Think you have listened to the nonsense around the media too much, you do realise England have for the most part been fielding pretty well established internationals with a few new faces, England kicked a lot in 2019 it's not some fresh new establishing team where kicking is a new fernomin, let's not pretend.
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England World Cup Squad
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No I haven't listened to the media too much...but thanks anyway, and I think your underestimating the job that Jones left...
England for sure are a mess but essentially the game plan of what we loosely believe is one, isn't substantially different to that of 2019 which has aged and teams have worked around. it means predominantly the same bulk of the squad are implementing said game plan whilst being older and a declining force, I really don't understand why we are expected to believe these players are on a newer journey than that of France the evidence tells us otherwise, post WC is a different story, I think it's also short of someone regularly performing show stopping tackles like Underhill who swang momentum in key moments in 2019.
Jones had gone off on the wrong tangent from 2019 though. The players themselves seemed totally confused on the pitch.
There will also be differences from Jones to SB.
SB has stripped it all back to the basics to essentially start again.
But theres clearly lots to work on.
Just look at some of the decision making....Elliot Daly wide open and elects to kick. Baffling..and that was just one example. Daly gets alot of criticism but he's a creative attacking player...so clearly it's about instructions...and they're not quite there yet.
It's also about execution. It's not the coaches kicking badly or the kick chase not at the races, its the players on the pitch.
But the fact we're seeing Earl come to the fore and the likes of Itoje coming back into form gives me confidence that the rest will sort their game out aswell.
2 more weeks of training under the belt so I expect to see a better performance...not exhilarating but better execution and decision making.
I'm expecting to see a comfortable controlled win tonight.
Look I'm not a SB fan boy.. but I Just respect the position he was in and can see what he's trying to do so I'm giving him the benefit for the moment.
I've said rhe key for me will be the squad changes he makes post World Cup for the 6n....
There will also be differences from Jones to SB.
SB has stripped it all back to the basics to essentially start again.
But theres clearly lots to work on.
Just look at some of the decision making....Elliot Daly wide open and elects to kick. Baffling..and that was just one example. Daly gets alot of criticism but he's a creative attacking player...so clearly it's about instructions...and they're not quite there yet.
It's also about execution. It's not the coaches kicking badly or the kick chase not at the races, its the players on the pitch.
But the fact we're seeing Earl come to the fore and the likes of Itoje coming back into form gives me confidence that the rest will sort their game out aswell.
2 more weeks of training under the belt so I expect to see a better performance...not exhilarating but better execution and decision making.
I'm expecting to see a comfortable controlled win tonight.
Look I'm not a SB fan boy.. but I Just respect the position he was in and can see what he's trying to do so I'm giving him the benefit for the moment.
I've said rhe key for me will be the squad changes he makes post World Cup for the 6n....
I don't know how were going to get better at executing the kick everything plan when we've been **** at executing it for 4 years.
Your making out like it's a new system the players are still working out.
Your making out like it's a new system the players are still working out.
Not really....Jones was devising this complicated attacking plan....but couldn't pull it off with this group of players.
So now they're on to another plan.
Anyway...let's just see how it goes.
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Jones SAID he was devising a complicated attacking plan( saying "Nah mate" with knowing wink whenever questioned isn't evidence of a plan)… it seemed to be exactly the same as the other plan.
Well who know. I guess we'll know what went on when a few of the old guys retire and write the books
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He couldn't pull it off with the Australians either.
Maybe his cunning plan all along was to completely destroy any chance England had this World Cup to lead Australia to victory.
And he would have gotten away with it if it weren't for this complicated attacking plan.
Maybe his cunning plan all along was to completely destroy any chance England had this World Cup to lead Australia to victory.
And he would have gotten away with it if it weren't for this complicated attacking plan.
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We're nowhere near far enough removed from EJs reign to be getting all misty eyed and nostalgic about....our absolutely terrible attacking structures that led to him being fired
We had attacking structures?
Sorry this is revisionism EJ said he had a plan. The actual evidence it existed in game was non existent.
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I still feel that Eddie should've been given this RWC.
Couldn't have been any worse, RFU could've kept you know the few million it apparently spent and pumped it into the Champ clubs for another year, Eddie could've been given his last chance to see if he actually had a single bit of truth.
Also more importantly Borthwick and co could've been given another 18 months and see if they where actually good enough yet. Only Walters is experianced enough at this level.
But the media like everything by into early hype and 1 good club season way too much, look at Mitchell hyped as the next 9 off the rank but he's nowhere near good enough under pressure.
Second best option was to just give it to Cockerill who has good experience of doing short term turnarounds.
I will say as a Tigers fan I feel it worked out well for us, I wasn't convinced Borthwick wasn't being found out by Christmas last season. Tigers pocketed some nice money I'm pretty happy (Sinfield defence was certainly found out that season)
Couldn't have been any worse, RFU could've kept you know the few million it apparently spent and pumped it into the Champ clubs for another year, Eddie could've been given his last chance to see if he actually had a single bit of truth.
Also more importantly Borthwick and co could've been given another 18 months and see if they where actually good enough yet. Only Walters is experianced enough at this level.
But the media like everything by into early hype and 1 good club season way too much, look at Mitchell hyped as the next 9 off the rank but he's nowhere near good enough under pressure.
Second best option was to just give it to Cockerill who has good experience of doing short term turnarounds.
I will say as a Tigers fan I feel it worked out well for us, I wasn't convinced Borthwick wasn't being found out by Christmas last season. Tigers pocketed some nice money I'm pretty happy (Sinfield defence was certainly found out that season)
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In hindsight, I agree. I wanted Jones out, but I didn't want Borthwick in. Should have just left it to Jones if this is the end result.
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I still think binning EJ was right but I'd have gone with an interim for the rwc
How experienced do they need to be? Borthwick has been assistant both for Japan and with England?
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Yup, a few of said at the time - it was either a year too early, or 1-2 (or 3) years too late.
And that would have been with a Cockerill / Diamond / Blackett / ANOther appointment.
Probably 1-2 RWC cycles too early for Borthwick
And that would have been with a Cockerill / Diamond / Blackett / ANOther appointment.
Probably 1-2 RWC cycles too early for Borthwick
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I mean more than 2 years as a head coach would be preferable
Farrell had no years experience as head coach BUT coaches around him
Easterby 11 years
Catt 15 years
POC 4 years
Fogarty 8 years
Total 38 years experience
v England
Sinfield 2 years
Wigglesworth 2 years
Harrison 2 years
Total 6 years
alternatives about who was available
Forshaw 13 years
King 13 years
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ATM
Joesph
Rennie
Rassie
Prior to his hire a lot more.
Edwards and Farrell both seemed like they might have been open post 2027
