A great big Munster thread

[Feicarsinn]

Wrong way to look Feic. These guys have played majority of AIL and Con don't have sufficient back up in their squad and made a request. We accepted as we felt guys deserved to play in a Semi Final of a competition they've tried to win all season it means to them what a Heineken Cup mean to experienced players in provinces. Imagine taking BOD or Cullen out of Toulouse game because that's what it'd feel like for these guys

Not good enough. Nagle is a future international, his development is more important than Cork Con's season. The fact is he should have been involved more earlier in the season, the fact that he wasn't doesn't mean that he shouldn't be now. Conservative, parochial selection policy.

 

[munstermuffin]

True but the lad preferred to play in AIL semifinal and realistically this is his last chance of AIL medal so I think the right decision was made.

 

[monkeypigeon]

Wrong way to look Feic. These guys have played majority of AIL and Con don't have sufficient back up in their squad and made a request. We accepted as we felt guys deserved to play in a Semi Final of a competition they've tried to win all season it means to them what a Heineken Cup mean to experienced players in provinces. Imagine taking BOD or Cullen out of Toulouse game because that's what it'd feel like for these guys

I generally get annoyed about such things, but I suppose there is some sense to this. So long as whoever's left gets a go. I'm looking at at least one of O'Donnell and Butler to start.

Thanks for the answer MM.

 

[munstermuffin]

I'm hoping O'Donnell gets a go at 7 as Wallace needs a break and Ronan isnt at races. Paddy Butler isn't ready for a start but maybe off the bench. I'd maybe consider Archer or Hurley along with Sherry to get a start too. All going well in training and just to rest some guys but also freshen up team. We need to also try get a partnership in centre and stop mixing and matching

 

[munstermuffin]

Paul O'Connell will play in Amlin final should Munster get there. Expected back in 4/5 weeks. Has slight chip on bones, sprained ligaments and severe bruising but couldve been alot worst

 

[monkeypigeon]

Munster: P Warwick; S Zebo, J Murphy, L Mafi, D Barnes; D Cusack, P Stringer; M Horan, M Sherry, S Archer; D Ryan, M O'Driscoll T O'Donnell, N Ronan, D Leamy capt. Replacements: D Fogarty, D Hurley, J Hayes, A Quinlan, P Butler, D Williams, S Tuitupou, S Deasy.

A few guys getting a go in this match. Looking for a big game from Zebo and O'Donnell of they want to play a part in the play-off matches and Amlin matches.

If Scarlets can't beat that team though then they're silly coots.

 

[Groundhog]

im glad some younger players are getting a chance

 

[munstermuffin]

Osulli mi. That was team for last week

 

[monkeypigeon]

And this is the team for this week.

Munster: F Jones; D Howlett, L Mafi, P Warwick, K Earls; R O'Gara capt, C Murray; M Horan, D Varley, J Hayes; I Nagle, D O'Callaghan; D Ryan, D Wallace, J Coughlan. Replacements: M Sherry, W du Preez, T Buckley, T O'Donnell, N Ronan, P Stringer, D Barnes, S Zebo.

Finally, a mix of youth and experience. Jones, Murray and Nagle all start with Sherry, Zebo, Barnes and O'Donnell all on the bench. You can see about 5 of them featuring regularly next season. Good stuf. I still think that one of O'Mahony, O'Donnell or Butler should be starting each week. But this is probably the best mixture I've seen in a while.

Will be interesting to see how they manage against a what will be a very strong Ospreys team...

 

[munstermuffin]

Paulie seems to be winning battle to be fit for Saturday. Has trained fully last 2 days and management seem keen to use him but may decide to ease him back against Connacht but either way it's looking positive.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Pilfered from the Munster v Quins thread:

How about popping over to the Munster thread and suggesting what player you think need to be retired, let go and promoted.

While not directed at me, I'll give my opinion on it anyway. Some of the below have been confirmed already.

Retirements: Alan Quinlan, Ian Dowling, John Hayes
Let Go: Sam Tuitopou, Paul Warwick, Tony Buckley, Dave Ryan, Peter Borlase, Scott Deasy, Denis Fogarty, Tom Gleeson, Billy Holland, Barry Murphy, Niall Ronan, Duncan Williams
Promoted from academy: JJ Hanrahan, Conor Murray, Mike Sherry, Simon Zebo

Munster's squad has 45 players at present before you count academy players. Make the changes I've suggested above and that number is reduced to 34. It's a good base from which to start. Add in the confirmed signings of Ian Keatley and BJ Botha and you're looking at a decent squad but depth is needed in certain areas.

