[November Tests 2016 EOYT] England vs. Australia (3/12/2016)

[KeyboardWorrier]

From what I saw from both these sides, neither of them are going to worry the All Blacks.

 

[The Jones Boy]

From what I saw from both these sides, neither of them are going to worry the All Blacks.

I wouldn't say that at all.
The top four teams in the 6 Nations are all capable of beating anyone.

I'm arguing against the silly rolling of the ship in the swell kind of change of heart folks go through when they are losing or other teams are winning.
Not everyone on here suffers from it but more than half do.

 

[ALJ]

Part of the reason the English media is so over the top is because barely a calendar year ago they suffered the most humiliating departure in the history of world rugby.
They were thrown out of their own rugby world cup, in the pool stages, by Wales and Australia.
Yes... Wales.
(I thought England had every chance before the Aussie game but boy was I wrong as Aussie belted them out of Twickenham and out of their own world cup.)

Both of those teams beat England when it counted.
When there was silverware on the table and the pressure was at it's highest level.
England had home advantage, they had everything in their favour off the park to do the business on the park.
The English media was already talking about who the quarter final opponents would be while England were just starting their early pool games.
They were beaten by Wales... 25-28, ouch!!! ... and then hammered by Australia. An Australia who had a new coach who had been in the job for about half an hour.

Now there is plenty of argument about how England lost to to Wales rather than Wales beating them but the scoreboard doesn't lie and they certainly didn't get hard done by from the ref, they never do at Twickenham.
I remember being in Cardiff for the quarter final against France and everywhere the Welsh were cock-a-hoop about England being out of the world cup while Wales were still in.
Why would they feel that way?
Well it's not hard to understand when you see how much English media was ramming it down everyones throats that England were on track for a home RWC and would be striding out of the pool into the knock out phase, long before a whistle had been blown in earnest.
The endless trotting out of adverts and images of Woodward, the great Wilkinson, the legendary Richard Hill, even Guscott and Carling and Brian Moore. Eddie Butler being interviewed and the cretin Stephen Hughes.
...and you English wonder why the other home nations want to to see you go down????
Really??
You're media is nigh on unbearable and it all amounts to a whole lot of hype stuffed up the jumpers of the English players.
It may come to pass that England will never win a home RWC because of the effect the media has on its own players, over hyping them and compounding the pressure, and other countries using it as a motivating factor to defeat England, much as Wales did.
This is why England tend to do better away from home in RWC's.
(I thought England had every chance before the game but boy was I wrong as Aussie belted them out of Twickenham and out of their own world cup.)

So when you sink as low as it is possible to get as a tier one team on the biggest world stage, and you are humiliated in front of your own fans at the biggest rugby dedicated stadium in the world on live television... and boy were England humiliated by Australia in the pool game... as soon as you start to come good, your own media are going to pump up the volume.
Of course they are.
No media in rugby moreso than the English media.
A whole string of has been hack journo's and old rugby wannabes come out of the woodwork and start giving it the Rah Rah and the stripey blazer trumpet and the Hooray Henrys are all about shoulder to the wheel, Sweet Chariot and Jerusalem.
"God Save Your Rugby Team..."

What silverware have they won this Autumn against fatigued southern hemisphere teams who left their hearts out on the field after the RC.??
Now England can only play whats put in front of them; but these teams they play now have no silverware on offer, only pride.
As we can see from England's rise, like a Phoenix, from the ashes of the RWC 2015. Pride can reappear very quickly. Just a few wins and suddenly pride is almost fully restored, Silverware is another matter though.

England are now the world no.1 CHOKERS.

Yes they can win at home when they are fresh in the Autumn like flat track bullies in between Rugby World Cups (where it counts) but they can't win a raffle as soon as the pressure comes on. At least that has been the historical case up to now.

