New Zealand vs England (06/07/24)

[Kiwiwomble]

i think its mainly to because hes 6 years past him prime and hasnt been playing in NZ so there was some chat about him swooping straight back into the AB's being a bit **** on those that have hing around to earn their spot

 

[Umaga's Witness]

This is a big game for perofeta for sure. It seems I'm one of the few in NZ that rate him, but even I am concerned about him dealing with the pressure in this game, he'll be peppered with high balls no doubt.

Also wouldn't mind seeing narawa at 15 at some point.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I only see Perofeta when hes playing Otago/Highlanders...but generally ive thought he looks promising....i think Love was probably a stronger choice at 15 and plummer at 10 though but that would mean dropping BB and that wasn't going to happen

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

Perofeta starting over BB the closes thing to a surprise, more or less full strength


View attachment 20637

Not that different to the Fozzie allblacks team. Maybe Razor is bringing evolution not revolution.

 

[esoj]

i think its mainly to because hes 6 years past him prime and hasnt been playing in NZ so there was some chat about him swooping straight back into the AB's being a bit **** on those that have hing around to earn their spot

I think it's because there are a lot of anti-auckland/blues fans out there. Ardie Savea did the same thing as BB and people were thinking Ardie should be captain of the abs.
BB while older and maybe not quite as quick as he used to be does have a lot of experience which can be useful to have in a not so experienced backline with guys like perofeta in the team.

Dmac I would say is not fully proven at the international level just yet especially running the team from the start at 10 which is one reason why he has been in and out of the side when he has been in all blacks squad. This is also why I think razor picked BB on the bench in case Dmac has an off game he can bring BB on and be assured 9/10 he can bring the team home.

I saw in an article today one reason Razor said he picked Perofeta was because he was good under the high ball so if england do try that could be to their downfall. Perofeta was pretty good in super rugby under the high ball I thought and his ability to beat the first man often setup some good counter attacks for the blues. There are questions marks if he does always pass at the right time but lots of player have been guilty of that in the past and I'm sure with the coaching team the All Blacks have he will learn quite quickly when he should pass or back himself to take the defense on.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I think it's because there are a lot of anti-auckland/blues fans out there. Ardie Savea did the same thing as BB and people were thinking Ardie should be captain of the abs.
BB while older and maybe not quite as quick as he used to be does have a lot of experience which can be useful to have in a not so experienced backline with guys like perofeta in the team.

Dmac I would say is not fully proven at the international level just yet especially running the team from the start at 10 which is one reason why he has been in and out of the side when he has been in all blacks squad. This is also why I think razor picked BB on the bench in case Dmac has an off game he can bring BB on and be assured 9/10 he can bring the team home.

I saw in an article today one reason Razor said he picked Perofeta was because he was good under the high ball so if england do try that could be to their downfall. Perofeta was pretty good in super rugby under the high ball I thought and his ability to beat the first man often setup some good counter attacks for the blues. There are questions marks if he does always pass at the right time but lots of player have been guilty of that in the past and I'm sure with the coaching team the All Blacks have he will learn quite quickly when he should pass or back himself to take the defense on.

there was more than one suggestion BB shouldnt have even gone to the RWC last year, still moments of brilliance no doubt.....but not as reliable with some basics like kicking for territory, some basic game management for a play maker

Perofeta being good under the high ball is a bit self fore-filling as any opposition is going to test a newish fullback with taking some kicks

Not that different to the Fozzie allblacks team. Maybe Razor is bringing evolution not revolution.

yeah, seeing a bit of acceptance that given the short lead time he's gone pretty conservative re selections (i might have liked to see 6. Finau 7. Savea 8. Sititi)...hoping we at least see some improvements in gameplan....ie....having a gameplan other that "do something special"

 

[BPM]

I'm sure Borthwick will want to test Perofeta a bit, but with Smith at 10 and Furbank at 15, our gameplan isn't likely to be (or definitely shouldn't be) based around the same type of kick chase as if we'd had Farrell and Steward in those roles.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I only see Perofeta when hes playing Otago/Highlanders...but generally ive thought he looks promising....i think Love was probably a stronger choice at 15 and plummer at 10 though but that would mean dropping BB and that wasn't going to happen

Everyone raving about love. Ive been a fan for a while but doesn't mean I think he's ready. truth is he made a lot of mistakes in the second half of the season that people forgave or were basically blind to because they'd already made their mind up he was great. Certainly I would expect he will get some game time this year though.

