England World Cup Squad

[Saintjay]

According to the stats with The Times it's been nearly 6hrs of rugby since the backs scored a try. That pretty much somes up Borthwick's tenure. 3 from 8 says it all.

 

[SG59_]

Maybe he slipped it under the door and it's gone under the carpet.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I think this year we will be looking at Englands first ever loss to Italy and a tier 2 nation, to add to our worst ever defeat at home and probably a few other "worst ever" records Borthwick will have accumulated before he either performs a miracle or is kicked out.

Also last 5 games England have score 5 tries, opposition 19. We have also had 3 red cards, 4 yellows and near a century in penalties. That is tier 2 level of performance.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

With two red cards in two games for virtually the same tackling offence, you do have to wonder what goes on in the England training re tackling technique

How to tackle is a basic of the game that should be sorted long before players get anywhere near a national team. Sinfield should be spending his time on patterns, not technique. But noticed that Daly also fell off a few today.

 

[Noonz]

If SB can't take OF and BV, I would call in Cadan Murley and Zach Mercer.

I know, I know, but one can dream.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Honestly Wigglesworth isn't the problem

Without Borthwick tigers attack under Wig was very very strong

Lmao

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Person A does something wrong.
Person B acknowledges that person A did something wrong.
Person C agrees with B but also calls A a ****.
Person D agreed with B but says there's no reason to call A ****.
Rinse and repeat. Every time.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Lmao

care to expand

 

[Reiser99]

care to expand

Laugh my arse (we are british) off

 

[Crash Hamster]

So where does this leave "Billy needs a few games to play himself into form and fitness" now?

Assuming that Bostik hasn't really actually submitted the squad yet*, does he take Binny and have him 'playing himself into form and fitness' in actual, important, World Cup games, or does he ditch him in favour of the other number 8 in the squad?

Oh.

Let's make that bringing someone in from outside the squad who hasn't been training with the system (sorry, "system") and has to learn it in the one remaining warm-up match... or playing a non-specialist 8.

Coming up in next week's episode of Uncle Sniff's Bad Few Weeks, an injury to Jamie George.

* Surely not?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't think Billy's been to tackle school, has he?
Wouldn't be surprised if he gets 6 weeks down to 3 weeks down to 2 weeks, so they'll just not call up a replacement and have one of the flankers cover vs Fiji and Argentina (which would be a big step up tbh)

Farrell is an awkward one
6 with no reduction? 6 down to 5 or 4? Will they count the Ireland game in his ban?
I could honestly see us not calling anyone up for him either - 6 weeks (if they count the Ireland game) means he misses the whole group stage and is back for a (theoretical) quarter final. I could see them just accepting that, if replacing him in the squad is a permanent switch and not treated like an injury replacement (i.e. they can't name him, but because he's unavailable they can call in another player until he's available)

 

[Saintjay]

I don't think Billy's been to tackle school, has he?
Wouldn't be surprised if he gets 6 weeks down to 3 weeks down to 2 weeks, so they'll just not call up a replacement and have one of the flankers cover vs Fiji and Argentina (which would be a big step up tbh)

Farrell is an awkward one
6 with no reduction? 6 down to 5 or 4? Will they count the Ireland game in his ban?
I could honestly see us not calling anyone up for him either - 6 weeks (if they count the Ireland game) means he misses the whole group stage and is back for a (theoretical) quarter final. I could see them just accepting that, if replacing him in the squad is a permanent switch and not treated like an injury replacement (i.e. they can't name him, but because he's unavailable they can call in another player until he's available)

Pretty sure it's either his first red or international red. So he's definitely not at the interviewing his parents on his tackle technique level, or calls to boycott the game as he might kill someone level of hysteria.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

care to expand

Just laughing grimly at the concept of this team and 'attack'.

 

[BrokenWing]

Let's make that bringing someone in from outside the squad who hasn't been training with the system (sorry, "system") and has to learn it in the one remaining warm-up match... or playing a non-specialist 8.

There doesn't appear to be much of a system, and I'm not sure someone coming in who hasn't been stunk up with it if there was is a bad thing.

One match to learn not much seems doable.

Would there be much of a step down between a non specialist 8 and the binliner full of dripping that's supposed to be an actual 8?

