England tour of Argentina

[BPM]

Argentina in Argentina against a young English team they will be 1000% up for this.

Would be big for them in terms of support if they get the win.

I really see them whitewashing us.

Undoubtedly that Argentina squad has the ability to beat this England squad, but whether they will when it comes to it is another matter.

Sure our squad being depleted by the Lions call ups gives them a good opportunity to beat us, but I imagine most people would view it as a bit of a hollow triumph. On the other hand, our team should be massively up for it. For a largely second string squad to beat Argentina on their own soil would be a much more significant victory.

Eddie's stated aim for this tour was to unearth 3-4 new players and I think that's 100% achievable. If we lose both games but come away with some new options blooded in the back row and at scrum half, I could take that.

I'm more optimistic though. I think we'll win at least one test and I think we'll come away with several players putting their hands up.

 

[BPM]

Argentina in Argentina against a young English team they will be 1000% up for this.

Would be big for them in terms of support if they get the win.

I really see them whitewashing us.

Undoubtedly that Argentina squad has the ability to beat this England squad, but whether they will when it comes to it is another matter.

Sure our squad being depleted by the Lions call ups gives them a good opportunity to beat us, but I imagine most people would view it as a bit of a hollow triumph. On the other hand, our team should be massively up for it. For a largely second string squad to beat Argentina on their own soil would be a much more significant victory.

Eddie's stated aim for this tour was to unearth 3-4 new players and I think that's 100% achievable. If we lose both games but come away with some new options blooded in the back row and at scrum half, I could take that.

I'm more optimistic though. I think we'll win at least one test and I think we'll come away with several players putting their hands up.k

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Who do people think have a real chance of impressing on this tour? I'd say Underhill and the Currys are the only ones that have a real chance of pushing for a spot in the 1st team, but Genge, Taylor, Williams, Maunder and Earle all have the potential to earmark themselves for Japan.

 

[BPM]

Agree with you there Toby. The 7 shirt is up for grabs and this tour is an amazing opportunity for one of Underhill or the Curry brothers to grab it. I think Eddie planned to experiment anyway but losing Haskell and Wood forces him to be bold.

I agree on your squad contenders too.

I'd add Wilson or Armand to that list. We don't have an obvious back up for Robshaw and even if neither gets much game time, they still have an opportunity to impress Eddie.

I'm not sure what the situation is with Solomona, but if he goes, I think he has the ability to fill the finisher spot Eddie wanted Ashton for.

Clearly an opportunity for someone at 12 too. That just really depends on how we line up and who gets the gig.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Do people think Eddie will change the team much between the two tests?

Honestly watching the England V Barbarians game again just not that impressed by England TBH.

I just really not that confident going into this series.

Cant see Mallinder and Isiekwe really featuring the midfield has to be for me Devoto and Slade and can see Armand being lock sub.

 

[BPM]

We weren't amazing but I thought we looked OK with the odd good moment.

Even if you only added Hartley, Launchbury, Hughes and Slade to that side, it would be immediately improved.

What makes you think Isiekwe won't feature? He's one of only 3 specialist locks and played well enough on Sunday to warrant a place on the bench.

Win or lose, there are valuable opportunities on this tour. For example, Haskell and Wood being unavailable could end up being a massive blessing.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

We weren't amazing but I thought we looked OK with the odd good moment.

Even if you only added Hartley, Launchbury, Hughes and Slade to that side, it would be immediately improved.

What makes you think Isiekwe won't feature? He's one of only 3 specialist locks and played well enough on Sunday to warrant a place on the bench.

Win or lose, there are valuable opportunities on this tour. For example, Haskell and Wood being unavailable could end up being a massive blessing.

I suspect Armand will be the lock sub with a Curry the back row sub.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I suspect Armand will be the lock sub with a Curry the back row sub.

I'm expecting a continuation of the 6/2 split, would be very surprised to see Armand as a lock sub

 

[BPM]

I suspect Armand will be the lock sub with a Curry the back row sub.

Why though? Has he ever played lock?

If Eddie wanted to take another lock, he could have taken Spencer or one of the guys not in the training camp such as Symons or Barrow. Why would he take a guy who is there on the back of his performances as a 6, 7 or 8 be picked to play for England as a lock?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Why though? Has he ever played lock?

If Eddie wanted to take another lock, he could have taken Spencer or one of the guys not in the training camp such as Symons or Barrow. Why would he take a guy who is there on the back of his performances as a 6, 7 or 8 be picked to play for England as a lock?

