England World Cup Squad

[Becca]

I don't deny something stinks with the Farrell decision but it's getting to hysteria when things like his own dad defending him rather than throwing him to the hounds get people foaming.

I agree.
The response has become totally OTT.

 

[Which Tyler]

I don't deny something stinks with the Farrell decision but it's getting to hysteria when things like his own dad defending him rather than throwing him to the hounds get people foaming.

Oh, absolutely.

I just don't think it's "holier than thou" to say that the process around this one stinks more than just about any other recent red card controversy

 

[Bada-Bing!]

It's become a circus because he's the England captain who has previous for a leading with his shoulder when attempting to tackle and still hasn't learnt from it when punished and went back to school.

Not pleading guilty and getting off on a technicality, in an initial opaque process, that few others understood how the decision was reached didn't help.

All this he's not malicious etc is cobblers IMO. Justice delayed is justice denied. That applies to all areas of life when someone decides to break the rules/law.

 

[higgik]

He's not lost any pace over the last two seasons. So i don't see how his lack of pace has taken him from one of the best full backs in the world, to not being good enough at full back.

Good in the air, ability to kick and chase, defence positioning are probably more key attributes for a full back before out and out gas. I'm struggling to think of any current full back who you say has serious wheels other than Barrett.

He's not lost any pace over the last two seasons. So i don't see how his lack of pace has taken him from one of the best full backs in the world, to not being good enough at full back.

Good in the air, ability to kick and chase, defence positioning are probably more key attributes for a full back before out and out gas. I'm struggling to think of any current regular full international full back who you would say has serious wheels other than Barrett.

LeRoux????
The key thing is not the outright pace but the ability to read the game in both attack and defence.
Steward does not come into the line enough, but maybe more to do with tactics.
In defence, teams have worked out that they can pull the whole backline out of place too easily, when they kick of 2nd pass, meaning he has to cover more ground, when speed is essential.
It is this lack of reading that is part of the issue.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Unironically think we'd have been better off if we'd have give it Dimes to the end of the season

He's always said the first two things he does when he gets to a club is gets the players working their arses off getting back into the line/back into the game, and getting players playing for each other/the shirt
Two things that we absolutely are not doing at the moment

 

[higgik]

Unironically think we'd have been better off if we'd have give it Dimes to the end of the season

He's always said the first two things he does when he gets to a club is gets the players working their arses off getting back into the line/back into the game, and getting players playing for each other/the shirt
Two things that we absolutely are not doing at the moment

True, he also keeps things simple on the pitch.
A lot of the issue is that the players are confused about what to do, and therefore look disinterested when they are actually confused.

 

[higgik]

Time to rewrite your 33 that SHOULD be going to France.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Don't think we'd do much worse with the late replacements tbh

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Time to rewrite your 33 that SHOULD be going to France.

Theo Dan --> Curtis Langdon
Jamie George --> Jamie George
Jack Walker --> George McGuigan
Ellis Genge --> Ellis Genge
Joe Marler --> Joe Marler/Simon McIntyre (admit I'm being biased here but SiMac was the form loosehead in England in the latter part of the season, think he and Marler play a similar game though Marler a bit better in the loose, SiMac, currently a bit better in the scrum)
Bevan Rodd --> Obano/VRR (roll a dice - Obano only just back from injury but been great since then and lifted the whole Bath side, VRR been great all season - one could replace the Marler/SiMac pick aove and I wouldn't be mad tbh)
Dan Cole --> Nick Schonert (form scrummaging tighthead in the country this season, by a long shot)
Kyle Sinckler --> Kyle Sinckler
Will Stuart --> Will Stuart
Ollie Chessum --> Ollie Chessum
Maro Itoje --> Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes --> Courtney Lawes
George Martin --> George Martin
David Ribbans --> Dave Ribbans
Tom Curry --> Tom Curry
Ben Earl --> Tom Willis (Harsh, as he's had a great season and played really well vs Wales last week, but he's not better than Tom or J.Willis so would rather T.Willis covering 6/8)
Lewis Ludlam --> Lewis Ludlam
Jack Willis --> Jack Willis
Billy Vunipola --> Zach Mercer
Danny Care --> Danny Care
Alex Mitchell --> Alex Mitchell
Ben Youngs --> Gus Warr
Owen Farrell --> Owen Farrell
George Ford --> George Ford
Marcus Smith --> Marcus Smith
Elliot Daly --> Elliot Daly (though tempted with Dan Kelly)
Ollie Lawrence --> Ollie Lawrence
Joe Marchant --> Joe Marchant
Manu Tuilagi --> Manu Tuilagi
Max Malins --> Adam Radwan
Anthony Watson --> Anthony Watson
Henry Arundell --> Tommy Freeman
Freddie Steward -> Freddie Steward

