June Internationals: Japan v Wales, Second Test (15/06/13)

[Thingimubob]

Honestly there's no point caring about rankings anymore, already in the 3rd band for the RWC and stuck in a pool of death, so whatever. Ah if only we had Beck, Eli Wales, Fussell (why on earth did he Howells go ahead of him), Owens, Charteris, Shingler...
Can we play them with our 1st XV soon then? they've beaten our 3rd XV, seems only fair they go up a level now!

 

[Bluemoon]

Honestly there's no point caring about rankings anymore, already in the 3rd band for the RWC and stuck in a pool of death, so whatever. Ah if only we had Beck, Walker, Fussell, Owens, Charteris, Shingler...
Can we play them with our 1st XV soon then? they've beaten our 3rd XV, seems only fair they go up a level now!

Yeah I know, its just I always feel it is difficult enough to get up those rankings and easy to go down them.

Yeah I agree with the comments, great win for Japan, but do remember a lot of those players are earning their first jerseys or are barely in the Wales squad. Some are struggling to get form at their regions, let alone being called up for Wales. As I've said, I feel McBryde has put too much pressure on these youngsters and it showed.

Harry Robinson is looking increasingly good. If only Cardiff Blues had a decent centre partnership this year we might have seen more of him.

 

[Ospreylian]

Just worked out the rankings. Wales (5th) and France (6th) swap places. Wales now on 81.36. Japan stay 15th but aren't far behind Fiji now.

 

[Thingimubob]

Yeah I know, its just I always feel it is difficult enough to get up those rankings and easy to go down them.

Yeah I agree with the comments, great win for Japan, but do remember a lot of those players are earning their first jerseys or are barely in the Wales squad. Some are struggling to get form at their regions, let alone being called up for Wales. As I've said, I feel McBryde has put too much pressure on these youngsters and it showed.

Harry Robinson is looking increasingly good. If only Cardiff Blues had a decent centre partnership this year we might have seen more of him.

Sums it up. Would have felt much better having an experienced head like Fussell in there, even though he'd be earning his first caps, he's played a lot top level rugby.

Also, isn't it the All Blacks that'll probably get the TRF Shield next? Obviously this was all a massive All Blacks conspiracy to get the most coveted trophy around back... sneaky buggers

 

[Ospreylian]

Sums it up. Would have felt much better having an experienced head like Fussell in there, even though he'd be earning his first caps, he's played a lot top level rugby.

Yeah I cannot understand why Fussell still hasn't been given a cap. He's been 2nd best to Halfpenny all season.

Centre partnership of Spratt and O Williams was absolutely superb, awesome, sensational! Screw Roberts and BOD, get these two on the plane to Australia NOW

 

[Draggs]

Owen played for like five minutes, and gained decent ground. Patchell was poor Spratt worse.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Problem comes when Patchell is new to the international scene and is a 10 not a 12. Dafydd Howells is a guy who has shown he's still has much to learn about the game. I think Wales need not to panic, over 24 players unavailable and Wales played against a very good and organised Japanese side, who to be honest have received little credit at times for playing so very well.

Also TRF Shield heads to Japan.

 

[Draggs]

We had no centre cover whatsoever. None.
Stupid selections, amateur looking on the whole.

Maybe we can at least get rid of McBryde?

 

[Big Ewis]

...really ? Not even close...well, I suppose it's final. Wales have no depth unfortunately.

 

[William18]

Problem comes when Patchell is new to the international scene and is a 10 not a 12. Dafydd Howells is a guy who has shown he's still has much to learn about the game. I think Wales need not to panic, over 24 players unavailable and Wales played against a very good and organised Japanese side, who to be honest have received little credit at times for playing so very well.

Also TRF Shield heads to Japan.

Is the TRF Shield the same as the Raeburn Shield?

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Is the TRF Shield the same as the Raeburn Shield?

No because the TRF Shield ... is the TRF Shield!

