June International Tests: Argentina vs. England (2nd Test) (17/06/2017)

[BPM]

I get fed up with people saying Manu doesn't pass or offload.

Do you lot forget Manu's game V NZ did all that? or most of his game with Tigers.

He was obvious told by Lancaster on whole to just run.

Possibly. I also think he was a bit of a one man back line back then. Farrell and Barritt were mover going to break the gainline, so we were reliant on him doing so. Under Lancaster, we didn't have many heavy carriers in the pack either, so Manu had the main responsibility.

It's not that I think he can't offload or pass, but I do think Te'o is better at those particular skills although I would still rate Manu as the more individually talented.

My point was that Te'o is doing what Eddie said he wants from a gainline busting 12. Manu's mainly played at 13 and more to the point, hasn't played a great deal of rugby at all in the past couple of years.

I 100% want Manu back at his best, I've just lost a little faith in the reality of it.

 

[ncurd]

Still see Te'o as the bench option with Farrell starting. Te'o does it against tired defences so until they tired I want the passing option to create holes through slick play which is more likely to happen early game.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Still see Te'o as the bench option with Farrell starting. Te'o does it against tired defences so until they tired I want the passing option to create holes through slick play which is more likely to happen early game.

Has started every game he's played for the Lions and has caused havoc regardless, don't think that statement is fair.

 

[BPM]

Has started every game he's played for the Lions and has caused havoc regardless, don't think that statement is fair.

Agreed. Te'o has been up there with the best performers for the Lions. Certainly in the backs.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Agreed. Te'o has been up there with the best performers for the Lions. Certainly in the backs.

I'd argue he's been the most consistently impressive back of the tour, in strong competition with Faz.

 

[BPM]

Is anyone else a touch unsure about back up in the second row?

Isiekwe is clearly a talent, but with Skelton and Day joining Saracens, how much game time is he going to get in the next season or two?

Ewels looked good in Argentina so has effectively cemented his place at 5th choice, but 5 locks isn't enough IMO.

There is always Attwood, but he doesn't seem to be highly regarded by Eddie and I feel like we've missed an opportunity to blood another credible option like Symons or Barrow.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Is anyone else a touch unsure about back up in the second row?

Isiekwe is clearly a talent, but with Skelton and Day joining Saracens, how much game time is he going to get in the next season or two?

Ewels looked good in Argentina so has effectively cemented his place at 5th choice, but 5 locks isn't enough IMO.

There is always Attwood, but he doesn't seem to be highly regarded by Eddie and I feel like we've missed an opportunity to blood another credible option like Symons or Barrow.

Personally feel that 5 top quality options is enough but if not then Attwood is a more than capable option.

Far more concerned about the lack of 7 options. Despite Currys and Underhill all being very impressive, I doubt EJ would start them in a full international. We're one Hask injury away from Wood starting 7.

 

[Goodey]

Te'o I think started his England career as a Tuilagi stand in, but we are discovering that 'Tuilagi stand in' is in fact a permanent position

 

[Which Tyler]

I get fed up with people saying Manu doesn't pass or offload.

Out of interest, has anyone said that?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Out of interest, has anyone said that?

I've seen plenty of people say that throughout Manu's career.

 

[Which Tyler]

Kinda, I don't recall seeing it quite that way, and not even close to that here, to deserve the comment.

 

[ratsapprentice]

He doesn't pass very much, and he offloads a bit.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Kinda, I don't recall seeing it quite that way, and not even close to that here, to deserve the comment.

Just cause you don't recall, doesn't mean it's the case.

And i wasn't talking about people just on here but on the wider internet.

 

[Which Tyler]

Just cause you don't recall, doesn't mean it's the case.

And i wasn't talking about people just on here but on the wider internet.

I never claimed that it has never happened anywhere; and PI still fail to see the relvevance of the original post bringing it up - it was interjected as part of a conversaton, and appears to have nothing at all to do with the conversation.

Anyways; Manu needs first to prove that he can last a season without breaking horribly; then he's in a fight with JJ, Daly, Te'o, Farrell, Marchant, Devoto, Slade and Francis to get one of the 2 centre berths - and quite possibly 1-2 more by the time he's proven that fitness.
If he can do that, then he will also need better defence and better distribution than he's really shown so far; he should still be a good player, but the competition has moved on a touch from 4 years ago. He's no automatic pick, even if fit.

 

[Reiser99]

Personally feel that 5 top quality options is enough but if not then Attwood is a more than capable option.

Far more concerned about the lack of 7 options. Despite Currys and Underhill all being very impressive, I doubt EJ would start them in a full international. We're one Hask injury away from Wood starting 7.

I think that last part is the most depressing thing I've on this forum in a while and that includes all of the stuff with Gatland and the Lions.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I'd argue he's been the most consistently impressive back of the tour, in strong competition with Faz.

I think both of these are fallacies. Faz hasn't been very good bar his cameo v the Baabaa's while at 10, he played his best stuff at 12, but his start against the crusaders and finish against the Highlanders weren't great at all with some bad passing and defence.

I think Te'o is a flat track bully, was anonymous v the Crusaders and only broke into the game after the Maoris completely fell apart 2nd half.

Sexton - Faz is the obvious 10 - 12 axis for me and Murray has been the best back on tour probably followed by Watson.

Edit: did think this was a Lions thread but it's relevant enough anyway!

 

[TRF_Olyy]

My least favourite thing about the lions is I find myself agreeing with the Irish ( @The Alpha Bro )

I feel unclean, what have Gatland and Howley done? Bringing the English and the Irish together in mutual loathing of them. Why can't we just go back to hating each other?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

My least favourite thing about the lions is I find myself agreeing with the Irish ( @The Alpha Bro )

I feel unclean, what have Gatland and Howley done? Bringing the English and the Irish together in mutual loathing of them. Why can't we just go back to hating each other?

Yeh agree with that.

Weird seeing the Irish and English get along. Although we are all British i guess, even if the Irish have celtic blood in them, so it makes some sense.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Yeh agree with that.

Weird seeing the Irish and English get along. Although we are all British i guess, even if the Irish have celtic blood in them, so it makes some sense.

The Irish are definitely British, they just sorta forgot that's all.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Lads... Don't make us invent terrorism again!