F1 Racing

[Reiser99]

Why did they remove the colours? They told us it had nothing to do with the Russian flag last year.

 

[ncurd]

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/ot...nsure-they-have-non-biased-stewards-1.4810306

Missed this last week. Merc and Hamilton should proceed very carefully, it looks to me like they're trying to influence the running of races in their favour. One of the worst decisions in the sport went against them but they know that a lot of favourable ones went their way last year, going after Masi is as much as I think can be justified.

"We need to make sure we have non-biased stewards," said Hamilton. "Some of the former race drivers, who are now stewards, are very good friends with certain individuals, some travel with certain individuals, and tend to take more of a keen liking to them.

"So people who have no bias, are going to be super-central when it comes to making decisions"

I did particularly enjoy this. There's a lot of accounts of Hamilton keeping his distance from other drivers. It's your fault you have no friends Lewis, recent drivers are needed in the stewards room.

 

[Reiser99]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/ot...nsure-they-have-non-biased-stewards-1.4810306

Missed this last week. Merc and Hamilton should proceed very carefully, it looks to me like they're trying to influence the running of races in their favour. One of the worst decisions in the sport went against them but they know that a lot of favourable ones went their way last year, going after Masi is as much as I think can be justified.

I did particularly enjoy this. There's a lot of accounts of Hamilton keeping his distance from other drivers. It's your fault you have no friends Lewis, recent drivers are needed in the stewards room.

So asking for non-biased officials is trying to influence races in your own favour? The only way is if non-biased is subject to Mercedes approval. But if you don't think it's an issue then can we get an English ref for our next 6Ns game?

As for needing to make friends, this isn't the pub it's sport. Being friends with the officials shouldn't be a condition for fair decisions. I know it's not what you meant, but you definitely imply that it's Hamilton's fault for not making friends that is causing decisions to go against him.

 

[ncurd]

It was a strange one the drivers steward was seen as instrumental a few years back to make decisions with their input. But they are also ref's and neutral ref's are considered important in sport. How you do that in a multinational sport where drivers have allegiances based on many complex relationships.

The driver steward is definitely meant to be an advisors to provide nuance rather than decision make so the question is are they relying on those stewards too much rather than the regulations?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

So asking for non-biased officials is trying to influence races in your own favour? The only way is if non-biased is subject to Mercedes approval. But if you don't think it's an issue then can we get an English ref for our next 6Ns game?

When there's literally no evidence of bias race stewards, I think it is an attempt to influence.

As for needing to make friends, this isn't the pub it's sport. Being friends with the officials shouldn't be a condition for fair decisions. I know it's not what you meant, but you definitely imply that it's Hamilton's fault for not making friends that is causing decisions to go against him.

Having good relationships with people in your place of work generally helps with decisions that should be neutral, promotions, transfers, secondment opportunities etc... Hamilton hasn't built many and now appears paranoid* that it will negatively affect him is a lot closer to me point.

It was a strange one the drivers steward was seen as instrumental a few years back to make decisions with their input. But they are also ref's and neutral ref's are considered important in sport. How you do that in a multinational sport where drivers have allegiances based on many complex relationships.

The driver steward is definitely meant to be an advisors to provide nuance rather than decision make so the question is are they relying on those stewards too much rather than the regulations?

I don't know the details but surely they can't maintain ties to teams and are regularly scrutinised, if not there's an issue but why not state that? The only bias I saw was to ensure an Abu Dhabi showdown that at times both favoured and harmed both drivers chances in the last two weekends.

I think the issue in F1 last year was they got lost in the new popularity they found and favoured entertainment, popular drivers and engaging narratives over fair racing throughout the season. The recent driver race steward cares fairly little of that bluster and has even less influence I imagine.

*I think paranoia is the best justification that can be made from all of this. Somewhat understandable given Abu Dhabi but less so considering Hamilton's entire career has gone about as well as it possibly could otherwise.

 

[ncurd]

snip

Honestly I think the driver's steward and these comments has more to do with what happened in Sao Paulo than Abu Dhabi. Supposedly is drivers briefing afterwards nobody was really clear why Verstappen was allowed to do what he did and even when Masi provided further clarity on rules of engagement they were still bemused by it all. Silverstone and Monza still has to be in their heads a bit too where outcomes were penalised instead of the actual racing.