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Great result for Japan. Wales can't really read anything into this loss though. The bad news is HOW THE HELL IS SA GOING TO TAKE THE TRF SHIELD NOW!!

 

[psychic duck]

Great result for Japan. Wales can't really read anything into this loss though. The bad news is HOW THE HELL IS SA GOING TO TAKE THE TRF SHIELD NOW!!

Canada and Japan playoff for the Raeburn Shield on Wednesday.

Japan are scheduled to play New Zealand and Scotland in November, but if Canada or USA beat Japan then neither is set to play a 6 Nations or Rugby Championship side in November so a lot of new nations could get the chance to get their name on the trophy. Only Romania (1984) and Samoa (1999) have held it before from outside the two main tournaments, in fact Italy has never won it.

http://raeburnshield.com/page5.php

Poor job from the coaches to be arrogant in selecting this crap Wales side. Got what they deserved really for picking these players when there was better available.

At least Japan have gained a bit more respect now from Wales and showed how much nonsense the theory that the U20 team was better than them.

 

[dullonien]

Fully deserved win for Japan, congratulations.

I thought Japan were more physical, especially in their defence. Their attack also had much more purpose, and they took their chances well.

As for Wales, they actually played quite well in that first half, but they failed to convert any of the 3-4 genuine chances they created. In the second half, the forwards started lagging and making mistakes. The backs were mostly poor throughout I thought.

Going through the team looking at the combinations:

Front row: Gill and Phillips were quite poor. Gill in particular got caught out in defence on a couple of crucial occasions. I thought Scott Andrews had a strong game. Mitchell really struggled in the scrum when he came on, which surprised me.

Second row: after the criticisms of Lou Reed, he was integral to Wales' strong start, winning plenty of lineout ball and getting stuck in in the tight. I thought Bradley Davies needed to show more considering he was the only experienced forward and captain.

Backrow: I was really looking forward to seeing King in a Welsh jersey, but he's been almost anonymous in both tests. Navidi wasn't the magic fix I hoped, but I thought he was the best Welsh backrower, getting stuck in and making plenty of tackles. Pretorius was poor, made numerous mistakes in both attack and defence. Some of his fringe defence was very poor, falling off tackles all over the place.

Halfback pairing: Lloyd Williams distributed well, but his kicking was atrocious. Biggar did plenty well, but again the kicking game really didn't work.

Centres: Spratt was pretty anonymous in attack. He hasn't demonstrated this season that he's of Pro12 quality let alone international. Owen Williams made a few strong tackles before being forced off. Patchell had to play out of position, and it showed, really struggled. Made a few wrong decisions I thought with overlaps outside. Showed a couple of nice touches, but that's about it.

Back-three: Robinson was the best Welsh player, always looked dangerous. Forced that pass to Patchell after making the clean creak. Prydie was very ordinary I thought. Liam Williams didn't have the impact he had last week, a few more errors creeping into his game.

I'm wondering if McBryde is regretting not taking Paul James, Ryan Jones, James Hook, Gavin Henson and Lee Byrne on tour with him. All of them would have added some much needed experience, not to mention a little creativity into the backline.

 

[KAPman]

Despite it being a weakened welsh side, it shows the progress that japan have made and are continously making in the rugby world stage. I thought they were unlucky last week and fully deserved the win this week. By the time 2019 comes around, when they host the world cup, i think they will be a force to be reckoned with!

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Seeing another tier 2 side beat a team from tier 1 is a great result for rugby (after Samoa toppled Scotland last week). Taking my Irish hat off for a second, it'd be great to see Canada turn over Ireland too.

 

[nickdnz]

Not suprised with the win - read that most of Japan's scientific research involves beating Wales.

If that blinder of a joke doesn't get me a nomination for funniest poster, I don't know what will.

 

[I Ludicrous]

Honestly there's no point caring about rankings anymore, already in the 3rd band for the RWC and stuck in a pool of death, so whatever. Ah if only we had Beck, Eli Wales, Fussell (why on earth did he Howells go ahead of him), Owens, Charteris, Shingler...
Can we play them with our 1st XV soon then? they've beaten our 3rd XV, seems only fair they go up a level now!

