France vs England

[Rocket Singh]

I think win or lose even France were getting a little annoyed with the refs antics, especially when he was spending ages before a French line out in the first half instructing everyone to move along a few inches, back a few inches...alllmost...there we go! No! *whistle* sorry but that was all wrong, you moved along by about three inches, we'll have to spend hours trying to get a scrum going now!

Wasn't very impressed at all as you'll gather no doubt.

Foden and Ashton were great, Tindall worked well with Flood and Cueto continued to play a strong game. Just goes to show we were all harping on about the wrong players in our back line when we keep whinging about Cueto's lack of pace, Armitage & Monye vanish and suddenly everything is rosy again with our back three

Ashton, Cueto & Foden looked great together. Lets keep it that way please!

 

[St Helens RLFC]

Was Brian Moore drunk?

I don't know a lot about union but I know that ref was pretty poor.

 

[dullonien]

Obviously alot of complains from English fans (uneducated English fans that is) about the referee, considering the comments in the studio afterwards. Obviously too many listening to Brian Moors rantings and believing he was correct. Personally thought the ref was ok, missed a few things and overall was harsh on England, but nowhere neer the levels that had Moor, Johnson and BrainKing venting. The English Scrum was under pressure and France deserved everything they got there. Cole quite honestly had a poor game today. Was innefective carrying the ball, and got murdered scrum time. Good call by Johnson to make the changes at half time.

The main thing the ref missed was the three blatant offside infringments at the rolling maul, where three french players entered from the side. Very poor reffing there. But I have no idea why Moore got so annoyed by that crooked quick lineout, as the ref got that spot on. It was a good 2-3m not straight.

The ref didn't cost England todays game, but it was that missed opporunity by Ashton.

Overall, England dominated todays game and deserved to win, if only for being the team willing to run with the ball (that just sounds wrong), but ultimately lost probably because they weren't used to running with the ball. Thought Foden was immense, as was Cueto and Ashton (but for the missed try). Flood showed that he get's the backline moving better than Johnny could dream of. Tindall was another shining light, can't believe Johnson took him off.

Congrats to France for winning the grand slam. I'm sure it wasn't in the way that most French fans would have been totally happy with, but they fully deserved it for the way the team has played throughout the competition.

Edit: gotta agree though that the ref was rediculous with all his little things. Does it matter in the slightest if the players touch each other before being told. As long as they hold the engage, it makes sod all difference. But that was for both teams.

 

[Mr.cyclopede]

Coming back from the match

England played like france use to, and also lost like France does.

Predicted on the comp that the defense would take on the attack, but thought we could have scored one or two tries in interception.
Great defense from both team whatever, the ability and rapidity of the English one to replace on the field was awesome.

 

[Bernard]

f***in tough moment ! but WE WON ! at the end that is what counts. IT was not beautiful at all, frenchies played like little scared babies and england played better than their other matches. I would say overall that France deserves this grand slam but yeah that is not the way i was seeing winning this match. But WE WON.

 

[Bernard]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Olyy @ Mar 20 2010, 10:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

If this is it, then that's poo!
England wasted two/three try scoring chances, and France are un-deserving winners (of this match at least)


f*** nuggets.
France didn't deserve that one bit.
Can managers make formal complaints about referees? Because that performance certainly warrants one.[/b]

I remember a semi-final in 2007 where i'm not sure that england deserved it with a lucky try in the first 5 minutes...so lets be fair on this one : we won in the english way, means being realistic with penalties and just wait for opponent's fault.


Can you reckon that French has played a better rugby than england on the tournament ?

So France un-deserved win is hurting in a way...we deserved it and we have it , whatever the way we took to win it .

about refering i remember a match between France and England in twickenham in 2009 where the referee only whistle against France during the first 30 minutes (but yeah the BBC did not make a big thing about it obviously) ...and it gave a 29-0 for England at the half time...so sometimes it is with you and some other times it is against you ...and whatever you can think, you have to take it as it is...

 

[Bernard]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (St Helens RLFC @ Mar 20 2010, 11:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Was Brian Moore drunk?

I don't know a lot about union but I know that ref was pretty poor.[/b]

I thought the same thing about the first half in 2009...the referee was fully drunk....and i know a bit about rugby union...

 

[gingergenius]

The bar I watched the game in was very loud, so I can't offer an opinion on the refereeing.

Other than that, despite an England defeat, I'm quite happy. It was the best England played since we played the French last year.

Notes:

1. We got f***ed in the scrums, but Cole and Wilson are both good young players who'll improve and I'm quite happy with our tighthead departmant. Payne has to go, and I've really lost patience with Hartley, who incidentally should be serving a very long ban for gouging last week.

2. Where was Deacon, again? Palmer played well, but I saw nothing of Deacon.

3. I really liked the backs today. I'm Armitage's biggest fan, but on this kind of form Foden and Ashton form such a great link that I can see them wearing England shirts for a long time. DA is dependable cover, especially if he rediscovers his form of recent seasons. Cueto also thrived having Foden around, and once he's gone over the hill I'd love to see an English back 3 of Ashton, Cato and Foden. Mouthwatering.