But ultimate Sao Paulo is where it all soured for Mercedes and Hamilton where they appeared to be looking for reasons to be penalised. Abu Dhabi was just another brick on that.

I also think its just some bad public speaking its the first time the press have really been able to ask him about it all. All he's really saying is he want decisions made accurately rather than being arbitary as they were last season.

Still think the bigger joke was Verstappen defending Masi.

 

[Reiser99]

When there's literally no evidence of bias race stewards, I think it is an attempt to influence.

Having good relationships with people in your place of work generally helps with decisions that should be neutral, promotions, transfers, secondment opportunities etc... Hamilton hasn't built many and now appears paranoid* that it will negatively affect him is a lot closer to me point.



I don't know the details but surely they can't maintain ties to teams and are regularly scrutinised, if not there's an issue but why not state that? The only bias I saw was to ensure an Abu Dhabi showdown that at times both favoured and harmed both drivers chances in the last two weekends.

I think the issue in F1 last year was they got lost in the new popularity they found and favoured entertainment, popular drivers and engaging narratives over fair racing throughout the season. The recent driver race steward cares fairly little of that bluster and has even less influence I imagine.

*I think paranoia is the best justification that can be made from all of this. Somewhat understandable given Abu Dhabi but less so considering Hamilton's entire career has gone about as well as it possibly could otherwise.

Ok, explain how Verstappen being allowed to get behind Hamilton, but Sainz not being allowed to be behind Verstappen isn't biased?

As for fostering good relationships in work places, what has that got to do with sport and the officials making neutral decisions on the competition. That comparison is ridiculous.

 

[ncurd]

Also well done to to FIA for winning the most stupid governening body in international sport.

Russian and Belarusian drivers can compete in neutral capacity, rules FIA

Motorsport's governing body the FIA rules Russian and Belarusian drivers can continue to compete in a neutral capacity.

www.bbc.co.uk

It take a special kind of stupidity when you looks bad against FIFA and the IOC.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Ok, explain how Verstappen being allowed to get behind Hamilton, but Sainz not being allowed to be behind Verstappen isn't biased?

That's not the driver stewards decision.

As for fostering good relationships in work places, what has that got to do with sport and the officials making neutral decisions on the competition. That comparison is ridiculous.

Ok, is it much different to "playing the ref" in rugby then? Most drivers do it by being normal and approachable people, Ham has to throw unfound accusations out. (There's also no evidence of favouritism so it could be entirely baseless)

Still think the bigger joke was Verstappen defending Masi.

I think they're as ridiculous as each other. Verstappen also wasn't the only driver to disapprove of Masi going. It was more him saying why is Masi the fall guy when there was loads outside of his control that went wrong and probably triggered by Mercs involvement in his dismissal.

I'm guessing Merc are targeting Liuzzi as a steward and RB will continue to argue the opposite of anything they say. It'd be great if neither were contenders this year because it's getting so tiresome.

 

[Reiser99]

That's not the driver stewards decision.

Ok, is it much different to "playing the ref" in rugby then? Most drivers do it by being normal and approachable people, Ham has to throw unfound accusations out. (There's also no evidence of favouritism so it could be entirely baseless)

I think they're as ridiculous as each other. Verstappen also wasn't the only driver to disapprove of Masi going. It was more him saying why is Masi the fall guy when there was loads outside of his control that went wrong and probably triggered by Mercs involvement in his dismissal.

I'm guessing Merc are targeting Liuzzi as a steward and RB will continue to argue the opposite of anything they say. It'd be great if neither were contenders this year because it's getting so tiresome.

First playing the ref is nothing like friendship in a work place, so your original comparison is still rubbish. Also playing the ref isn't about friendship, it's about being polite and respectful. Honestly, what does friendship have to do with competitors and officials.

As for not a stewards decision that's you being pedantic. You know he's referring to the officiating as a whole and so am I. That's you avoiding the issue.

Simple fact for me is that the officials should always be neutral and unbiased in any sport. Asking for that as a competitor is not wrong, especially after Abu Dhabi.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

First playing the ref is nothing like friendship in a work place, so your original comparison is still rubbish. Also playing the ref isn't about friendship, it's about being polite and respectful. Honestly, what does friendship have to do with competitors and officials.

As for not a stewards decision that's you being pedantic. You know he's referring to the officiating as a whole and so am I. That's you avoiding the issue.