If this is your 3rd team, where are the 2nd team playing ?

 

[dullonien]

If this is your 3rd team, where are the 2nd team playing ?

Looking rationally, it was a decidedly 3rd string side. We still lack the depth once we are missing a lot of players, probably highlighting the big problem of only having 4 professional sides. England could probably put out a 5th choice side which would be no worse than the Welsh side today due to the amount of clubs they have to pick from.

Going through the Welsh side, this is where I'd place them in the pecking order with everyone fit:

Rhys Gill: 3rd choice. Gethin Jenkins (Lions) and Paul James (rested) are ahead of him.
Emyr Phillips: 4th choice. Hibbard (Lions), Ken Owens (injured) and Matthew Rees (not selected) would be ahead of him.
Scott Andrews: 3rd choice. Adam Jones (Lions) and Craig Mitchell ahead of him, although Mitchell was worse today when he came on.
Bradley Davies: 2nd/3rd choice behind Alun-Wyn Jones (Lions) and Luke Charteris (injured).
Lou Reed: 3rd choice. I'd have him behind Ian Evans (Lions), Andrew Coombs, Olly Kohn and Lloyd Peers, but in reality (to the selectors) he's only behind Evans and Coombs.
James King: 5th choice. Dan Lydiate (Lions), Ryan Jones (rested), Sam Warburton (Lions), Aaron Shingler (injured) would all be ahead of him, possibly Turnbull as well. I was expecting much more from him though.
Josh Navidi: 3rd choice behind Warburton (Lions) and Tipuric (Lions). I'd guess that a couple of the blindsides would switch before Navidi was used in a big match as well, such as Lydiate, Shingler, Faletau or Turnbull. I still think he can develop though.
Andries Pretorius: 3rd choice? Faletau (Lions) and Ryan Jones (rested) would be ahead of him. I'd also have Delve (overlooked).

Lloyd Williams: 2nd choice. Only Phillips (Lions) ahead of him. Won't stay that way unless he improves.
Dan Biggar: 1st choice.
Harry Robinson: 4th choice? North (Lions) is certainly ahead of him, whilst they would also play Liam Williams out of position ahead of him. Eli Walker (injured) would also be a better option.
Jonathan Spratt: 6th choice? Jamie Roberts (Lions), Ashley Beck (injured), James Hook (rested), Gavin Henson (overlooked) would all be ahead of him imo. I'd also have had Steven Shingler (injured by all accounts) ahead of him.
Owen Williams: 5th choice. I'd currently have Jon Davies (Lions), James Hook (rested), Scott Williams (injured), and Andrew Bishop (injured?) ahead of him. Cory Allen next season as well, as long as he's given game time. I think Owen Williams can improve though, so I'm not trying to be harsh.
Tom Prydie: 4th choice. Alex Cuthbert (Lions) certainly ahead of him, and like Robinson I'd expect the likes of Walker and Liam Williams would be played ahead of him as well.
Liam Williams: 3rd choice. Arguably 2nd choice behind Halfpenny (Lions), but I'd still have Byrne (overlooked) in front of him too.

Still I hoped for more before the tour began. If we hadn't have lost Ken Owens, Aaron Shingler, Ashley Beck, Scott Williams and Eli Walker to injury I think we could have won. I admit that I was guilty of underestimating Japan. Duck warned me all along, but I was expecting a stronger scrummaging display, and better physicality to keep us in control, but neither materialised at all. I'd say Japan was the more physical side and that's a big disappointment.

McBryde's decision to leave experienced players at home was also a big mistake. Paul James, Matthew Rees, Ryan Jones, James Hook, Gavin Henson and Lee Byrne were all available and would have made a big difference imo. It's all well and good looking to the future, but what good would these two tests have done to those youngsters? Not much in hindsight.

 

[Draggs]

Duck=Eddie Jones?
More on this later.