England Six Nations thread

[ratsapprentice]

You say that as if we haven't before...?

You know Andy Farrell and Jason Robinson were league converts?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

What makes you think he thinks he's bigger than the team?

Don't get that either - I'm a big league fan and I've not heard anything bad about Sam from anyone who's met him.

France doesn't have that privilege

I dunno, give it a couple more years till he's qualified and Scott Dureau could be France's answer at 10

 

[ratsapprentice]

The only bad thing I've heard about him is his tendency (last season only) to take his role as an "enforcer" to heart a bit too much.
But I'm sure a firm talking to could focus his energies elsewhere.

 

[j'nuh]

England eventually should and likely will draw talent from League. They're "lucky enough", or at an advantage to have a large League pool to pick from. Australia has already benefited from it, Folau the latest big example. He's now on many's World XV's, in Rugby Union. France doesn't have that privilege, and I think since England does they should somehow look to exploit that reality. Surely there are specimens in League that could fit exactly what England wants in Union, in terms of backs for e.g. or more mobile but still powerful forwards like this Sam Burgess guy above in the vid.

I'm not too sure. You might be able to argue that had league never been a thing, union would have been more popular in the North of England and we'd have a larger talent base to draw from.

Australia certainly don't benefit from league. Just think of how much more popular union might be if not for league...

 

[ratsapprentice]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/ru...ed-switch-from-rugby-league-to-join-Bath.html

Quite a bit more detail in there - if true.

 

[j'nuh]

4. Tom Burgess
8. George Burgess
12. Sam Burgess
15. Sam Tomkins

Not sure if that would be good or not.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Don't think Tomkins would be able to translate his talent to Union all that well tbh.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'd love to see "Gorgeous" George in Union - I reckon he'll be better than Sam (arguably is now, just not as...famous?).

Chuck in some more league-ies that are in/around the England set up:

4. Tom Burgess



8. George Burgess

10. George Ford
11. Kyle Eastmond
12. Sam Burgess
13. Joel Tomkins
14. Chris Ashton
15. Sam Tomkins

 

[j'nuh]

Who knows? Eastmond adapting as well as he has came as a surprise to many. I'd be pretty happy if Glos were to sign him.

 

[Peat]

Burgess and Tuilagi in the midfield would certainly put the fear of God into some defences.
You manage to put down Sam and he gets the offload to Manu.

Having thought about this...

Would they partner them? They've express dissatisfaction with Tuilagi's handling skills (through media leaks). Lancaster has said he wants a gainline breaker and a playmaker (he says a lot of things). If Burgess is doing the business, does Manu get the nod if someone like Daly/Joseph/Trinder is in form?

I haven't seen much of Burgess but virtually no player can get away the offload if you double hit him. Play Burgess and Tuilagi together and the defence can play pretty narrow. Put a gasman with a decent pass at 13 and all of a sudden they can't get narrow. Besides, I'd rather have Daly running onto that offload

 

[stus768]

I'm not too sure. You might be able to argue that had league never been a thing, union would have been more popular in the North of England and we'd have a larger talent base to draw from.

Australia certainly don't benefit from league. Just think of how much more popular union might be if not for league...

In the North if there wasn't league they would have had to play football surely? Main reason league came about was so players could be paid. If there was no league players would not have been able to play union as they would not have been able to afford it.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Having thought about this...

Would they partner them? They've express dissatisfaction with Tuilagi's handling skills (through media leaks). Lancaster has said he wants a gainline breaker and a playmaker (he says a lot of things). If Burgess is doing the business, does Manu get the nod if someone like Daly/Joseph/Trinder is in form?

I haven't seen much of Burgess but virtually no player can get away the offload if you double hit him. Play Burgess and Tuilagi together and the defence can play pretty narrow. Put a gasman with a decent pass at 13 and all of a sudden they can't get narrow. Besides, I'd rather have Daly running onto that offload

Agreed on Daly - an alternative, seeing as Lancaster says he sees the centres as "two centres" rather than "inside and outside" is Eastmond. Both being Leaguies their natural instincts in situations might work well together.

 

[Peat]

Wasn't a case of afford as far as I know, as much as they had the money and thought it only right to give it to the players. It's not like working class communities haven't been able to play rugby elsewhere as amateurs.

 

[stus768]

Wasn't a case of afford as far as I know, as much as they had the money and thought it only right to give it to the players. It's not like working class communities haven't been able to play rugby elsewhere as amateurs.

Actually it was. Northern teams had far more working class players who could not afford to take the time off of work to play. Same with other sports.

 

[Big Ewis]

You say that as if we haven't before...?

You know Andy Farrell and Jason Robinson were league converts?

nope didn't know that about Robinson. Makes sense...he's England's most dangerous back I can think of, and it turns out he was League before...I would have thought the current Mike Brown had been, but he hasn't apparently...

I think because of England's (Union) too conservative use of backs in a predominantly forward-aspiring scheme, the backs are just trained to be like Ashton and co. But League allows for that expansive back play obviously, and England can only benefit from picking there, because they're not going to entirely change their customs and back culture in Union...at least they get raw specimens with good athletic ability and running technique.

 

[big ginger 8]

Ehm Ashton is from league...

 

[Big Ewis]

Ehm Ashton is from league...

aaaaaaaaah !!!! My God, you're RIGHT !! Forget everything I've said !

srsly though, how the fk is that dude from League ? He was so bad they decided to dump him into Union ?

 

[stus768]

Just watching the England France game again. Did Nowell make all of his metres from one run he did in loads of space?

 

[ratsapprentice]

Being a league player doesn't make you some sort of rugby god.
Generally they will have better handling skills, and arguably better fitness (compared to backs anyway) - but that's just down to the nature of the game.
It's not like Jason Robinson was a bum in league... he was just as awesome in league.

And it's not like England don't produce dynamic, exciting backs... we do - we just don't ordinarily pick them.
Case in point: Tom Varndell... he's been the Premiership's top try scorer 3 times, and he's only got 4 caps.

Just watching the England France game again. Did Nowell make all of his metres from one run he did in loads of space?

Made a couple of big(ish) runs but he's generally effective at making ground through contact.
I'd say it was probably about half from 2 big runs and half from contact.

 

[Jaguares]

What about George Ford??