In this Autumn we see England as the least changed squad since the RWC 2015.
That is a huge advantage.
You don't hear about that in the media though do you? Hmmmm... ???
No.
The All Blacks lost over 800 caps since January this year and had to start again and rebuild a young team. Without the advantage through injury of having the impressive Sonny Bill Wiliams experience and gifts in the midfield.
All the other teams have lost players as well to varying degrees but England are almost completely unchanged in their player base.
Eddie Jones has had a huge head start this year.
But... he has used it effectively and beaten everything in front of them. You can't ask for more than that.
Would his England have beaten the All Blacks at Twickenham this Autumn?
I think they probably would have because the All Blacks looked a shadow of their RC form after the Dublin game. The Irish really took it out of the AB's at the end of a long hard grinding season. I think Twickenham would have been a bridge too far for the young AB's after the Dublin test.
More fool the ERU for not paying a little extra to get the world champions on a plate at Twickenham. A deal that would still see the vast part of the treasure still sitting in English hands but no, they're greedy so they miss out on the biggest prize of all available during an Autumn International.
The scalp of the world champions, the world no.1 rugby team, hanging over their Twickenham changing room door at the end of the AI.
If you don't wanna pay a bit more money to have the best team in world rugby come to your house then you have to content yourself with second rate fare.
A woeful Springbok team that is a shadow of it's former self. Performing at lower levels than we have seen them in decades, if ever. Battered by a bruising RC, a long super rugby competition and ruined by ineffective management and a racist quota.
A Wallaby team that you beat convincingly three nil away from home six months back. Whats to prove there? That the demons of the RWC are behind you?
Only a reverse result at the next RWC can eradicate that I'm afraid. You have to do it when it counts.
Argentina.
Three teams already wrecked by Super rugby and the RC, a genuinely tough international competition. Then what, oh thats right...
Fiji.
Wow.
Really?
Fiji??
Oh dear...

A month ago there was a cacophony of English fans ( and a smattering of others) on here shouting about how it was so boring that the All Blacks were unbeatable, it was dull that the All Blacks were winning so much... it was bad for world rugby etc yada yada yada
What a load of garbage.
Here we are a month later and lo and behold, the All Blacks are definitely beatable... by Ireland no less, by England, even by a resurgent France.
Of course they are.
It's 15 human beings against 15 human beings.
Everybody is beatable.
Look at England now nearly on top of the world after the AI's. Only a year after their Annus Horibilis.
Yes the English media are the most one eyed unpleasant bunch in world rugby media.
It doesn't change the fact that world rugby is wide open.
Foolishly England wouldn't pay the money, Ireland did because Ireland are courageous and they don't fear defeat, but England were too mean to shell out a bit more of their vast pile of loot and they didn't have the guts, the courage, or the self belief to go for the glory and pound on a tired young AB team who were ripe for the taking.
By 2018 when the teams finally meet i can't see England getting considerably better, sure they will improve but the AB's are going to continue to grow and improve their young talent and hone it sharp for Japan in 2019.
You missed a trick England because it's not the Scots who are tight with their money, it's the English.
Its always been the English.
So mean, so abstemious, so tight fisted they let the best and biggest prize go begging this Autumn and it won't be this easy again for at least 4 years following the next RWC.
For those lippy Poms who think you can do it... keep your money, we are skint but we will still show you good old fashioned Kiwi hospitality so come on down to lil old God's Zone and we'll give you a tour of the garden... of Eden.
We'll show you shakey quakey Canterbury and a cake tin at windy Wellington, we'll show you what a Rugby World Cup looks like ;-) you've probably forgotten it's been so long... and we'll send your hopes, dreams and glory home in a box.
Shattered.
Thats why Eddie won't let you visit.
All his careful hard work will be undone in a short ugly month where your ten man rugby will be ruthlessly torn apart by artistry and guile.
So come on down. Nobody is stopping you.
If you're big enough.
If you can do Aussie three times in your off season, why not us?
Bring it.

Have you ever heard the phrase "he protests too much"?