4. Tindall was immense, but we can't hang around with him. Flood was also infinitely better than Wilkinson. A midfield of Flood, Flutey and Tait is not direct enough when you consider how poor our forwards are at ball-carrying, so someone like Hape may well have a future unless we find some really dynamic loosies.


All in all, a thouroughly deserved Grand Slam for France. They were the only team in the tournament who had no really noticeable flaws. England will undoubtedly keep plugging away and will pick up results here and there, but there's no signs in this current setup that we're going to win anything in the next couple of seasons. What we do have is a lot of promising players. Unfortunately, under Johnson, they're not going to get their chances, so I think England fans will have to settle for a few years more of the same... after RWC 2011 is when things should improve, and being optimistic, this is when I want us to start building a world class team that wins Grand Slams and beats SH teams.

 

[Bernard]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Mar 21 2010, 04:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

All in all, a thouroughly deserved Grand Slam for France. They were the only team in the tournament who had no really noticeable flaws. England will undoubtedly keep plugging away and will pick up results here and there, but there's no signs in this current setup that we're going to win anything in the next couple of seasons. What we do have is a lot of promising players. Unfortunately, under Johnson, they're not going to get their chances, so I think England fans will have to settle for a few years more of the same... after RWC 2011 is when things should improve, and being optimistic, this is when I want us to start building a world class team that wins Grand Slams and beats SH teams.[/b]

I defenitly think that England has great players. I do not know why but their flair is waking up against France. If we look objectivly to England game of yesterday evening, it was just great and even magical on some attacking actions. France was awake as well..on a defending POV and it helped a lot to this victory. With the match of yesterday i would not be too worried for the future of England team. I think england should give some playtime to players like gerarthy to bring more flair to their game..personal thought...It was like England was one yesterday , you could have put whatever english player on the ground, he would have transform himself in a great rugby player.

It is not just me being polite, it is what i thought watching the match in a pub called "The Frog"...

 

[lynam1104]

where are england touring the summer?

 

[Bullitt]

Austtralia.

My thoughts, player by player;

Payne - absoloutely has no business there. Never thought I'd say this, but hurry back Sheridan
Hartley - Wobbly lineout aside, a 50% performance. Which is still 50% more then Paice or fat c*** Mears could do. Tough times ahead for the number 2 shirt.
Cole - Excellent once again.
Shaw - Will anyone <strike>shoot</strike> put the old horse out to stud. Crap.
Deacon - Meh. As much to blame for the lineout as anyone.
Worsley - Tackled like an animal. Did little else.
Moody - Meh
Easter - Acutally very good. Looked more if a leader then Moody.
Care - Had a great game.
Flood - What England have been crying out for all Championship
Cueto - Looked sharp. Foden alonside helped.
Flutey - I've run out of paitence with him. Negative play and brainfarts galore... Looked like Wilkinson. f*** off.
Tindall - Really good. I mean REALLY good. which supprised me.
Ashton - The chip kick aside, had a great game. Awesome offload for Fodens try. Will only get better.
Foden - Wow! Just Wow! Armitage and his shitty, kicky boot can now f*** off forever.

Thompson - looked like he never broke his neck. Impressive.
Wilson - Added no improvement.
Palmer - pleasently good.was only hindered by having deacon as lineout partner.
Wilkinson - slowed the backline and wrecked Englands attacking threat. Good penalty, but hardly something Flood couldn't have done. Needed Allen for Flutey instead.
Tait - A shame he had to be at Tindalls expense. Too much cfrash ball instead of his natural game.

Overall - Englands best performance under Johnson was mostly down to Ben Foden behaving like Robinson did in 2007. Wasn't helped when the weather turned, by the coaches obsession with percentages and Jonny f***ing Wilkinson ruined it. Wells, Ford and Smith out. Geech, Brown and Ashton in. And ban f***ing Wilkinson.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bullitt @ Mar 21 2010, 09:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Austtralia.

My thoughts, player by player;

Payne - absoloutely has no business there. Never thought I'd say this, but hurry back Sheridan
Hartley - Wobbly lineout aside, a 50% performance. Which is still 50% more then Paice or fat c*** Mears could do. Tough times ahead for the number 2 shirt.
Cole - Excellent once again.
Shaw - Will anyone <strike>shoot</strike> put the old horse out to stud. Crap.
Deacon - Meh. As much to blame for the lineout as anyone.
Worsley - Tackled like an animal. Did little else.
Moody - Meh
Easter - Acutally very good. Looked more if a leader then Moody.
Care - Had a great game.
Flood - What England have been crying out for all Championship
Cueto - Looked sharp. Foden alonside helped.
Flutey - I've run out of paitence with him. Negative play and brainfarts galore... Looked like Wilkinson. f*** off.
Tindall - Really good. I mean REALLY good. which supprised me.
Ashton - The chip kick aside, had a great game. Awesome offload for Fodens try. Will only get better.
Foden - Wow! Just Wow! Armitage and his shitty, kicky boot can now f*** off forever.