Simple fact for me is that the officials should always be neutral and unbiased in any sport. Asking for that as a competitor is not wrong, especially after Abu Dhabi.

How am I being pedantic when he's singled out the driver steward? He couldn't have a go at Masi or Race Control after it's been changed completely so took a jab at a party no one has complained about.

I think if there was any grounding to his claim my comparisons would be unfair but there isn't. He knows he's not well liked among drivers, his doing, and has taken a jab at a position that could affect him which is run by recent drivers. If he maintained good relationships with people there'd be nothing to worry about.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

Lewis was referring to Vitantonio Liuzzi having raced for Red Bull and having raced under Christian Horner specifically. It's like having Frank Murphy referee the Munster-Leinster derby.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Lewis was referring to Vitantonio Liuzzi having raced for Red Bull and having raced under Christian Horner specifically. It's like having Frank Murphy referee the Munster-Leinster derby.

Yeah but by that measure Karl Dickson is a perfectly adequate ref also and I believe is now also allowed to ref quins games

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Lewis was referring to Vitantonio Liuzzi having raced for Red Bull and having raced under Christian Horner specifically. It's like having Frank Murphy referee the Munster-Leinster derby.

That has happened before. It was the only game of the last 10 (rainbow excl.) that Munster won... Maybe Hamilton is on to something.

Realistically though it's impossible for stewards with recent F1 experience not to have a previous tie to a team or driver unless you want to hit up HRT or Virgin pay drivers who never knew how to race at the best of times. If Liuzzi was former Ferrari or McLaren you don't hear this complaint.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

Yeah that's why I mentioned it, no one is happy when Frank gets that match.

I think it's a solid complaint, if you are going to have former drivers they should either be from a different elite level series or far enough removed that they don't have relationships with any of the personnel still in the paddock.

And of course if you change the facts his response would be different.

Edit: I had the misfortune of explaining baseball to Frank. He's a solid dude, I legit feel bad that they assign him the biggest match in Ireland when he played for one of the sides. Leinster-Ulster would do as much for his development.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Nikita Mazepin: Russian Formula 1 driver barred from British Grand Prix after Motorsport UK decision

No Russian/Belarusian licenced teams are approved to enter motorsport competitions in the UK; no Russian/Belarusian licenced competitors and officials are approved to participate in UK motorsport events; no Russian/Belarusian national symbols, colours, flags to be displayed

www.skysports.com

Mazepin banned from racing at Silverstone. At least UK motorsport has some balls even if the FIA don't. I'm sure this will have seriously impacted his ***le chances.

 

[unrated]

Nikita Mazepin: Russian Formula 1 driver barred from British Grand Prix after Motorsport UK decision

No Russian/Belarusian licenced teams are approved to enter motorsport competitions in the UK; no Russian/Belarusian licenced competitors and officials are approved to participate in UK motorsport events; no Russian/Belarusian national symbols, colours, flags to be displayed

www.skysports.com

Mazepin was banned from racing at Silverstone. At least UK motorsport has some balls even if the FIA don't. I'm sure this will have seriously impacted his ***le chances.

Why is the banning of individual Russian civilians cheered?

Is every Russian civilian to be punished and condemned in society for the actions of their government, a government which the UK government believed was not one placed in power by popular support?

 

[ncurd]

Why is the banning of individual Russian civilians cheered?

Is every Russian civilian to be punished and condemned in society for the actions of their government, a government which the UK government believed was not one placed in power by popular support?

Apart from the point which is to isolate Russia to create backlash against their policies. You're probably against the apartheid boycotts of SA this serves the same purpose.

I would look up this particular individual, how he has become an F1 driver and the connection that money has to Putin.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Surely having Mazepin being irredeemably rubbish on a global stage is exactly the sort of sporting punishment that should be issued to Russia. Heck, the FIA could have had a Mazepin cam for 2022 so we could all point and laugh at the millions being squandered by the Russian state while it completely fails to look after the Russian people with basics like pensions.

Generally not in favour of banning athletes/sportsfolk from competions unless their regime has systematic doping history in the sport in question or some racial based ideology. However, in F1 half the field are only getting a seat because of their financial backing. So if the FIA are happy with Azerbaijan, Bahrain and Chinese money, but not Russian money, then it's their call I guess. Give the seat to someone who can actually drive a car safely at speed.