All we can do it beat what's in front of us. That we have done so while we have some improving still to do, I'm happy (as I suspect are most England fans).

 

[ncurd]

for the first time in a long time some of the NH teams are playing a style and quality of rugby that has made them real contenders for the number 2 & 3 in the world. I suspect Ireland are probably the best of the NH teams, despite a horrible injury list they have reallly looked the goods. England not far behind, and I think English fans could run a reasonable argument that they are better than Ireland - but for mine Ireland just edge them out.

England are on an unbeaten run of 14 games and current grand slam champions of the 6 nations, I also suggest you look at our injury list. Ireland's win over NZ was impressive have lost to them, us and were twice by SA. Ireland are an impressive unit but looking at the one game and I feel it might the phrase 'one swallow doesn't make a summer' comes to mind. Don't get me wrong I understand England have had their fair share of one off impressive games over the past 13 years and false dawns.

Anyway point being Ireland have to take the no.1 status in the NH from us their record isn't impressive enough to really say they are ahead of us. I am immensely looking forward to the last weekend of the 6 nations with hopefully a grand slam on the line (on current form you'd expect it to be the case).

 

[spartan32]

Well that was a interesting game. Australia only looked convincing while England were all at sea in the first half. The second they had a talking too at half time England dominated the game and by the end Australia looked like us at the beginning. Someone mentioned that the performance was not good enough to beat NZ, and I have to agree. But still, given all the replacements, there was some very encouraging stuff.

Hughes has some storming runs and I think could well peg down a bench spot to cover Billy

Youngs is just getting better and better. So mature in his decision making and very good in his execution.

May keeping it up and has a bright future on current trajectory.

JJ quality as usual, certain lions spot awaits.

Ford had a couple of shockers, and needs to get some kicking practice in, but continues to pull the strings masterfully and will no doubt become world class.

Faz as above.

Really impressed with all the pack in the end and the impact subs were all pretty damn good. Just put us into another gear and left the Aussies for dust in the last 20 or so.

All in all really encouraging stuff, and with a full compliment England will make anyone think twice.

Lastly. That yellow was never a yellow. Should have been a pen only and slightly marred the game, although but that pint we were out of sight so hardly matters.

And finally I think we had a serious touch of the green in the first 25 that may have saved us ultimately, but that's how the game goes sometimes, and usually the team in the ascendency gets the benefit of the doubt. I'll call it the All Black effect.

 

[ALJ]

**** them then I say, I'm tired of this "hate England at all costs" attitude prevelant among the fans of other rugby nations. It is basically accepted racism.

It gets a bit wearing doesn't it but that seems to be the rub as an England fan.

For example, all I've heard in the last few weeks is how we won a meaningless Grand Slam.
Can you imagine if we said that of one of the the other nations? Yet we just have to take it on the chin and get on with it.

 

[McTallshort]

It gets a bit wearing doesn't it but that seems to be the rub as an England fan.

For example, all I've heard in the last few weeks is how we won a meaningless Grand Slam.
Can you imagine if we said that of one of the the other nations? Yet we just have to take it on the chin and get on with it.

I love it. Seeing the likes of Jones boy ranting endlessly about how much everyone hates us is brilliant. They obsess about us and hate the fact we are largely indifferent to them. They are the ones with the problem not us. No matter what we do they will always find a reason to hate so dont get upset about: reviel in it!

 

[TommiG88]

Bejeezus, where did they get this guy...

You are fresh.
You have home advantage.
Wingers mean squat, you're best winger, Johnny May was playing. Nowell is alright but the rest are nothing to write home about, you missed nothing and in the forwards, England have more depth than anyone else in the world. You have a conveyer belt of top quality forwards from the biggest player catchment in the world, by far, stop your garbage son we're not buying it.
Face the facts, you put out virtually full strength teams every game at home in front of your own crowd when you are fresh in the Autumn.
Your key players were not injured, not like the Irish boys.
You can't talk about losing players when they are filthy, thats indiscipline, look to your own yard for excuses.
All the cards are in your hands at this time of the year against fatigued southern hemisphere opponents.