Reserves list with the likes of Dan Kelly, Fraser Dingwall, Joe Carpenter, Nic Dolly etc.


Not a million changes tbf - biggest two changes (if we take Borthwick as a given) would be:
Kevin Sinfield --> Mike Forshaw
Richard Wigglesworth --> Lee Blackett

 

[Booboobang]

Theo Dan --> Curtis Langdon
Jamie George --> Jamie George
Jack Walker --> George McGuigan
Ellis Genge --> Ellis Genge
Joe Marler --> Joe Marler/Simon McIntyre (admit I'm being biased here but SiMac was the form loosehead in England in the latter part of the season, think he and Marler play a similar game though Marler a bit better in the loose, SiMac, currently a bit better in the scrum)
Bevan Rodd --> Obano/VRR (roll a dice - Obano only just back from injury but been great since then and lifted the whole Bath side, VRR been great all season - one could replace the Marler/SiMac pick aove and I wouldn't be mad tbh)
Dan Cole --> Nick Schonert (form scrummaging tighthead in the country this season, by a long shot)
Kyle Sinckler --> Kyle Sinckler
Will Stuart --> Will Stuart
Ollie Chessum --> Ollie Chessum
Maro Itoje --> Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes --> Courtney Lawes
George Martin --> George Martin
David Ribbans --> Dave Ribbans
Tom Curry --> Tom Curry
Ben Earl --> Tom Willis (Harsh, as he's had a great season and played really well vs Wales last week, but he's not better than Tom or J.Willis so would rather T.Willis covering 6/8)
Lewis Ludlam --> Lewis Ludlam
Jack Willis --> Jack Willis
Billy Vunipola --> Zach Mercer
Danny Care --> Danny Care
Alex Mitchell --> Alex Mitchell
Ben Youngs --> Gus Warr
Owen Farrell --> Owen Farrell
George Ford --> George Ford
Marcus Smith --> Marcus Smith
Elliot Daly --> Elliot Daly (though tempted with Dan Kelly)
Ollie Lawrence --> Ollie Lawrence
Joe Marchant --> Joe Marchant
Manu Tuilagi --> Manu Tuilagi
Max Malins --> Adam Radwan
Anthony Watson --> Anthony Watson
Henry Arundell --> Tommy Freeman
Freddie Steward -> Freddie Steward

Reserves list with the likes of Dan Kelly, Fraser Dingwall, Joe Carpenter, Nic Dolly etc.


Not a million changes tbf - biggest two changes (if we take Borthwick as a given) would be:
Kevin Sinfield --> Mike Forshaw
Richard Wigglesworth --> Lee Blackett

Richard wigglesworth was the big one, when I initially heard he was bringing nick evans for the 6N I was impressed, he would adapt to the players he had and his leicester tactics were simply playing to their strengths.

Leicester for as good as some of their strengths are, attack is not one of them. His coaching choices are massive red flags, fixed thinking.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Richard wigglesworth was the big one, when I initially heard he was bringing nick evans for the 6N I was impressed, he would adapt to the players he had and his leicester tactics were simply playing to their strengths.

Leicester for as good as some of their strengths are, attack is not one of them. His coaching choices are massive red flags, fixed thinking.

Six Nations makes me think maybe Borthwick is a harsher task master than we might think, because we showed zero attacking intent, whereas Evans/Quins is pretty much balls to the wall 100% of the time

 

[Booboobang]

Six Nations makes me think maybe Borthwick is a harsher task master than we might think, because we showed zero attacking intent, whereas Evans/Quins is pretty much balls to the wall 100% of the time

Oh for sure, from looking in, it looks like its steves way or the highway and he will only ok playing his style of rugby. Also explains his coaching choices, safe space hires with little conflict or challenging of ideas.