Think he mostly grew up as a lock and was signed for Chiefs to play there; his transfer to the back row has been relatively recent (Last 3 years or so). I'm hoping to see him there for Chiefs next year with Parling out and Kvesic coming in, as well as Simmonds looking to be a star of the future and us still having Ewers, Salvi, Waldrom and Horstmann in the back row. I do agree though that to take Armand as lock cover when he hasn't played there in a while would be odd. Jones only took 3 locks in the initial squad so he clearly thinks he can get by with Launch, Ewels and Isiekwe.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Do people think Eddie will change the team much between the two tests?

Honestly watching the England V Barbarians game again just not that impressed by England TBH.

I just really not that confident going into this series.

Cant see Mallinder and Isiekwe really featuring the midfield has to be for me Devoto and Slade and can see Armand being lock sub.

To be honest when you look at it, we swapped out most of the squad for uncapped players, many with little prem experience too and brought them together for a short while. The main weakness of England was cohesiveness and to be honest I don't know many teams in the world that could make as many changes as we did for such a short period of time and not suffer the same loss of team chemistry. When you look at it, we didn't have much longer to prepare than the Barbarians with the same lack of team time as them and yet individually many of the young English players matched their far more experienced counterparts.

I think against a fully set and cohesive side England will struggle but towards the end of the Barbarian game, it looked like the players were getting used the the defensive setup and were making it much harder for the babas. I think we need Launchbury and Hartley back in to provide some experience and maybe direct the younger players in defence. My main gripe is May and Brown just do not work together, primarily Brown's fault. He doesn't like May for whatever reason and it shows, as a professional sportsman he should sort it out but he clearly wants to take his personal dislike onto the field.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

My main gripe is May and Brown just do not work together, primarily Brown's fault. He doesn't like May for whatever reason.

Based on what? Have I missed something?

The who's got the most to gain question is interesting especially up front.

We have a good pack, but it's not particularly dominant, aggressive or in your face. Jones likes that kind of character, so may be keeping a very close eye on Genge......a good tour could see him right in the mix for the 2019 1 shirt. There's also at least one flanking position up for grabs; the Currys will have their say, but I think Jones is a big Underhill fan, perhaps partly because he also is aggressive and hits hard.

Also a good opportunity for WIlliams on the TH. Neither Cole nor Sinkler are consistently dominant scrummagers and there should be room on the plane for one.

With Hartley ageing and LCD absent it could be a make or break for Taylor. Don't think George has fully convinced EJ yet.

Behind the scrum, it will be interesting to watch the differing wing styles of Earle, May and Joe C. The one with most to gain is perhaps Devoto who looks a completely different player now and might become the round peg for the 12 hole.

Most to lose: Ford. Through his own performances and possibly those of others - Faz down under and Devoto and maybe even Mallinder in Arg.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I think Earle has a massive opportunity - If Eddie wants to move Tony to FB, then a wing spot opens up.

I get the impression that he'd like as many really, really quick guys in the back three as possible.

 

[Goodey]

If Watson moves to fullback that'd probably be to keep playing Daly on the wing, right?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

If Watson moves to fullback that'd probably be to keep playing Daly on the wing, right?

Hope not. He's not an out and out winger. He either needs to lay claim to the starting 13 or 15 shirt, or remain as a pretty perfect 23 option

 

[Scotty]

Its a shame that one of the only 1st team players we have in a flanker in robshaw...the one position we really want to devlop, with launch there for experience id be temped to have b curry at 6 and underhill at 7 with say t curry on the bench. 2019 RWC draw is done rankings dont matter if we loose just give them game time and get us some proper experience even if its a loss

Same with wing yarde and may arnt getting any better but earle and cockasanga( how ever you spell it) have a chanve to prove them selves 7 is the main one but id develop 6 and 7s giving alot of depth in a previously weak positio.

Anyone else agree? And whats the deal with FB any prospects going on this tour to replace brown?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Rather keep Watson on the wing and have Daly at 15.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Brown doesn't seem to trust may under the high ball, they've collided going for the same ball multiple times.
They also just don't seem to click on attack.

Agree on Daly (hopefully) not being on the wing going forward. His skills shone through on the wing, but his positioning was poor. Obviously it's something that comes with time, but he's not playing there for his club so he'll be learning on the job for England, Which isn't ideal.
I, too, would rather keep Watson on the wing and have Daly at 15. With Beale leaving and JdJ arriving at Wasps hopefully it leaves a spot open at 15 for Daly.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Singleton and JFR replace Schonert and Taylor (both injured).

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

FFS Taylor this was going to be your time to shine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!