:lol: you're obviously special. I didn't mention Daly you half wit.

 

[RoosTah]

RoosTahs- have you been following the NRC? Any decent players coming through?

TBH the NRC is hard to judge because the scoring system and rules have been altered to encourage attacking play. It's enjoyable to watch as a result, but there's a lot of games that are high scoring to the point you see plenty of games with scores like 47-52. As a result it's almost like a long form of 7s at times (although to be fair the finals have tended to be tighter affairs). This also means that whilst you see the odd impressive outside back (Karevi came through it) our weaknesses upfront aren't being addressed, as it's a competition designed to generate public interest as much as it is to create a ne avenue for promising players. The problem though is that it'll always just be seen as a feeder comp for super and so it's got no viewership on Fox (numbers so low they often don't even register in ratings). I'm wonder what it's future is now as they cut a couple teams this year and it feels like a competition that doesn't know what it's trying to achieve... the clubs in the local suburban comps of Sydney and Brisbane hate it and often won't cooperate with player releases etc too.

 

[Which Tyler]

Jesus Christ that journo is a ****.
Could his head be any more up his own arse if he tried?

It's Chris Rattue - for those who haven't come across him before, think of Stephen Jones, without the class or insight

 

[KeyboardWorrier]

I wouldn't say that at all.
The top four teams in the 6 Nations are all capable of beating anyone.

I'm arguing against the silly rolling of the ship in the swell kind of change of heart folks go through when they are losing or other teams are winning.
Not everyone on here suffers from it but more than half do.

Nah. Barrett alone could beat these teams. No kidding.

 

[RoosTah]

It's Chris Rattue - for those who haven't come across him before, think of Stephen Jones, without the class or insight

So basically just Stephen Jones lol

 

[Bada-Bing!]

TBH the NRC is hard to judge because the scoring system and rules have been altered to encourage attacking play. It's enjoyable to watch as a result, but there's a lot of games that are high scoring to the point you see plenty of games with scores like 47-52. As a result it's almost like a long form of 7s at times (although to be fair the finals have tended to be tighter affairs). This also means that whilst you see the odd impressive outside back (Karevi came through it) our weaknesses upfront aren't being addressed, as it's a competition designed to generate public interest as much as it is to create a ne avenue for promising players. The problem though is that it'll always just be seen as a feeder comp for super and so it's got no viewership on Fox (numbers so low they often don't even register in ratings). I'm wonder what it's future is now as they cut a couple teams this year and it feels like a competition that doesn't know what it's trying to achieve... the clubs in the local suburban comps of Sydney and Brisbane hate it and often won't cooperate with player releases etc too.

Doesn't sound too promising ATM, but still it's only started going again hasn't it after the last ARU Chief Executive previously put an axe to it? That's put the Australian Super Rugby teams and then the Wallabies back because the layer below Super rugby hasn't been there like ITM Cup in NZ.

Wallabies front five talent has always been a problem, apart from RWC when Ladesma transformed the Wallaby scrum, the only problem is teams then analyse how to counter the work he's done. Sio looks like he has been found out after being one of the better looseheads last year.

 

[RoosTah]

Doesn't sound too promising ATM, but still it's only started going again hasn't it after the last ARU Chief Executive previously put an axe to it? That's put the Australian Super Rugby teams and then the Wallabies back because the layer below Super rugby hasn't been there like ITM Cup in NZ.

Wallabies front five talent has always been a problem, apart from RWC when Ladesma transformed the Wallaby scrum, the only problem is teams then analyse how to counter the work he's done. Sio looks like he has been found out after being one of the better looseheads last year.