@esoj I don't think perofeta needs to learn when to pass, as such. I agree he has made some wrong decisions but I see that more as a composure in the moment sort of thing, but yes crusaders have always been good at executing under pressure so hopefully some of these crusaders coaches can help him out there. Usually he is pretty composed actually and has good vision, I just think he had some issues coming back from injuries and dealing with greater expectations and opportunities this year. He is pretty good under the high ball like you say and his positional play is good in terms of defending kicks.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I'm sure Borthwick will want to test Perofeta a bit, but with Smith at 10 and Furbank at 15, our gameplan isn't likely to be (or definitely shouldn't be) based around the same as if we'd had Farrell and Steward in those roles.

Sure but it's not just quantity, the quality of the kick and kick chase game in Europe/South Africa is a level above super rugby and we tend to have a lot of outside backs picked for X factor in super rugby, so it's important for us to find our better players under the high ball when it comes to tests

And even when we do that sometimes they can't handle test level high ball kick and chases

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Not that different to the Fozzie allblacks team. Maybe Razor is bringing evolution not revolution.

It was never going to be different. It's still important to razors bosses that we win as many tests as possible, not just the World Cup. That means using experienced players/combos and having continuity. Even if razor wouldn't have given the experience to those players had he been coaching instead of fozzie, he's still going to pick them now they are experienced. Let's also not forget it was never fozzie on his own and nor will it be razor selecting players, but you can expect the new group of selectors to bring in new players bit by bit. Just like foster would have wanted to do, but couldn't, razor will want to bring new players in when the team has been winning

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Tell us about fin baxter. Does he scrum though?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Tell us about fin baxter. Does he scrum though?

Yeah, he's very very promising - think he overtook Marler at club level by the end of this season

Imo he's the most promising all round loosehead we've had since Corbisiero

It's his debut, so I'm not expecting the world from him, but he's looked the real deal at Prem and Euro level

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Yeah, he's very very promising - think he overtook Marler at club level by the end of this season

Imo he's the most promising all round loosehead we've had since Corbisiero

It's his debut, so I'm not expecting the world from him, but he's looked the real deal at Prem and Euro level

Will be an interesting battle against young fletcher newell who is a very strong scrummager, minus a couple of games where he got owned last year coming back from injury against the boks and france. I'm hoping he has learnt his lessons and is in better shape now

 

[BPM]

Baxter is a good scrummager who more than held his own against Tameifuna and Aldegheri in the Champions Cup so the prospect of facing Newell (or Lomax) shouldn't be overly daunting.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Tell us about fin baxter.

Going to be quite something when he starts shaving.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Looking forward to this one. Good to see both at full strength. Just got to wake up in time.

 

[West Country Wail]

This is set up so well with stories on both sides. There is a rather interesting similarity between the opposing 10s who seem to have the same 'international class' question mark hanging over them after everyone acknowledges their obvious flair. Here we go!

 

[Larksea]

I think the medium/long plan is that Jordan will come back and go into 15 and he could potentially be available after the Fiji game.
And DMac and Beauden are seen as our best 10's and they want them to focus on 10.
I think we have seen enough consistant form from Perofeta for long enough to believe he will do well at 15.

I think it's a really strong side, I'd have liked to see Narawa. I think he's the form winger in NZ but you can't say Reece and Talea don't deserve a shot.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

yeah, Jordan comes straight back in, same with Roigard. BB was seen training at 10 during the week so yeah, i think your right....as much as i personally would move on and start developing the next generation

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Going to be quite something when he starts shaving.

Look bigger?