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Australia vs England - 3 Tests - June 2016

johnmac99 said:
Underhill has played at 6 to Tipuric's 7 for Ospreys, so shows his versatility.

I don't see why it has to be one or the other for England tbh, there must be room for both him and Kvesic if we are going to play this way, with Jack Clifford making a good three.
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A good 3 players completing the depth that Eddie wants for each position? Or a good 3 in the backrow, dropping our standout player in Vunipola?
 
Most years u20's players will stay with their clubs if they are getting game-time, it's not unusual.

Which is preferable is another matter - although the intensity is probably higher in senior rugby, the quality of experience isn't necessarily better (difficult to quantify, but that's my opinion).

I'd be very happy to the likes of Mallinder, Brophy-Clews and Underhill playing in the JWC - particularly as it's at home... but can understand why they mightn't.
 
Do we pick foreign based players for the u20s?
I know we pick non-eligible but prem-based players (Protheroe) but I can't remember ever seeing a foreign based guy.


I heard Underhill turned down Wales u20s, though.
 
TRF_Olyy said:
Do we pick foreign based players for the u20s? I heard Underhill turned down Wales u20s, though.
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I don't think it's ever been a pertinent issue...

I have no worries about Underhill playing for Wales, I don't see any reason that he should.
 
ratsapprentice said:
Most years u20's players will stay with their clubs if they are getting game-time, it's not unusual.

Which is preferable is another matter - although the intensity is probably higher in senior rugby, the quality of experience isn't necessarily better (difficult to quantify, but that's my opinion).

I'd be very happy to the likes of Mallinder, Brophy-Clews and Underhill playing in the JWC - particularly as it's at home... but can understand why they mightn't.
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Maybe so, but it's good to give them tournament experience at this stage of their careers. Knowing what it's like to play pool games and then knock out rugby in a short space of time; in the under 20s this tournament only lasts 2 and half weeks. This will be invaluable if any of them make it to the Senior team when they play in proper RWC and have to play 7 games in 6 weeks.
 
That's what I was saying - the experience of a handful of PRO12 games isn't worth the experience of a successful JWC.
 
ratsapprentice said:
That's what I was saying - the experience of a handful of PRO12 games isn't worth the experience of a successful JWC.
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It's certainly very different. What I am saying is if they are fit they should play in the junior RWC. There should be no question of them staying with their clubs, injury permitting. Junior RWC starts on June 7, so Pro 12 and Aviva will have finished by then. In fact, I think Underhill would be better served playing in it than being picked for seniors or a potential Saxons tour, even if "exceptional circumstance" is exercised and agreed in his case.
 
A lot of folks talking about how the lads will have played too much rugby by the time the series comes round and that star players should be rested and others allowed a chance to play some top level test matches. I agree with the principle but let's not forget that the draw for the 2019 World Cup is at the end of this year and we have only just got into the top 4. We need to keep winning games to have any chance of being seeded and avoiding another pool of death, so I'm afraid we are going to have to throw everything at it and get up those rankings. If by some miracle we manage a 3 series win then we might even drag ourselves up to 2nd (although I must confess the whole world rankings points system confusing the bejesus out of me).

I agree that the modern player is up against a lot, but they are also looked after and prepared much better, allowing to take on more work load. This is also why Jones has stated that he wants three quality players in every position and that its all about the 23 on the day, not just the starting 15. He clearly wants to cultivate lots of strength in depth and, given the pretty punishing scheduling of the modern game, that seems very sensible.

Really looking forward to what the boys can do down under and to see if they can take the next big step up in their performance.
 
Maverick1987 said:
Looks as though Kruis has been cited for biting Davey Wilson in retaliation to being gouged . Anyone got video footage ?

http://www.skysports.com/share/10230278
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It's a bit odd as I thought there were two separate incidents of eye gouging (hand to face) within the same maul at the same time. They showed the incident several times after it didn't see Kruis but Wilson is pretty guilty. Although I don't think there was any intent.
 
ncurd said:
It's a bit odd as I thought there were two separate incidents of eye gouging (hand to face) within the same maul at the same time. They showed the incident several times after it didn't see Kruis but Wilson is pretty guilty. Although I don't think there was any intent.
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Maybe I've misread it . I haven't seen the game at all . Only read this article
 
All 3 incidents happened in the same maul.
Davey is bang to rights with fingers around the eye.
Kelly Brown had his fingers in Attwood's face - but not particularly around the eye - looked like he was trying to grab the scrum-cap whilst unsighted. This doesn't appear to have been cited.
Davey apparently (I missed it at the time, and haven't gone back) reported Kruis to the ref at the time for the bite - it's thought that his hand to Kruis' eye was the retaliation. Davey was certainly mighty pissed off with Kruis in the immediate aftermath. Bear in mind that it's kinda understandable that the Bath fansite would end up with "Davey was just defending himself"; whilst the Sarries fansite would come up with "Kruis was just defending himself".
 
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Honestly regardless of who did what first eye gouging and biting are hardly defending oneself. Both if guilty don't deserve leniency for what the other did. That's the argument of a child.

Admittedly though if one lamped the other afterwards I'd probably say it was fine.

I'm surprised Brown wasn't even citied ala Ashton or Francis fair enough if common sense prevailed at the hearing but it was the incident I noticed first on the replay, and thought it was pretty bad, Wilson was worse though.

I'm equally the ref/TMO did nothing on replay. Yet sent Watson off....
 
Kelly Brown's done nothing wrong there (I'm pretty sure he's been cited for potential eye gouge, but he's grabbed Attwood's scrum cap - at most it's a retrospective yellow card, but even that's a stretch),
Kruis has done nothing wrong,
Wilson has (accidentally) eye raked and then looks like he punched him - he'll be gone for a while.
 
TRF_Olyy said:
Kruis has done nothing wrong,
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Seems pretty clear from the video that either Kruis has done something wrong, or a poltergeist has done something to Wilson.
Clearly very ****** off about something.

Brown definitely done nothing though.
 
Is there an outcome of the Kruis and Wilson hearing? I read a ESPN article that stated the hearing was today.

I know the Marler one was the high profile case today taking the headlines. But from a purely England Rugby tour to Australia point of view, the potential minimum 10 weeks for both of these citations could be problematic.
 

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