The competition is a few years in now and I think it's the right idea, but the decision to go with the law variations and the geographical spread of the teams seems a bit questionable. It's predecessor - the ARC - was axed by the prior ARU head because it was pretty well completely ARU funded and was haemorrhaging money, but this is more of a mixed funding model and so is more sustainable over the longer term. But again, it's hard to see how it'll plug our gaps in the tight five long term and so part of me thinks that if we're going to have a semi-pro comp like the NRC that no one watches we ought to gear it toward more set-piece play

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

England are on an unbeaten run of 14 games and current grand slam champions of the 6 nations, I also suggest you look at our injury list. Ireland's win over NZ was impressive have lost to them, us and were twice by SA. Ireland are an impressive unit but looking at the one game and I feel it might the phrase 'one swallow doesn't make a summer' comes to mind. Don't get me wrong I understand England have had their fair share of one off impressive games over the past 13 years and false dawns.

Anyway point being Ireland have to take the no.1 status in the NH from us their record isn't impressive enough to really say they are ahead of us. I am immensely looking forward to the last weekend of the 6 nations with hopefully a grand slam on the line (on current form you'd expect it to be the case).

Agreed, you lads are the team to beat in the NH. Ireland had a very unstable year and can't yet cope with an injury to Henshaw, I think England would be tge same without Farrell though. Next year I hope to take our spot as Europe's best back and I think Schmidt has enough about him to do so, he'll win his slam!

It gets a bit wearing doesn't it but that seems to be the rub as an England fan.

For example, all I've heard in the last few weeks is how we won a meaningless Grand Slam.
Can you imagine if we said that of one of the the other nations? Yet we just have to take it on the chin and get on with it.

Ragerancher has an awful victim complex and fabricates most of it here to be honest. We're reasonable guys on these boards for the most part and accept England are the standard to reach in the North currently.

 

[galumay]

England are on an unbeaten run of 14 games and current grand slam champions of the 6 nations, I also suggest you look at our injury list. Ireland's win over NZ was impressive have lost to them, us and were twice by SA. Ireland are an impressive unit but looking at the one game and I feel it might the phrase 'one swallow doesn't make a summer' comes to mind. Don't get me wrong I understand England have had their fair share of one off impressive games over the past 13 years and false dawns.

Anyway point being Ireland have to take the no.1 status in the NH from us their record isn't impressive enough to really say they are ahead of us. I am immensely looking forward to the last weekend of the 6 nations with hopefully a grand slam on the line (on current form you'd expect it to be the case).

Fair enough, its certainly an arguable opinion. You are correct, the 6 Nations will tell the story and will definitely have me pressing the record button this season!

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Part of the reason the English media is so over the top is because barely a calendar year ago they suffered the most humiliating departure in the history of world rugby.
They were thrown out of their own rugby world cup, in the pool stages, by Wales and Australia.
Yes... Wales.
(I thought England had every chance before the Aussie game but boy was I wrong as Aussie belted them out of Twickenham and out of their own world cup.)

Both of those teams beat England when it counted.
When there was silverware on the table and the pressure was at it's highest level.
England had home advantage, they had everything in their favour off the park to do the business on the park.
The English media was already talking about who the quarter final opponents would be while England were just starting their early pool games.
They were beaten by Wales... 25-28, ouch!!! ... and then hammered by Australia. An Australia who had a new coach who had been in the job for about half an hour.

Now there is plenty of argument about how England lost to to Wales rather than Wales beating them but the scoreboard doesn't lie and they certainly didn't get hard done by from the ref, they never do at Twickenham.
I remember being in Cardiff for the quarter final against France and everywhere the Welsh were cock-a-hoop about England being out of the world cup while Wales were still in.
Why would they feel that way?
Well it's not hard to understand when you see how much English media was ramming it down everyones throats that England were on track for a home RWC and would be striding out of the pool into the knock out phase, long before a whistle had been blown in earnest.
The endless trotting out of adverts and images of Woodward, the great Wilkinson, the legendary Richard Hill, even Guscott and Carling and Brian Moore. Eddie Butler being interviewed and the cretin Stephen Hughes.
...and you English wonder why the other home nations want to to see you go down????
Really??
You're media is nigh on unbearable and it all amounts to a whole lot of hype stuffed up the jumpers of the English players.
It may come to pass that England will never win a home RWC because of the effect the media has on its own players, over hyping them and compounding the pressure, and other countries using it as a motivating factor to defeat England, much as Wales did.
This is why England tend to do better away from home in RWC's.
(I thought England had every chance before the game but boy was I wrong as Aussie belted them out of Twickenham and out of their own world cup.)

