England v Scotland, 02/02/13

[pd rugby]

What I take from that; England are weak in the scrum. France will destroy us unless Lancaster picks a front row that includes Hartley that can compete. Hopefully Corbs will be back for Marler, who did ok, though that is the stand out weakness. Along with Goode.

didn't think youngs played that badly, marler is a bigger weakness than youngs in the scrum.

 

[UlsterRugby2012]

Difficult to judge Henry when he came on to play for a team under so much pressure. Agree about Kearney though.

England looked good just off the fringes, some real good offloading aswell. The Backrow particularly impressed me, really well balanced. Twelvetrees had a great debut and Robshaw along with Farrell had impressive games.

Some of Englands tackling was abit poor, Parling will not want to see some of his attempts on Beattie.

Haha no I was talking to 'HenryChinaski' not Chris Henry , but you're right - hard to judge, POM played well though.

 

[coonor]

Haha no I was talking to 'HenryChinaski' not Chris Henry , but you're right - hard to judge, POM played well though.

Thank God! Agree that POM was good today.

Anyway we better end this conversation before we get accused of overriding this thread!

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

What I take from that; England are weak in the scrum. France will destroy us unless Lancaster picks a front row that includes Hartley that can compete. Hopefully Corbs will be back for Marler, who did ok, though that is the stand out weakness. Along with Goode.

Were we watching the same game? England were getting a huge shove on even when Scotland were getting the initial hit. We were on top at scrum time in a pretty big way... I generally agree that Marlers not the best scrummager, but today the scrum went downhill somewhat with Vunipola on...

 

[smb64]

Were we watching the same game? England were getting a huge shove on even when Scotland were getting the initial hit. We were on top at scrum time in a pretty big way... I generally agree that Marlers not the best scrummager, but today the scrum went downhill somewhat with Vunipola on...

I agree, don't think our scrum looked to bad today to be honest.

What I don't understand is putting Flood at center, if he is going to be in the squad it should be as fly half cover for Farrel, Toby is rubbish at center

Also I think SL should keep 36-Barritt combination for next week, nothing wrong with it today and no reason to change it. Manu can come off the bench as an impact when Irish getting tired. Its also possible Manu might not be fully match fit for next week.

 

[kesh]

Pd, For Ireland I'd have Youngs for the pure yards he gets, in the scrum though Hartley doesn't go backwards, an Cole needs him, Marler.. wish Sheridan was there but the French are so strong in the scrum now you can't pick Youngs. It's the obvious weakness in this England side. Going to have to drop Youngs.

Totally ignoring Ireland, I'm arrogant. (Plus Sexton an the Irish are *****).

 

[pd rugby]

What I don't understand is putting Flood at center, if he is going to be in the squad it should be as fly half cover for Farrel, Toby is rubbish at center

I thought flood played 10 and faz went to 12?

 

[smb64]

I thought flood played 10 and faz went to 12?

Oh maybe he did - I thought it looked like Farrel was still playing first receiver with Flood in the center, I'm not entirely sure to be honest :lol:

 

[kesh]

Thought the Scottish scrum more then competed, I'm thinking more about how the English scrum would do against other teams. Particularly don't wish to see it destroyed by the French scrum is all I'm saying really. An with Marler/ Youngs, that will happen.

 

[Teh Mite]

Without a massive lump in the Boiler room like he enjoys at Quins, Marler looks loose in the scrum.

Both the Youngs brothers looked more a liability to me today then they looked useful - Care is the obvious change at scrum half, but a better backup to Hartley (who should be the obvious 1st choice) is needed.

I sound like a broken record, but Mike Brown was the ultimate bottler in an England shirt yet again. 3 trys went begging and he was directly responsible in buildup for the 1st Scotch try with the loose kick infield when he should have found touch on the 10m line.

Changes I would like:

Youngs -> Hartley (looked decent in the NZ game, but way out of his depth today. Were he not a Leicester player he'd not even be considered). Joe Gray to the bench.
Parling -> Lawes (accuse me of club bias, but Parling doesn't do much IMO. Lawes will add much more grunt into the scrum while having more impact as an open field enforcer. Launchbury can be groomed into the "general").
Youngs -> Care. Simpson on the bench if we desperately want a sniper in backup.
Barritt -> Tuilagi. Harsh call, but If we eventually have Burns -> 36 -> Tuilaggi, that will be out midfield mecca. BB can act as a useful sub.
Brown -> A winger. Sharples will do. Or JSD as he's still young enough.
Goode - > Foden (eventually, if he ever gets some form back). Goode has skills, but he didn't look particularly fit IMO and I'm sure he used to have a decent lick of pace. He'll get caught out as the tournament goes on I'll predict.

Bench wise:
Vunipola -> Anyone.
Sharples -> My dead nan would be better.


An okay performance I suppose for the 1st game in yonks, but they need to be much better.

