[EOYT] England vs. Argentina 09/11/13

[McTallshort]

Oh my Lord, THIS!!! It's been this way for years!! This really does sum up post 2003 England. World cup Quarter final 2007 (single tear down the cheek), Ireland 2008 6n, France 2009 6n, Australia 2010 tour + Autumn, All Blacks 2012 - It's all been when they've taken such a shafting in the media! We should visciously beat them like dogs constantly. 'Beat the All blacks? Why didn't you get another try? You're sh**' 'Won the grand slam? Wales have been doing that for years you ba******'

Yes but in the games mentioned above we never actually win them the French/Irish/Kiwis lose them and we get lucky.

 

[j-dawg]

I've heard England have never actually won a game ever.

 

[Aspry]

It's clear for me that England should win without much trouble due the awful conditions that this Puma team is facing.
Leaving aside the new coach and the internal problems in the squad, too many of our key players are out for this test and also we don't have a clear leader ahead of the team. The last time we didn't have a leader playing on the field we lost 73-13, so I am a little bit worried about this match to tell the truth.
That being said, England by 25.
Wish well for both sides and I hope at least for a fun game to watch, want to see Cordero on the field.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I bet Lancaster will eff it up and drop Yarde for Wade :lol:

I'm annoyed that Attwood has been released - wanted to see him start this game.
I imagine that Hartley will be starting at 2, then - they won't want to train all week with Youngs as their starting 2 if it's 50/50 whether he'll be there or not.

I knwo what you mean, but then we've already seen Attwood Wilson and Wade against Argentina - I'd have liked to see them start the game against Oz, being different opposition, rather than a 3rd run out against Argentina. As it is, it feels like Lancaster is still giving the top and most competitive games to his favourites of which Ashton is unfortunately one, whilst pn;y letting Wade, Burns and co have a go against the 2nd tier sides! I don't mean this as disrespect to Argentina - I think they're capable of winning against us of course, but away from home in their current form seems a long shot.

 

[Patchey]

Only real surprise in the list of released players is Mako. A bit odd that Marler has been chosen over him. Everything else was fairly expected, if a little sad in the case of Burns and Attwood.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

This is a very different Argentina side, though.
and if Attwood isn't in this game, then I can't see him being in the 23 next week either, meaning we won't see him until the Six Nations which, unless there's injury, he'll be fighting to get into the 23 with Lawes/Parling/Launchbury already having their spots.

 

[Big Ewis]

It's clear for me that England should win without much trouble due the awful conditions that this Puma team is facing.
Leaving aside the new coach and the internal problems in the squad, too many of our key players are out for this test and also we don't have a clear leader ahead of the team. The last time we didn't have a leader playing on the field we lost 73-13, so I am a little bit worried about this match to tell the truth.
That being said, England by 25.
Wish well for both sides and I hope at least for a fun game to watch, want to see Cordero on the field.

As a fan whose nation is having big problems itself, I can only tell you this: France and Argentina will seemingly very often have ups and downs, look amazing and then go through a crisis, but it's only temporary. Be patient and the Pumas will come right back into good form and put fear into the nations they're playing. With both feet in TRC, there's no way but up.
Godspeed, Argentina !

 

[Patchey]

This is a very different Argentina side, though.
and if Attwood isn't in this game, then I can't see him being in the 23 next week either, meaning we won't see him until the Six Nations which, unless there's injury, he'll be fighting to get into the 23 with Lawes/Parling/Launchbury already having their spots.

Is it churlish of me to suggest that the Barnes inspired Lawes-hype has cost Attwood his place?

 

[Peat]

Possibly. I think getting injured just before the AIs was probably a bigger deal.

 

[Patchey]

True. Although he seemed back fit and playing well the week before the first game if i remember correctly. The same weekend that Lawes made lots of hits and got everyone excited.

