England vs Fiji 26th August 23

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Why did I talk myself into this being a snoozefest and have an afternoon outside? I missed history. Fiji up to 7th and a lovely shot in the arm for Tier2 rugby and the RWC.

 

[Saintjay]

Borthwick admits England's defence has got worse...

What else did he say, i had to pop out. Sounds like he's scapegoating Sinfield tbh.

 

[McTallshort]

What else did he say, i had to pop out. Sounds like he's scapegoating Sinfield tbh.

Ultimately he carries the can. Also is Cockerall still forwards coach?

 

[Crash Hamster]

What else did he say, i had to pop out. Sounds like he's scapegoating Sinfield tbh.

Defence had been working better than it did today. Squad is very tight and going forward together. Sinfield is great. No-one is injured except Watson. Blah blah corporate bolloxspeak...

 

[Geordie]

Called it....hardly difficult.

Embarrassing....goodbye Borthwick.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Ultimately he carries the can. Also is Cockerall still forwards coach?

Iirc Cockers left very shortly after Eddie

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Ultimately he carries the can. Also is Cockerall still forwards coach?

Nah, left in June (end of the 22/23 season), he's with Montpellier now

 

[SG59_]

Called it....hardly difficult.

Embarrassing....goodbye Borthwick.

Think he'll do a Roy Hodgson and have a speech ready to go the second they're out of the world Cup?

 

[Booboobang]

If the RFU didn't have a break clause for poor performance in Borthwicks contact, everyone involved in writing that contract should be fired.

They probably should anyway tbh but especially in that case.

I mean, you saw they didnt have anything like that with eddie or even a non compete.

The fundamental issue with english rugby is **** poor management from the top and bill sweeney is the chief in that.

Borthwick is bad, there are no excuses there should be performing better but england will never truly advance past mediocre untill the board is sorted.

Saying that, even getting to mediocre would be nice at this point.

 

[Grizwald]

Probably repeating what others have said but two years as head coach in the premiership isn't enough to prepare you for the England job. Jones was playing a dangerous game and got sacked for it, but England would've been a lot closer to NZ and RSA right now if he were still in charge.

Historic day for Fiji.

I agree with the coaching ticket 100%. Its pretty much like we've seen numerous players who are good club levels players but don't quite cut it at International level, take Dombrandt as an example.

England have good players, so I'm scratching my head as how the same crop of players give or take look tier 2 at best at the minute. Defence just looks pathetic, attack, Wigglesworth supposedly a cracking player coach when he was still playing but an international attack coach from someone who was still a player last season? I listed to a podcast with Nick Evans and he had a week with the squad before the 6N Scotland game, Wigglesworth has had a couple of months plus.

I was fed up with Eddie,q but through gritted teeth at the time thought he should stay on until after the WC. His post 2019 WC legacy for me was to fail to develop depth in key positions in time for this years competition.

 

[Booboobang]

I know te sky is falling etc...

But one thing I did take away from today is either smith plays at 15 (not my option, far to risky and doubt the high ball defense would hold up) or may needs to be binned of and someone like slade or lozowski needs to come in.

This team like every other attack in the world NEEDS a second playmaker to make it less predictable and open space. Otherwise the attack goes nowhere. Marchant, lawrence stewart, tuilagi are good players with strengths, but having them all in there leaves the attack far to predictable.

 

[Saintjay]

At what point can you say Borthwick has lost the dressing room. From what i can tell Billy V fell out for having 'words'. Has anyone got the balls to say it isn't working.

 

[SG59_]

Did he ever have it? Like Pivac, there's a strong smell of the caretaker from him.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

At what point can you say Borthwick has lost the dressing room. From what i can tell Billy V fell out for having 'words'. Has anyone got the balls to say it isn't working.

I wonder if the players are that brainwashed that they think it is working.

Clearly there are lots of things wrong, but the players or at least some of them are making the problem worse.

It's also evident that the RFU have all their eggs in the SB baskets so any player will realise the potential of having a blow up with them as he's not going anywhere.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Players should go back to their clubs for a week, get some outside perspective

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

I wonder if the players are that brainwashed that they think it is working.

Clearly there are lots of things wrong, but the players or at least some of them are making the problem worse.

It's also evident that the RFU have all their eggs in the SB baskets so any player will realise the potential of having a blow up with them as he's not going anywhere.

I wonder if that's why there have been so few new faces. Like Mercer's appearance with England was short lived. There doesn't appear to be much new life coming into England.

 

[BrokenWing]

It's safe to say SB is a control freak and probably wouldn't react well to players speaking up, so it depends if it's the back of their mind that speaking up might see them out of the squad.

 

[Saintjay]

Anyone know if that Japanese 90 years old fella from the Land Rover commercial is English qualified. He looks nails and wants it more. Seems quicker getting off the deck than Englands defence as well.

 

[Booboobang]

I wonder if the players are that brainwashed that they think it is working.

Clearly there are lots of things wrong, but the players or at least some of them are making the problem worse.

It's also evident that the RFU have all their eggs in the SB baskets so any player will realise the potential of having a blow up with them as he's not going anywhere.

I would of thought with this likely being the last world cup for some of them they would be more likely to go for it, thats a big reason the previous rebelion worked, those guys were at the end.

 

[AlRums]

I know te sky is falling etc...

But one thing I did take away from today is either smith plays at 15 (not my option, far to risky and doubt the high ball defense would hold up) or may needs to be binned of and someone like slade or lozowski needs to come in.

This team like every other attack in the world NEEDS a second playmaker to make it less predictable and open space. Otherwise the attack goes nowhere. Marchant, lawrence stewart, tuilagi are good players with strengths, but having them all in there leaves the attack far to predictable.

Everything else seems to have failed, maybe risky is all that is left