*puts on tin hat*

 

[Big Ewis]

Honestly English fans, you will naturally look for your team's mistakes/areas to improve on/flaws etc...but it was a fine, intimidating effort.
Naturally I'll be hard on myself and on the French team, so I have no clue if we look intimidating or not because I don't have the outsider's eye. But England looked very strong, played their game, didn't look for nonsense improvisation or experimentation or nothing...A strong start against a Scotland team that could have easily put up more points on that scoreline.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Someone ruined the score for me at work (Overheard people discussing it).

Very happy with the win though! Just watching it through now, England looking strong so far.
Too tired to make an informed opinons on how we played, so will just read through here and take your words as gospel :lol:

 

[Patchey]

Really happy with the game, couple of thoughts,

1. England looked really good going forward both around the ruck and when the ball was through hands. The latter being very encouraging.

2. Launchbury is some player.

3. Youngs had a much better game but totally agree with Manx about his box kicking, makes me shudder just to think of it.

4. Launchbury really is some player.

5. Next week, presuming everyone stays fit, 12.TT, 13. Tuilagi with Barrit on bench as centre/desperation 10 cover.

6. Is it me or is Farrell getting better at this whole distribution thing.

7. Scotland have one hell of a back three. Their tries were basically a result of Hogg/Maitland and to some extent Visser having the vision to pounce on English cock ups. Watch out Italy.

8.Is it wrong to build a shrine to Joe Launchbury?

 

[Big Ewis]

uhmm btw guys, I keep reading "I hope we don't get pushed over by the French scrum" uhm guys that's not going to happen. England has always shown sides with strong scrums, and honestly, your forwards (besides just scrummaging) were the match for you. So physical, so imposing, so strong...the same kind of recipe the Australians survived and NZ succumbed to.

I'm worried about our match in Twickenham, we've got forwards ourselves but your guys since November play with so much bloodlust in those rucks; all you need is a few well stringed passes, fast execution (as you've shown today) and you've got 2-3 tries on France after 80minutes, especially with the intensity of playing at home and the psychological advantage.

EDIT: I dunno what the debate is amongst England fans over Ben Youngs at scrumhalf, but surely England can do better than that dude. I dunno if ppl pick on him or if he's actually a crowd favorite, no clue, but he's standard level, very uncreative in the faster moments of the match - England could srsly do with a top-notch no.9 with all that forward strength and ruck power...

 

[racingmetrofan]

EDIT: I dunno what the debate is amongst England fans over Ben Youngs at scrumhalf, but surely England can do better than that dude. I dunno if ppl pick on him or if he's actually a crowd favorite, no clue, but he's standard level, very uncreative in the faster moments of the match - England could srsly do with a top-notch no.9 with all that forward strength and ruck power...

imo he is still riding on the form he showed under Martin Johnsons England. When he got his debut he was a fast new player in a really slow boring England team, and then he was matched with his 10 at club level in Flood and then they both looked good alongside Hape and Tindall. Care on the other hand never looked that good for England, but he was used to playing alongside a world class running flyhalf in Nick Evans and not alongside Wilkinson or Flood under a slow MJ gameplan.

Now Farrell is getting better and the whole team has upped their intensity, Care fits in far better and Youngs X factor has gone because he's not the most exciting player in an average unexciting team.

 

[Teh Mite]

imo he is still riding on the form he showed under Martin Johnsons England. When he got his debut he was a fast new player in a really slow boring England team, and then he was matched with his 10 at club level in Flood and then they both looked good alongside Hape and Tindall. Care on the other hand never looked that good for England, but he was used to playing alongside a world class running flyhalf in Nick Evans and not alongside Wilkinson or Flood under a slow MJ gameplan.

Now Farrell is getting better and the whole team has upped their intensity, Care fits in far better and Youngs X factor has gone because he's not the most exciting player in an average unexciting team.

Bingo.

 

[Patchey]

Double Bingo.

 

[Big Ewis]

yeh and you know, about the whole "boring VS flashy" thing, England is looking the most exciting we've (well I've, at least) ever seen them.
What I'm about to say is very strange, I know, but they almost remind me of Pacific Islander sides in intensity, except much much more organized and efficient:
when the last Australia match started, England looked rampant. You'd close your eyes, and bam, open them to see them already within Aussie 22 in a vigorous ruck, forwards piling into it, scrumhalf throwing it back left or right, and repeat, repeat.
But then, they turned boring again against SA, which were themselves fkn boring this November Tour...
And then of course the grand finale with the win over NZ (ill, but still), in which again, those forwards looked INTENSE, and that intensity of course just never left them as they could smell the blood...

They looked as intense again this time around against Scotland to open their 6N.

Also:
where England lack, Ireland in particular has. Ireland's backs look absolutely fkn amazing, I think it's going to be one hell of a Lions side this time around, and tbh, I don't even think it's fair for the Ozzies this summer, but that's horribly off-topic.

 

[Jockstap]

Big wow England you barely managed to beat the worst team in the competition. Normal service will be resumed next week when Ireland f you in the b(if Mike Ross is fit).

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Big wow England you barely managed to beat the worst team in the competition.

Wait, isn't that what you did this afternoon?