So when you sink as low as it is possible to get as a tier one team on the biggest world stage, and you are humiliated in front of your own fans at the biggest rugby dedicated stadium in the world on live television... and boy were England humiliated by Australia in the pool game... as soon as you start to come good, your own media are going to pump up the volume.
Of course they are.
No media in rugby moreso than the English media.
A whole string of has been hack journo's and old rugby wannabes come out of the woodwork and start giving it the Rah Rah and the stripey blazer trumpet and the Hooray Henrys are all about shoulder to the wheel, Sweet Chariot and Jerusalem.
"God Save Your Rugby Team..."

What silverware have they won this Autumn against fatigued southern hemisphere teams who left their hearts out on the field after the RC.??
Now England can only play whats put in front of them; but these teams they play now have no silverware on offer, only pride.
As we can see from England's rise, like a Phoenix, from the ashes of the RWC 2015. Pride can reappear very quickly. Just a few wins and suddenly pride is almost fully restored, Silverware is another matter though.

England are now the world no.1 CHOKERS.

Yes they can win at home when they are fresh in the Autumn like flat track bullies in between Rugby World Cups (where it counts) but they can't win a raffle as soon as the pressure comes on. At least that has been the historical case up to now.

In this Autumn we see England as the least changed squad since the RWC 2015.
That is a huge advantage.
You don't hear about that in the media though do you? Hmmmm... ???
No.
The All Blacks lost over 800 caps since January this year and had to start again and rebuild a young team. Without the advantage through injury of having the impressive Sonny Bill Wiliams experience and gifts in the midfield.
All the other teams have lost players as well to varying degrees but England are almost completely unchanged in their player base.
Eddie Jones has had a huge head start this year.
But... he has used it effectively and beaten everything in front of them. You can't ask for more than that.
Would his England have beaten the All Blacks at Twickenham this Autumn?
I think they probably would have because the All Blacks looked a shadow of their RC form after the Dublin game. The Irish really took it out of the AB's at the end of a long hard grinding season. I think Twickenham would have been a bridge too far for the young AB's after the Dublin test.
More fool the ERU for not paying a little extra to get the world champions on a plate at Twickenham. A deal that would still see the vast part of the treasure still sitting in English hands but no, they're greedy so they miss out on the biggest prize of all available during an Autumn International.
The scalp of the world champions, the world no.1 rugby team, hanging over their Twickenham changing room door at the end of the AI.
If you don't wanna pay a bit more money to have the best team in world rugby come to your house then you have to content yourself with second rate fare.
A woeful Springbok team that is a shadow of it's former self. Performing at lower levels than we have seen them in decades, if ever. Battered by a bruising RC, a long super rugby competition and ruined by ineffective management and a racist quota.
A Wallaby team that you beat convincingly three nil away from home six months back. Whats to prove there? That the demons of the RWC are behind you?
Only a reverse result at the next RWC can eradicate that I'm afraid. You have to do it when it counts.
Argentina.
Three teams already wrecked by Super rugby and the RC, a genuinely tough international competition. Then what, oh thats right...
Fiji.
Wow.
Really?
Fiji??
Oh dear...