 

[Packman]

It's clear for me that England should win without much trouble due the awful conditions that this Puma team is facing.
Leaving aside the new coach and the internal problems in the squad, too many of our key players are out for this test and also we don't have a clear leader ahead of the team. The last time we didn't have a leader playing on the field we lost 73-13, so I am a little bit worried about this match to tell the truth.
That being said, England by 25.
Wish well for both sides and I hope at least for a fun game to watch, want to see Cordero on the field.

If we score 25 points more than the Pumas then I'll do a naked Morris dance outside 10 Downing Street with jangley bells tied to my fingers, toes and privates. Anyone asks though and I say I'm campaigning for world peace, writing off world debt (including my student loan and credit card bill) and promoting sustainable energy to help save the Grey Whale because there are only about 140 of the big 'ol fellas left in the whole wide world and that's sad. :boese0556kf:

 

[Packman]

Nothing to see here. Move along...

 

[McTallshort]

Only real surprise in the list of released players is Mako. A bit odd that Marler has been chosen over him. Everything else was fairly expected, if a little sad in the case of Burns and Attwood.

Mako carrying an injury.

 

[Crapspray]

The Daily Wail are reporting that Wade will get a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/ru...-Wade-start-England-Argentina-Twickenham.html

Please be at the expense of Ashton...

 

[Patchey]

Makes much more sense. I'd only seen the team news on twitter, without any context or explanation.



I think it'll be Yarde/Wade. Lancaster has made no secret that Yarde is the kind of winger he likes and comparing Wade's very good form at the weekend with Ashton's as expected average showing I think we might finally see him go.

 

[McTallshort]

I fear Ashton will play I really don't understand why he is retained or picked he's a busted flush in terms of International rugby and the sooner he's dropped the better SCW would never have given him this many chances

 

[Patchey]

I'm not sure about that. Doesn't Woodward keep praising him in various columns he's been writing?

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Slightly aside, if SCW wants his opinions to be taken more seriously he needs to stop writing for the daily mail.

 

[Prestwick]

Is billy an 80min player though? He looked pretty dead when coming off last week. His style definitely looks to be to run himself ragged and then get subbed.
Suppose wood can cover 8 from the pitch in that case.

He's definitely not an 80m player. At least not yet. He's making the same transition as Ben Morgan had to when he first ran out for England. I've got no problems with substituting one dynamic wrecking ball with another though.

I wouldn't change anybody in that team bar Corbs for Mako Vunipola and...maybe Parling for Lawes (which would be a very rum deal for Lawes).

What I don't get it this obsession with Wade right now so close to the All Blacks. Yes I know Wade is extremely exciting and yes I know Ashton hasn't set the world alight and yes I know he's still got defensive issues - though the same people who were saying that Israel Folau is amazing and can run around anybody then suddenly expected Chris Ashton to tackle him effectively while Folau was running in full flow in open space. Logic my friends. Use it.

Aaaanyway. The last thing we need is for England to field two inexperienced wingers for Argentina and (I presume) New Zealand. While we're at it, is there any way we can make the back line even more defensively naive? Anybody? Maybe put Kyle Eastmond in there at Center to freak Joel Tompkins out even more. Maybe even go trawling the England under 19s for a full back greener than a 100 dollar bill and put him there in place of Mike Brown because, hey, he's, like really fast and exciting!

Okay, I'm over reacting by a lot and yes I am drinking too much of this very good 21 year Highland Park but I'm going to to a Rob Ford and blame all of this on me being in a "drunken stupor" and ask that is this really the best time to bed in Christian Wade? A guy who could be thrown into the mix in the Six Nations and if he does well bring him on against the All Blacks next summer?

 

[j'nuh]

Inexperienced Wade > Experienced Ashton

And if we want to talk about experience, how many years of play does each have in union?

In any case, now is the best time to bed someone in. Better to bed in whilst playing a series of fairly meaningless one-offs, than during a tour or a Six Nations. It also means that we don't keep putting his breakthrough further and further back. Don't do it now, guarantee that people will complain about his inexperience come the 6N. And then again during the summer tours. And then again next AIs. Repeat, repeat, until injury to Ashton forces him into the team.