Nick Evans putting up that 6N rugby was a shock, only possible reason is hamistringing by HC since quins are the complete opposite.

 

[Crash Hamster]

Unironically think we'd have been better off if we'd have give it Dimes to the end of the season

He's always said the first two things he does when he gets to a club is gets the players working their arses off getting back into the line/back into the game, and getting players playing for each other/the shirt
Two things that we absolutely are not doing at the moment

Isuppose we shouldn't be surprised that the RFU have lived up tot hte second two initials of their name yet again, but how hard would it have been to have had Steve Diamond* lined up as interim head coach?

*Or whoever**

** but seriously Steve DIamond.

14th December 2022; we agreed then, too.

 

[AlRums]

With two red cards in two games for virtually the same tackling offence, you do have to wonder what goes on in the England training re tackling technique

 

[TRF_Olyy]

With two red cards in two games for virtually the same tackling offence, you do have to wonder what goes on in the England training re tackling technique

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Theo Dan --> Curtis Langdon
Jamie George --> Jamie George
Jack Walker --> George McGuigan
Ellis Genge --> Ellis Genge
Joe Marler --> Joe Marler/Simon McIntyre (admit I'm being biased here but SiMac was the form loosehead in England in the latter part of the season, think he and Marler play a similar game though Marler a bit better in the loose, SiMac, currently a bit better in the scrum)
Bevan Rodd --> Obano/VRR (roll a dice - Obano only just back from injury but been great since then and lifted the whole Bath side, VRR been great all season - one could replace the Marler/SiMac pick aove and I wouldn't be mad tbh)
Dan Cole --> Nick Schonert (form scrummaging tighthead in the country this season, by a long shot)
Kyle Sinckler --> Kyle Sinckler
Will Stuart --> Will Stuart
Ollie Chessum --> Ollie Chessum
Maro Itoje --> Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes --> Courtney Lawes
George Martin --> George Martin
David Ribbans --> Dave Ribbans
Tom Curry --> Tom Curry
Ben Earl --> Tom Willis (Harsh, as he's had a great season and played really well vs Wales last week, but he's not better than Tom or J.Willis so would rather T.Willis covering 6/8)
Lewis Ludlam --> Lewis Ludlam
Jack Willis --> Jack Willis
Billy Vunipola --> Zach Mercer
Danny Care --> Danny Care
Alex Mitchell --> Alex Mitchell
Ben Youngs --> Gus Warr
Owen Farrell --> Owen Farrell
George Ford --> George Ford
Marcus Smith --> Marcus Smith
Elliot Daly --> Elliot Daly (though tempted with Dan Kelly)
Ollie Lawrence --> Ollie Lawrence
Joe Marchant --> Joe Marchant
Manu Tuilagi --> Manu Tuilagi
Max Malins --> Adam Radwan
Anthony Watson --> Anthony Watson
Henry Arundell --> Tommy Freeman
Freddie Steward -> Freddie Steward

Reserves list with the likes of Dan Kelly, Fraser Dingwall, Joe Carpenter, Nic Dolly etc.


Not a million changes tbf - biggest two changes (if we take Borthwick as a given) would be:
Kevin Sinfield --> Mike Forshaw
Richard Wigglesworth --> Lee Blackett

Honestly Wigglesworth isn't the problem

Without Borthwick tigers attack under Wig was very very strong

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Honestly Wigglesworth isn't the problem

Without Borthwick tigers attack under Wig was very very strong

True, but then how much better would it have gotten if he'd had another season or two under his belt?

I love Wiggy, don't get me wrong, but I don't think a coach with 2 seasons under his belt (most of that only part time coaching) is right for an international side

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Borthwick seems to have implied he hasn't submitted the squad yet as the BBC are saying Farrell and Vunipola could be replaced.

 

[Which Tyler]

Borthwick seems to have implied he hasn't submitted the squad yet as the BBC are saying Farrell and Vunipola could be replaced.

TFFT

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Borthwick seems to have implied he hasn't submitted the squad yet as the BBC are saying Farrell and Vunipola could be replaced.

Has he sent one of his mates to sit outside the WR offices and intercept the letter?