Munster still lack fullback cover, tighthead prop cover, a starting centre and a dynamic backrow. Culling Tuitupou, Warwick and Borlase would give Munster options when it comes to getting in a project fullback and a high class NIQ centre and backrow. John Andress mightn't be a bad Irish qualified shout to spell for BJ Botha.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

They should also let mcgahan go. I think if they had Schmidt or kidney coaching them they'd be playin the saints today they have the players anyway

 

[munstermuffin]

Pilfered from the Munster v Quins thread:

While not directed at me, I'll give my opinion on it anyway. Some of the below have been confirmed already.

Retirements: Alan Quinlan, Ian Dowling, John Hayes
Let Go: Sam Tuitopou, Paul Warwick, Tony Buckley, Dave Ryan, Peter Borlase, Scott Deasy, Denis Fogarty, Tom Gleeson, Billy Holland, Barry Murphy, Niall Ronan, Duncan Williams
Promoted from academy: JJ Hanrahan, Conor Murray, Mike Sherry, Simon Zebo

Munster's squad has 45 players at present before you count academy players. Make the changes I've suggested above and that number is reduced to 34. It's a good base from which to start. Add in the confirmed signings of Ian Keatley and BJ Botha and you're looking at a decent squad but depth is needed in certain areas.

Munster still lack fullback cover, tighthead prop cover, a starting centre and a dynamic backrow. Culling Tuitupou, Warwick and Borlase would give Munster options when it comes to getting in a project fullback and a high class NIQ centre and backrow. John Andress mightn't be a bad Irish qualified shout to spell for BJ Botha.

Don't know how to move from 1 thread to another but views are on Munster Quins Amlin page. And Snoop my fear is Botha spends as much time on recovery table as field so I worry.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

They should also let mcgahan go.

Absolutely not. How many forward passes, missed tackles and inept kicks did McGahan put in yesterday? The players should carry the can for yesterday's defeat. The game plan, despite the tripe spouted on MF.com, wasn't wrong. Munster had plenty of chances to beat Harlequins but weren't accurate enough in executing the coach's game plan. If O'Gara doesn't kick away in the 22, if Tuitupou knew how to pass, if Warwick didn't miss a straighforward tackle and if Jones looked for support runners, Munster could have won by 10+ points despite not being at their best.

McGahan took over an old team with no quality backup. He's still reliant on Wallace, O'Gara, Howlett and O'Callaghan for example despite none being as good as they were even three seasons ago. While having to rebuild the squad, he was also expected to win every competition he entered. I believe Munster have had a decent season and they still have a shot to win the Magners League- a bigger competition than the Amlin Cup if we're honest. Next season will be tough too but if the coach bloods O'Mahony, Butler and Hanrahan in 2011/12 as he's blooded Murray, Nagle, Zebo and Sherry in 2010/11, Munster will be primed to mount a challenge on all fronts again come the 2012/13 season.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

And Snoop my fear is Botha spends as much time on recovery table as field so I worry.

He does, which is why they need a solid backup. Borlase isn't going to cut it and I don't rate Archer either. Andress could do an okay job, as could Cronin at Ulster or Shawe at Leinster.

 

[munstermuffin]

He does, which is why they need a solid backup. Borlase isn't going to cut it and I don't rate Archer either. Andress could do an okay job, as could Cronin at Ulster or Shawe at Leinster.

Agree 100% but see we don't have options as I said in my piece we do have players coming through in front row but problem is and it pains me to say it there is politics between Cork and Limerick and that is a stumbling block.
For instance the last 2 times Young Munster have played Cork Con the Con front row has been destroyed ( Hurley, Fogarty, Archer) by (Flaherty Slattery Cotter) so that in itself explain a good bit.

 

[lucky number 7]

Niall Ronan released? I think he is a pretty good Magners league player to be fair

 

[munstermuffin]

Niall Ronan released? I think he is a pretty good Magners league player to be fair

Yes but plenty others can be good ML players and be European standard players - Munster isn't a nursery it is a team with big hopes and expectations and we have to start thinking like that.
In an ideal world I'd like us to raid Connacht for Muldoon too as I think he can be a big player for us and is the type of player we need or maybe loan Ruddock/ D.Ryan for a year although that wont happen as Leinster will need them due to World Cup absentees.

