RBS 6 Nations - England vs Ireland - 17/03/2012 - 17:00

[SelimNiai]

All thats missing there is the dogs wife's cat!!!

Whatever that pesky feline has told you is false

 

[big ginger 8]

All thats missing there is the dogs wife's cat!!!

Exactly. Big families are terrible for reliable information.

 

[lucky number 7]

**** sake you had me worried...Little boloix...

 

[big ginger 8]

**** sake you had me worried...Little boloix...

Yeah I myself was worried my brother and mum convinced me so thoroughly. I did say rumored for a reason.

 

[Peat]

Well firstly he clearly can't cover both sides of the scrum, as evidenced by yesterday. And it's daft that the international rules haven't been updated to 23 man squads.

What I'd have done is bring any other Prop with potential rather than Court who we all know is nothing more than a quick-fix. If we're gonna have a mediocre prop on the bench it may as well be one that someone deems to have potential.

He does a better job of it at domestic level than any Irish prop I can think of by quite some distance - and has had some good days at tighthead in a green jersey. Name a name - McAllister? I'd have genuinely been scared for his safety in that situation. You wouldn't have had a mediocre prop on the bench in that situation, you would have an absolutely terrible one. And I think that goes for most of them.

And of course its a stupid rule, but Kidney can't change it. I don't see how you can blame him for it. Finally - would Hagan have held the French shove to preserve the draw while on the loosehead side on that final scrum? I don't think so.

Hmm, seems a bit speculative. There could have been many things that caused Ferris to retract his arm and especially since he himself can't see whats occurin' in that ruck. Where was this first raised?

It was raised on the pitch directly after the ruck in question. Owens said that he didn't see anything, and told both captains that, but did confirm that he saw tooth marks on Ferris' finger and that if he had seen it there would have been a red card. I'd love to believe this is speculative, but if Owens says he saw tooth marks, the only possible other answer is that an Irish player went in for a bite and got the wrong player. That would be hilarious.

The video shown here is inconclusive. I wouldn't be surprised if there was an angle that did show. Bear in mind that the citing committee had in the past worked off "We know it happened, and we know from the footage there's only one player it might have been, and that is proof enough for us", so that's potentially all they need. The Irish players at the time seemed pretty certain it was Hartley in that they went straight for him in the ensuing melee, but in fairness that could simply be because of his reputation - that does seem unlikely though.

That is my take, although I'd stress its mainly from talking to other people after the event, as I couldn't hear what was being said clearly at the time.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Watching this first half again I've just noticed how self-defeating the choke tackle technique can. A couple of occasions, such as 30:30 into the video, you see Ireland halfheartedly trying to execute the choke hold but with only two or even one players. At 30 minutes and 30 seconds its tuilagi charging at ferris, and ferris is trying to keep him up. Tuilagi always had enough momentum to take him through and down, and all Ferris really manages to do is help Tuilagi make a bit more distance. At 34 minutes in, just before Farrell's third penalty you have barritt charging at the Irish midfield supported by Tuilagi. Again, they have strong forward leg drive and holding them up there seemed counter-productive; Sexton is trying to keep him up but is actually just letting him make more ground; Barritt is perfectly happy to be kept up a bit longer by sexton and co because he knows that he's not isolated, and has the momentum to hit the deck when he needs to.

Kidney has to take some responsibility for having it drilled into his players that they always have to be trying to execute this type of technique. Sometimes you just have to put the player down asap, and the trick is to know when to use the choke. Ireland are trying to do it too often in my opinion.

 

[Peat]

Even if you don't make the turnover, the choke gives the defence an extra second or two to reset, even if you concede an extra couple of yards. That's often worth it. But you've got a good point that we dealt with it well.

 

[McTallshort]

The big problem with the choke tackle is it takes more out of the tackling player than a simple leg tackle. Could be a reason Ireland faded so badly in the second half

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Also, what did Ireland really have to gain when the outcome was....a scrum?

