England future management?

[Peat]

Yeah, the player pool bit is concerning me.
We've got a lot of talent in the prem, but how much does White/Jones know about them?

Jones' comments about England in the World Cup seemed to suggest a certain vagueness on the score. White's probably watched scouting footage of Quins at least.

No reason they can't learn quickly enough I guess but there's still probably going to be a bit of trial and error at best.

 

[Colombia]

We have a boat load.

I'm not sure I want Jones. I can see that one going down a pan of recriminations and media storms when instant success isn't coming. I'm not sure he's really going to cotton on too well to our one-note lumps.

I agree, I also think he might not be authoritarian enough. Borthwick & Dal Maso don't seem like the best back-up team either.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I'm not bothered about Jones/Whites knowledge of the player pool as I think it can be learned very quickly - it's a full time job, after all.
In any case because of the limitations to changes he can make under EPS he can basically focus on the Squad initially and then diffuse his attention outwards over time - because realistically he can't make many changs even if he really wanted to.

We can be pretty sure we won't get a coach who has a perceived recent 'failure' on his cv. It'll be a safety net for the RFU if all goes down the pan with the new coach so they can claim to have picked with the evidence on their side.
So for example I think Deans, Mackenzie, etc, are right out because they had disappointing experiences with the Wallabies.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I agree, I also think he might not be authoritarian enough. Borthwick & Dal Maso don't seem like the best back-up team either.

TBH Borthwick and Da Maso have transformed Japan's forward game, imagine that improvement with the talent we have coming up in the pack.

 

[Colombia]

TBH Borthwick and Da Maso have transformed Japan's forward game, imagine that improvement with the talent we have coming up in the pack.

I know, but Japan seemed malleable and amenable I don't have full confidence that it would be quite as easy with the England pack with its constant disruptions. I'd like to be proven wrong though obviously.

 

[j'nuh]

People are forgetting that whoever the head coach is will have assistants that can help fill in the player base knowledge gap at first. Even if none of them know the English game, four people scouting out the Premiership, knowing that most of the best are already in the EPS anyway, and the best of the rest have plenty of media coverage to bring them to the coaches attention... it's not a particularly tough task.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

People are forgetting that whoever the head coach is will have assistants that can help fill in the player base knowledge gap at first. Even if none of them know the English game, four people scouting out the Premiership, knowing that most of the best are already in the EPS anyway, and the best of the rest have plenty of media coverage to bring them to the coaches attention... it's not a particularly tough task.

Very true.
In addition to which there are plenty of crappopotamuses who they can ignore, to all intents and purposes, whilst publically trying to give all players the message that anyone can strive to make the squad.

 

[Crapspray]

People are forgetting that whoever the head coach is will have assistants that can help fill in the player base knowledge gap at first. Even if none of them know the English game, four people scouting out the Premiership, knowing that most of the best are already in the EPS anyway, and the best of the rest have plenty of media coverage to bring them to the coaches attention... it's not a particularly tough task.

This.

Lancaster has usually picked a good 35 and a horrible 23. Any coach worth their salt should be able to pick up on Slade, Ford, and Kvesic being better than the incumbents. They'd probably also be aware of Barritt's limitations at 13 and how to balance a back row. And maybe have some idea what they want their centres/three-quarters to do. And pick back three cover at 23.

Simply looking at the 50-man squad at the start of the summer would give them almost all of the parts. Only Daly and Ewers were notable omissions. Fraser and Simpson due to injury. Pick all 54 in the EPS and Saxons, then clear out 18 or so deadwood/pensioners/weaker players in time for the tournament. Job done.

 

[tsof]

Oh well, there goes Jones then. White it is, presumably?

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/latest-news/24427/eddie-jones-rules-out-england-role/

 

[Crapspray]

Oh well, there goes Jones then. White it is, presumably?

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/latest-news/24427/eddie-jones-rules-out-england-role/

First press conference at his new job. He's hardly going to say "Don't get too familiar; I'll be off as soon as the phone rings." is he? Doesn't look good for any party.

Though I wouldn't put it past the RFU to have not contacted him yet.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

First press conference at his new job. He's hardly going to say "Don't get too familiar; I'll be off as soon as the phone rings." is he? Doesn't look good for any party.

Though I wouldn't put it past the RFU to have not contacted him yet.

Yeh I'm interested in leaving this job for a job I have yet to be offered.

White is really the only person with the mentality to say that TBH.

 

[Colombia]

Yeh I'm interested in leaving this job for a job I have yet to be offered.

White is really the only person with the mentality to say that TBH.

Agreed. In saying that, even if offered the England job, I think Jones puts in at least one season with the Stormers.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Rumour has it that they are wanting a setup of

Head Coach - Cockerill
Forwards - West
Backs - Healey
Breakdown - Back

 

[smartcooky]

People are forgetting that whoever the head coach is will have assistants that can help fill in the player base knowledge gap at first. Even if none of them know the English game, four people scouting out the Premiership, knowing that most of the best are already in the EPS anyway, and the best of the rest have plenty of media coverage to bring them to the coaches attention... it's not a particularly tough task.

So long as they are not the same bunch of useless tw@ts that were Lancaster's assistants then fair enough.

FWIW, before Cheika took on the Wallaby job, he made a list of demands from the ARU which included

1. Being the sole selector of ALL his assistants
2. There was to be NO selection or policy interference from the back-room
3. Access to overseas based players who had 60 or more Wallaby caps (required a change in ARU policy).

The first two are exactly what Steve Hansen has...the NZRU gives the All Blacks' head coach carte blanche on who his assistants are, and who to select in the team. Whoever is going to take on the England job needs to make similar demands otherwise they are going to be hamstrung by the same old farts that kept getting in Lancaster's way.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

One worry I have about Jake White: Is he going to look to poach/bring in foreign players? Follow the Scotland/Ireland model?

I know it's very different at club level, but they were saying on the Quins/Montpellier commentary that he's been putting out sides with as few as 4 French players in the 23, and with up to 11 South Africans.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

One worry I have about Jake White: Is he going to look to poach/bring in foreign players? Follow the Scotland/Ireland model?

I know it's very different at club level, but they were saying on the Quins/Montpellier commentary that he's been putting out sides with as few as 4 French players in the 23, and with up to 11 South Africans.

Doubt it TBH.

He didn't do it with SA.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He's South African, though.

We don't need more Mo Bothas.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

He's South African, though.

We don't need more Mo Bothas.

Did he do it with Brumbies?

Who was the brumbies backs coach at the time? Larkham?

Just wondering who White has previously worked with who he could look to bring should he come.

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

http://exeterchiefs.co.uk/?p=20546

Rob Baxter: Only English coaches should be considered for England job
*coughs meaningfully and takes step forward*

Really not sure of his motivation for that statement.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Mallinder and Diamond both have international experience (....of coaching the Saxons )