Thompson - looked like he never broke his neck. Impressive.
Wilson - Added no improvement.
Palmer - pleasently good.was only hindered by having deacon as lineout partner.
Wilkinson - slowed the backline and wrecked Englands attacking threat. Good penalty, but hardly something Flood couldn't have done. Needed Allen for Flutey instead.
Tait - A shame he had to be at Tindalls expense. Too much cfrash ball instead of his natural game.

Overall - Englands best performance under Johnson was mostly down to Ben Foden behaving like Robinson did in 2007. Wasn't helped when the weather turned, by the coaches obsession with percentages and Jonny f***ing Wilkinson ruined it. Wells, Ford and Smith out. Geech, Brown and Ashton in. And ban f***ing Wilkinson.[/b]

Foden was the best player in England's back three I've seen since Cohen, Robinson and Lewsey. Really nice silky running skills and is the bit of risk England needs to be at all competitive.

 

[iWin]

Exactly. If we can give Foden and Ashton a bit more experience, we'll have a back 3 no-one will want to kick to.

 

[paella]

FFS, Sheridan needs to come back!!! (or a good loosehead needs to magically appear)

 

[Rocket Singh]

Yeah Dan Cole really really struggled in my view and had a very very uncomfortable time of it at scrum time but he is still very very new even for Leicester. Payne had a quieter evening but that just means that he wasn't doing anything. In any case we need to move Payne on as he's an accident waiting to happen to be honest. We need to give Dan Cole and David Wilson more time and bring back Sheridan.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bernard @ Mar 21 2010, 03:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I remember a semi-final in 2007 where i'm not sure that england deserved it with a lucky try in the first 5 minutes...[/b]

Lucky? I think it was a rather brilliantly taken try myself.

 

[Olyy]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bernard @ Mar 21 2010, 03:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

?

So France un-deserved win is hurting in a way...we deserved it and we have it , whatever the way we took to win it .[/b]

Don't get me wrong, France are definately the deserved winners, if Ireland had over taken them it wouldn't have been fair. I think you even deserved the Grandslam, as France have played fantastically all the way through, up until that match, which i don't think France deserved to win. So you deserve the Grandslam, but not that match


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bullitt @ Mar 21 2010, 08:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Wilson - Added no improvement.[/b]

I would'nt say that, our scrums improved greatly in the second half




Also, how different is it playing 12 to 13?
Because with Tindall likely to be in the squad for a while (which, after that performance, is right) maybe he could move to 12 or Tait could, so then we'd have a strong/crash centre and a fast one to feed off of him. But then again Tait on the bench is probably where he's best untill Tindalls off, as he can cover Wing/Centre/FB.
Semi-related, but i watched the England/Australia highlights the other day, and Dan Hipkiss wasn't nearly as bad as i remember, maybe we should give him another run out

 

[dullonien]

France deserved the championship, but probably didn't deserve the grandslam due to that performance. However England also didn't deserve to finish in second place. Suppose it doesn't really matter at the end of the day.

France again showed that they are vulnerable when the pressure comes on.

England showed that they have potential if Johnson selects the in form players.

 

[Mr.cyclopede]

I'm very surprised by many reactions about this match, telling we deserve the slam but not this match.

Of course, we didn't play a french champagne, but the some who regulary smile about the French unconstinency, the lack of pragmatism and our arrogance are now complaining because we played once an English style game (when we loose from them this way, we're not stopped telling "that's the rule guys").

England did not play like this yesterday for fun, but because they knew they did'nt have the power to base a tent in our 30m and to wait for penalties and drops.

We made a serious match, that's all.

 

[elgringoborracho]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dullonien @ Mar 21 2010, 01:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

France deserved the championship, but probably didn't deserve the grandslam due to that performance. However England also didn't deserve to finish in second place. Suppose it doesn't really matter at the end of the day.

France again showed that they are vulnerable when the pressure comes on.

England showed that they have potential if Johnson selects the in form players.[/b]

Or that they're no longer as vulnerable as they used to be. Because this time, they won.

 

[erwanseb]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dullonien @ Mar 21 2010, 07:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

France again showed that they are vulnerable when the pressure comes on.

England showed that they have potential if Johnson selects the in form players.[/b]

I actually think exactly the opposite, France has shown a tremendous level of self control. The torrential rain ruined the game anyway so they settled for the hardwork and did it well.

They wear down England slowly but surely and made all their efforts count.

AS for England showing some potential and running rugby, who wouldn't in their situation. They wouldn't win the 6N anyway and were in Paris to ruin French slam. It is always easier to play running rugby with nothing to lose.

Now try to do the same in the opening game or on your own grand slam decider, an entirely different story.....

France has , IMO, shown great maturity and control.