England Post-WC discussion

[RedruthRFC]

I just don't think itoje is tall enough for an international lock. We need itoje to come in at 6 but only if he's got a good carrying game as well as everything else.

I kind of think our locks should be lauchberry, Attwood, kruis and then bring in a younger player until lawes learns to do some more basic lock things well.

At 6 try ewers, robshaw, itoje and see how it goes.

Agreed 100% re: Itoje, hopefully EJ will see his future this way make it known that he should be playing his rugby at 6. So far this season, he has started 3 games at 6 and 4 lock - another player who needs his club and international coach to be singing from the same song sheet.

 

[Aristodemus]

I just don't think itoje is tall enough for an international lock. We need itoje to come in at 6 but only if he's got a good carrying game as well as everything else.

I kind of think our locks should be lauchberry, Attwood, kruis and then bring in a younger player until lawes learns to do some more basic lock things well.

At 6 try ewers, robshaw, itoje and see how it goes.

I think he is tall enough myself, and what he brings would benefit the pack as a unit much more. I like the idea of two huge carriers in the backrow, such as Hughes at 6 (it's inevitable now he will play for England) and Binny at 8. This is the reason I would personally favour Itoje being backed at lock, although I wouldn't have any complaints if Sarries decided they see him as a 6 long term. They really need to decide now though.

 

[Mattybuck]

Don't see Itoje at lock, seems a 6 to me and to be honest not got the game at the moment to be picked ahead of the current competitions.

You need one of your locks to be at home in the tight. That's why we need Attwood in there.

 

[Raggs]

In terms of scrummaging strength, and England, following most the chops and changes the order of scrummaging strength is Attwood, Launch, Kruis, Parling, Lawes.

Slater comes somewhere after Launchbury, but we can't say where. Itoje comes somewhere after Kruis, but again, we can't say where.

I'd use Attwood, Kruis and Launchbury, massively physical, all capable of playing a smashing lock role, but equally able to play a bit of rugby when it's on. Itoje in the mix at 6.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I totally agree, it's all about balance.

Attwood wouldn't make any difference adding him to a springbok pack. Add him to an England pack and it helps our weaknesses.

Kvesic seems like the one true hope of all English fans. Personally I think Fraser has played better when I have seen him fit but it depends if he stays fit.

Yup, balance and roles. We need to do a 'Schmidt' and understand our player roles a bit better. I like Courtney Lawes but I'm not convinced he fills a proper role, for example. Big hits isn't a role, it's a luxury

 

[Raggs]

Yup, balance and roles. We need to do a 'Schmidt' and understand our player roles a bit better. I like Courtney Lawes but I'm not convinced he fills a proper role, for example. Big hits isn't a role, it's a luxury

It's a role if he did it twice every game, but as it is, it's more like once every 3-4 games. If he's not doing it regularly, then the rest of the game is more important.

 

[ratsapprentice]

It's a role if he did it twice every game, but as it is, it's more like once every 3-4 games. If he's not doing it regularly, then the rest of the game is more important.

I agree entirely.

 

[Raggs]

Gaskell has apparently put on 10kg since moving to Wasps, looking more powerful whilst still galloping around, could be an outside bet for a senior eps spot, can't see him missing out on the saxons.

 

[Mattybuck]

In terms of scrummaging strength, and England, following most the chops and changes the order of scrummaging strength is Attwood, Launch, Kruis, Parling, Lawes.

Slater comes somewhere after Launchbury, but we can't say where. Itoje comes somewhere after Kruis, but again, we can't say where.

I'd use Attwood, Kruis and Launchbury, massively physical, all capable of playing a smashing lock role, but equally able to play a bit of rugby when it's on. Itoje in the mix at 6.

Yep

Also agree with the following post about knowing our players roles.

Big hits are great to watch, but it's a fine line between sensational hit and 10 mins in the bin. I'd rather my lock make solid tackles and compete for the ball.

I like Lawes but right now I don't think he is an option.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

As a country we have a disgustingly good amount of depth @ lock.

Been slightly disappoint in Symons ATM but that could be because Irish have yet to click.

Then players like Gaskell and Barrow have surprised me this season.

In terms of tight five we should in theory be set for the next near decade.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Been slightly disappoint in Symons ATM but that could be because Irish have yet to click.

Based on what?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Based on what?

Watching him for Irish.

 

[ratsapprentice]

No - on what did you base your expectations?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Super rugby form.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Super rugby form.

Which wasn't much to shout about.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Which wasn't much to shout about.

I thought it was maybe not last season but certainly the season before. considering Fitzgerald who was below him @ Cheifs has looked very good @ Leicester esp in the breakdown.

 

[Peat]

In terms of scrummaging strength, and England, following most the chops and changes the order of scrummaging strength is Attwood, Launch, Kruis, Parling, Lawes.

Slater comes somewhere after Launchbury, but we can't say where. Itoje comes somewhere after Kruis, but again, we can't say where.

I'd use Attwood, Kruis and Launchbury, massively physical, all capable of playing a smashing lock role, but equally able to play a bit of rugby when it's on. Itoje in the mix at 6.

Kruis needs to stop entering rucks so bloody high.

I'd be interested in seeing what Kitchener adds.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

It's a role if he did it twice every game, but as it is, it's more like once every 3-4 games. If he's not doing it regularly, then the rest of the game is more important.

Even it he does it twice a game what role is he playing? His tackles are rarely momentum swingers in the phase of play. He's putting in a big one, legally, but is rarely preventing the player getting the ball away. Preventing him from getting up, perhaps. It's not a role I think should be our priority for a lock forward.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Can we all pick our English form 15 from the premiership but exclude any players from your home club.

Exclude any previous international form (the same way Eddie Jones might).

So as a Saints fan here is my England 15 so far this season. Only from the games I've seen btw.

1 autetac
2 yendal
3 JCW
4 kruis
5 itoje/ Gaskell
6 Haskell
7 Fraser (his little bits of play have been epic)
8 billy ( not many options really)
9 Simpson
10 slade (don't really know where to put him but was brilliant at 10)
11 nowell
12 no English player has impressed here apart from mills at Worcester to be honest
13 Daly
14 Watson/ roko/ wade - can't decide
15 goode (can't believe I'm saying that, but played really well)

 

[NickBD]

10 slade (don't really know where to put him but was brilliant at 10)
11 nowell
12 no English player has impressed here apart from mills at Worcester to be honest
13 Daly
14 Watson/ roko/ wade - can't decide
15 goode (can't believe I'm saying that, but played really well)

If were talking about form this season has to be Farrell to start at 10, I know people won't want to admit it but he's been great for Sarries. He's easily in my opinion been the best 10 this season.