A month ago there was a cacophony of English fans ( and a smattering of others) on here shouting about how it was so boring that the All Blacks were unbeatable, it was dull that the All Blacks were winning so much... it was bad for world rugby etc yada yada yada
What a load of garbage.
Here we are a month later and lo and behold, the All Blacks are definitely beatable... by Ireland no less, by England, even by a resurgent France.
Of course they are.
It's 15 human beings against 15 human beings.
Everybody is beatable.
Look at England now nearly on top of the world after the AI's. Only a year after their Annus Horibilis.
Yes the English media are the most one eyed unpleasant bunch in world rugby media.
It doesn't change the fact that world rugby is wide open.
Foolishly England wouldn't pay the money, Ireland did because Ireland are courageous and they don't fear defeat, but England were too mean to shell out a bit more of their vast pile of loot and they didn't have the guts, the courage, or the self belief to go for the glory and pound on a tired young AB team who were ripe for the taking.
By 2018 when the teams finally meet i can't see England getting considerably better, sure they will improve but the AB's are going to continue to grow and improve their young talent and hone it sharp for Japan in 2019.
You missed a trick England because it's not the Scots who are tight with their money, it's the English.
Its always been the English.
So mean, so abstemious, so tight fisted they let the best and biggest prize go begging this Autumn and it won't be this easy again for at least 4 years following the next RWC.
For those lippy Poms who think you can do it... keep your money, we are skint but we will still show you good old fashioned Kiwi hospitality so come on down to lil old God's Zone and we'll give you a tour of the garden... of Eden.
We'll show you shakey quakey Canterbury and a cake tin at windy Wellington, we'll show you what a Rugby World Cup looks like ;-) you've probably forgotten it's been so long... and we'll send your hopes, dreams and glory home in a box.
Shattered.
Thats why Eddie won't let you visit.
All his careful hard work will be undone in a short ugly month where your ten man rugby will be ruthlessly torn apart by artistry and guile.
So come on down. Nobody is stopping you.
If you're big enough.
If you can do Aussie three times in your off season, why not us?
Bring it.

TL: DR

...I later did read and regretted it.

 

[jomjom]

Can anyone please explain to me what the point of this fixture was? Oz, like NZ last week, looked knackered. When was the last time any of these guys had a break from playing rugby? Oz got their comeuppance with a 3-0 whitewash at home this year. I really just can't fathom why there had to be one extra AI in December between Aus and England. 5 times in one year...

That said it baffles me why it's only now (excl. 2003 of course) that England are regaining their status as among the best. They've always been in the top 5 arguably but with the amount of money and talented players at their disposal it baffles me how they've only won 1 world cup. England should be the best team in the world, or at the very least regularly contend with NZ for the no 1 spot. I think in the 6N Ireland will give them a good run for their money and will have every chance of beating them, but if England keep improving the way they do now - top class coaching combined with the most resources and flow of talented players - then a few years down the line they should almost always win the 6N and beat SH teams. There's no reason why they shouldn't. The only thing stopping them is adequate coaching which Jones has now remedied. Let's see for how long they can keep it up.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

The outstanding highlight of the match is Hooper riding along on the maul/Mako with a look of sheer terror on his face. Poor guy

 

[j'nuh]

Bejeezus, where did they get this guy...

You are fresh.
You have home advantage.
Wingers mean squat, you're best winger, Johnny May was playing. Nowell is alright but the rest are nothing to write home about, you missed nothing and in the forwards, England have more depth than anyone else in the world. You have a conveyer belt of top quality forwards from the biggest player catchment in the world, by far, stop your garbage son we're not buying it.
Face the facts, you put out virtually full strength teams every game at home in front of your own crowd when you are fresh in the Autumn.
Your key players were not injured, not like the Irish boys.
You can't talk about losing players when they are filthy, thats indiscipline, look to your own yard for excuses.
All the cards are in your hands at this time of the year against fatigued southern hemisphere opponents.

Key players not injured? I must have missed seeing our (IMO) three best players: Itoje, Launchbury and Billy Vunipola. As well as first team starters in Haskell, Watson and Tuilagi.

Anyway we did already beat Australia 3-0 when they had home advantage and when they were fresh and our players were at the end of their (much longer) season. So basically you're talking drivel.