 

[higgik]

Theo Dan --> Curtis Langdon
Jamie George --> Jamie George
Jack Walker --> George McGuigan
Ellis Genge --> Ellis Genge
Joe Marler --> Joe Marler/Simon McIntyre (admit I'm being biased here but SiMac was the form loosehead in England in the latter part of the season, think he and Marler play a similar game though Marler a bit better in the loose, SiMac, currently a bit better in the scrum)
Bevan Rodd --> Obano/VRR (roll a dice - Obano only just back from injury but been great since then and lifted the whole Bath side, VRR been great all season - one could replace the Marler/SiMac pick aove and I wouldn't be mad tbh)
Dan Cole --> Nick Schonert (form scrummaging tighthead in the country this season, by a long shot)
Kyle Sinckler --> Kyle Sinckler
Will Stuart --> Will Stuart
Ollie Chessum --> Ollie Chessum
Maro Itoje --> Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes --> Courtney Lawes
George Martin --> George Martin
David Ribbans --> Dave Ribbans
Tom Curry --> Tom Curry
Ben Earl --> Tom Willis (Harsh, as he's had a great season and played really well vs Wales last week, but he's not better than Tom or J.Willis so would rather T.Willis covering 6/8)
Lewis Ludlam --> Lewis Ludlam
Jack Willis --> Jack Willis
Billy Vunipola --> Zach Mercer
Danny Care --> Danny Care
Alex Mitchell --> Alex Mitchell
Ben Youngs --> Gus Warr
Owen Farrell --> Owen Farrell
George Ford --> George Ford
Marcus Smith --> Marcus Smith
Elliot Daly --> Elliot Daly (though tempted with Dan Kelly)
Ollie Lawrence --> Ollie Lawrence
Joe Marchant --> Joe Marchant
Manu Tuilagi --> Manu Tuilagi
Max Malins --> Adam Radwan
Anthony Watson --> Anthony Watson
Henry Arundell --> Tommy Freeman
Freddie Steward -> Freddie Steward

Reserves list with the likes of Dan Kelly, Fraser Dingwall, Joe Carpenter, Nic Dolly etc.


Not a million changes tbf - biggest two changes (if we take Borthwick as a given) would be:
Kevin Sinfield --> Mike Forshaw
Richard Wigglesworth --> Lee Blackett

Is Schonert now qualified?
If the kick chase game was the actual plan then tempted to go

Daly -> Murley

 

[Wasps92]

Unironically think we'd have been better off if we'd have give it Dimes to the end of the season

He's always said the first two things he does when he gets to a club is gets the players working their arses off getting back into the line/back into the game, and getting players playing for each other/the shirt
Two things that we absolutely are not doing at the moment

Which honestly blows my mind. You're playing for your country ffs. Showing some fight and a bit of pride is the least you should be doing. Especially in such a combative sport.

 

[Wasps92]

According to the stats with The Times it's been nearly 6hrs of rugby since the backs scored a try. That pretty much somes up Borthwick's tenure. 3 from 8 says it all.

Absolutely shocking that.

 

[BrokenWing]

Is the main quality of the hooker the ability to throw in to the lineout? Really can't say I've paid much attention to the forward stuff over the years, but it's just occurred why isn't there many lineout throwers that aren't hookers?
I know wingers used to do it many years ago, but I would have thought there would be some players in other positions who's skillset included throwing in.

 

[TopTen2003]

How did Chessum go yesterday guys? I had to dip in and out due to other commitments but saw he did come off the bench? Noted that one of the commentators on a highlights I've been watching suggested he had added a bit of grunt for England. Starting to wonder if Itoje could find himself under any pressure?

Also….Did Tuilagi go off early yesterday?

I enjoyed seeing Marcus Smith running in a little bit of space and making breaks -as we've previously discussed in here, we may have found a possible experiment with him at 15 in years to come.

Can't help but feel Borthwick has put himself under enormous pressure now that the one specialist 8 he picked - at the expense of an exciting talent like Mercer- has got himself banned.

I can't sympathise with him though with this current game plan. We need some players to be cut loose from the leash.

The players don't look happy with it to me.

 

[higgik]

Which honestly blows my mind. You're playing for your country ffs. Showing some fight and a bit of pride is the least you should be doing. Especially in such a combative sport.

But sometimes the brain is trying so hard to compute the plan, that everything is delayed, including the fighting spirit.

SCW talks about TCUP, and that is the problem, the thoughts are all mixed up still, especially in match situations.

SB should have taken the Tigers plan, however boring, and fitted the players in, regardless of whether they were the 'top players' or not.
He has fallen between 2 stools.

1) picked the best available players (good)
But
2) tried to play a game alien to them.