I'm over the moon with how Farrell has grown into this team, but I do feel that in future games he needs to develop more confidence in his backs. When he won the last penalty, we had built phases across the field, from right to left, and Ireland were stretched. Farrell went for a cross-kick when in my opinion shipping it out could have seen us in on the other side of the pitch. It's not a big criticism at all, but in future games there is a lot more we can get from our backline, if they are given the chance.

 

[RetiredRog]

Nice St. Patrick's day present for the Irish.............a PROPER PASTING

 

[Feicarsinn]

Yeah I myself was worried my brother and mum convinced me so thoroughly. I did say rumored for a reason.

The Irish times has it down as a mild neck injury, should be fine for Leinster's end of season. Which reminds me, it's going to take bloody weeks to get all of this Ireland negativity out of our lads.

 

[bushytop]

I'm over the moon with how Farrell has grown into this team, but I do feel that in future games he needs to develop more confidence in his backs. When he won the last penalty, we had built phases across the field, from right to left, and Ireland were stretched. Farrell went for a cross-kick when in my opinion shipping it out could have seen us in on the other side of the pitch. It's not a big criticism at all, but in future games there is a lot more we can get from our backline, if they are given the chance.

Farrell looks very solid and would have to say he's the form 10 of the 6N.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Farrell looks very solid and would have to say he's the form 10 of the 6N.

Yep, agree. But when we play teams who are competing more up-front then we need our other areas to be equally up to scratch. You can only play whats in front of you, and in fairness all we had to do was kick scrum kick. In the future, this won't be the case. We'll need our powerful centres to bring the back three into the game more if we want results in our tour of South Africa.

 

[bushytop]

He looks to have good distribution too... put in some slick misspasses of either hand vs Wales.

Give him time to grow within the jersey.

 

[Prestwick]

Sorry guys a little late to the party but here is my response to the Irish pack's efforts on Saturday.

In short an error strewn game with two dependable fly halves, one pack whose reputation has been transformed and another whose reputation is now in the gutter. If I were Leinster or Munster I'd be calling out all the sports psychologists I could get my hands on right now :-/

 

[monkeypigeon]

Sorry guys a little late to the party but here is my response to the Irish pack's efforts on Saturday.

In short an error strewn game with two dependable fly halves, one pack whose reputation has been transformed and another whose reputation is now in the gutter. If I were Leinster or Munster I'd be calling out all the sports psychologists I could get my hands on right now :-/

Thank god Munster only had one player and Donnocha O'Callaghan in the pack (starting) [was that a bit harsh?].

Peat, I take your point about Court. Really just looking for any reason to be p-ed off at Kidney at this stage.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

One Outcome from this is that one of the Irish teams will now definitely win the Heineken cup...out of anger.

 

[big ginger 8]

Here's what will happen as usual. The players will go back to their provinces and probably win the H Cup possibly with an all Ireland. They'll all be on class form (except of course DO'C and D'arcy) and we'll be really excited coming up to the summer tour maybe even holding out a glimmer of hope that we can beat N.Z.. But then Kidneyism will take hold of them and we'll get smashed and the cycle will repeat.

 

[Peat]

Thank god Munster only had one player and Donnocha O'Callaghan in the pack (starting) [was that a bit harsh?].

Peat, I take your point about Court. Really just looking for any reason to be p-ed off at Kidney at this stage.

Ice cold dude. Cold. ****, Munster will be less scarred by this than Ulster. Hopefully it just makes Ferris mad...

Understandable. Having considered the matter, I have decided that if Kidney hadn't spent so long trying to develop Buckley/clinging onto Hayes for dear life and had given some of that game time to Court at tighthead/at all, he might be a bit better at it - Court has 29 caps but less than 800 minutes on the pitch, both Healy and Ross clocked that up this season alone! So there we go. Kidney is at least slightly culpable after all.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9154101/England-hooker-Dylan-Hartley-to-be-cited-for-biting-Ireland-flanker-Stephen-Ferris.html

Hartley cited. Will be interesting to see whether he gets a ban, or if the citing is just a token gesture as the complain was made.