 

[profitius]

To go would be Borlaise, Buckley, Fogarty, Dave Ryan, Warwick, Tuitupou, N. Ronan, Barry Murphy, Tom Gleeson, WDP.
Retire: Hayes, Quinlan and Horan. Horan seems to have lost his dynamism.
In limbo and/or squad players: Holland, Deasy, Donn Ryan, Williams, Dave Foley, Johne Murphy

Try out some new props from the AIL. Like MM I saw the Young Munster front row destroy Cork Cons the other week. I'd bet Cotter is better than Borlaise. Theres also talk about John Ryan of UCC and Christy Condon getting development contracts. Sherry has a chance to become Munsters number one hooker. I've always thought Varley is average overall. But of course if/when Flannery comes back he'll be the number 1.

The young players has given Munster a bit of spark lately so why not continue bringing more through. O'Mahony in particular looks a good prospect. Nagle and Butler will have to bulk up but they're both excellent players. Dave O'Callaghan in the academy is a big unit who can play lock or backrow. Its ok having experienced players playing but too many of them begins to seriously weaken the team.

Zebo and Barnes in the backline are good players to have. Dineen looks decent too and looks to have a brain which is something you always look for. JJ Hanrahan is also coming along and he'll be playing for Ireland. It might be a year too early for him but he was MOTM (imo) against England in the U20's when Ireland were struggling to get any ball. I see Mafi as only a squad player but a handy one at that but by getting rid of some of the average NIQs they could sign top class NIQs.

Overall this Munster team are past it but theres still plenty of mileage on the clock for POC, DOC and ROG, Wallace is still going strong although need to be used less. Its time for McGahan to make some hard decisions.

 

[munstermuffin]

To go would be Borlaise, Buckley, Fogarty, Dave Ryan, Warwick, Tuitupou, N. Ronan, Barry Murphy, Tom Gleeson, WDP.
Retire: Hayes, Quinlan and Horan. Horan seems to have lost his dynamism.
In limbo and/or squad players: Holland, Deasy, Donn Ryan, Williams, Dave Foley, Johne Murphy

Try out some new props from the AIL. Like MM I saw the Young Munster front row destroy Cork Cons the other week. I'd bet Cotter is better than Borlaise. Theres also talk about John Ryan of UCC and Christy Condon getting development contracts. Sherry has a chance to become Munsters number one hooker. I've always thought Varley is average overall. But of course if/when Flannery comes back he'll be the number 1.

The young players has given Munster a bit of spark lately so why not continue bringing more through. O'Mahony in particular looks a good prospect. Nagle and Butler will have to bulk up but they're both excellent players. Dave O'Callaghan in the academy is a big unit who can play lock or backrow. Its ok having experienced players playing but too many of them begins to seriously weaken the team.

Zebo and Barnes in the backline are good players to have. Dineen looks decent too and looks to have a brain which is something you always look for. JJ Hanrahan is also coming along and he'll be playing for Ireland. It might be a year too early for him but he was MOTM (imo) against England in the U20's when Ireland were struggling to get any ball. I see Mafi as only a squad player but a handy one at that but by getting rid of some of the average NIQs they could sign top class NIQs.

Overall this Munster team are past it but theres still plenty of mileage on the clock for POC, DOC and ROG, Wallace is still going strong although need to be used less. Its time for McGahan to make some hard decisions.

Thing is there is politics involved when it comes to academy etc.
I think Billy Holland has done well this season when playing but if we can ship a few to Connacht and well I'd love to sign another Irish backrow (Muldoon) and up the quality.
I'd get rid of Mafi and free another NIQ spot, relieve Borlaise and get AIL players to test themselves as backup for Botha, A NIQ 12 and backrow and maybe a project player backrow or Centre along with a good Irish back row.

We have few young Irish backrows and Liam Og Murphy will be in academy next year. He isn't a fast 7 but a hard hitting guy who can make big difference. He was superb for Young Munster all season and could be going to World Cup with USA although I understand it bit of politics there too and captain of Trinity is ahead of him even though EOS loves him.