[2023 Six Nations] England v France 11 March 2023. Kickoff 16:45

[Zed]

I don't know what's going on with them. They have a great team on paper. The spotlight needs to be taken off Marcus Smith. He's a great player surrounded by mediocre players. The 9 for England at the weekend was poor, his passing was slow and laboured and he seemed ponderous, taking time and space away from Smith. The backrow seemed to struggle too, and I wasn't very impressed with Dombrandt(?). He looked out of his depth, again making life difficult for Smith.

The way I see it is, if you have a player that is carving up at club level, but not at international level, then maybe look beyond the player. Perhaps look at the players that play inside and outside of him, look at the coaches, their game plan, strategy etc. If Smith isn't "performing" then perhaps it's Borthwick that's the problem.

 

[AlRums]

Not sure if it's been posted yet but I just saw a stat saying that France were only in England's 22 for 1 minute and 51 seconds throughout the whole game. And scored 7 tries. Crazy.

They were just passing through

 

[Lé Ddanno]

When are you planning on putting a minute-by-minute up?

Yeah this

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

 

[Bada-Bing!]

George apologises to England fans after record defeat

Jamie George apologises to England fans after their 53-10 defeat by France and said he would be "gutted" to watch a performance like that at Twickenham.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Zed]

Borthwick needs the boot. Or he needs to completely overhaul his perception of how a team should play rugby. They can come good for the WC, but this requires something more than a few tweaks.

 

[ncurd]

Borthwick needs the boot. Or he needs to completely overhaul his perception of how a team should play rugby. They can come good for the WC, but this requires something more than a few tweaks.

You'd sack a manager after 4 matches, who inherited a failing team after they got stuffed by one of the best teams playing right now?

I don't think Borthers is the right choice but he has to be given some time.

 

[retired9]

As a casual observer from the North North looking in, England hada decent starting 15 IMO they initially looked a lot better than I had previously seen. There is a bit of a mismatch in tactics and the skills, Smith is of the Russel mould and in Scotland we have are now beginning to see the best of Russel because of a class 12 outside him in Tuipolotu.

And then there is Farrel, it seemed to be less than a minute of him coming on than England scored... when he was out injured a year or two ago England looked awful. He must bring some kind of direction to the play and boss players about because there is always a difference when he comes on.

The problem is you need a 12 that can play with Smith, but also lead like Farrel. Or, you have Farrel at 10 (where he should be IMO) and find a different 12 option. Could Smith be a 12 if he bulked up a bit more?

Its horses for courses but as said by others, Smith/Farrell together doesn't really seem to work, Smith can't be creative effectively and Farrell is in the wrong position.

Mitchell looked a better delivery at 9 when he came on, England just have to develop a style of play that works for them and who they have available. Smith needs the right people outside him otherwise it's pointless.

 

[Welsh Exile]

So I've finally got round to watching this and while England obviously got their pants pulled down it actually wasn't as bad as I was expecting. 20mins in and it was only 10-0. Not a great start obviously and when you got to 25mins in it was 17-3 I believe which is a different ball game. Still, there was that moment England should've scored to make it 27-17 which while o do t think would've made England go onto win it would've been interesting to see how it planned out had you scored then.

I'll be happy if we're only 10 points down after 20 mins in Paris.

 

[TSPopinjay]

Smith exposed as the fraud we knew he was.

 

[Jakedood]

It almost seems as if the French squad are determined to get Faltea the start... could be missing 4 tightheads for the game vs Wales

 

[Geordie]

As a casual observer from the North North looking in, England hada decent starting 15 IMO they initially looked a lot better than I had previously seen. There is a bit of a mismatch in tactics and the skills, Smith is of the Russel mould and in Scotland we have are now beginning to see the best of Russel because of a class 12 outside him in Tuipolotu.

And then there is Farrel, it seemed to be less than a minute of him coming on than England scored... when he was out injured a year or two ago England looked awful. He must bring some kind of direction to the play and boss players about because there is always a difference when he comes on.

The problem is you need a 12 that can play with Smith, but also lead like Farrel. Or, you have Farrel at 10 (where he should be IMO) and find a different 12 option. Could Smith be a 12 if he bulked up a bit more?

Its horses for courses but as said by others, Smith/Farrell together doesn't really seem to work, Smith can't be creative effectively and Farrell is in the wrong position.

Mitchell looked a better delivery at 9 when he came on, England just have to develop a style of play that works for them and who they have available. Smith needs the right people outside him otherwise it's pointless.

We have Dan Kelly who would have been the 12 but for injury. We have 6'4 Olly Hartley coming through who is now pushing a starting spot with Saracens...so he'll come on very quickly. Hes very skilled ASWELL as being a unit who'll bulk up aswell.

Post world cup i have no worries at all about most positions...its getting through the world cup that will be the challenge for Borthwick. We wont come close to winning it but we can surely give some of the ***le favorites a proper go!!

 

[General Melchett]

As a casual observer from the North North looking in, England hada decent starting 15 IMO they initially looked a lot better than I had previously seen. There is a bit of a mismatch in tactics and the skills, Smith is of the Russel mould and in Scotland we have are now beginning to see the best of Russel because of a class 12 outside him in Tuipolotu.

And then there is Farrel, it seemed to be less than a minute of him coming on than England scored... when he was out injured a year or two ago England looked awful. He must bring some kind of direction to the play and boss players about because there is always a difference when he comes on.

The problem is you need a 12 that can play with Smith, but also lead like Farrel. Or, you have Farrel at 10 (where he should be IMO) and find a different 12 option. Could Smith be a 12 if he bulked up a bit more?

Its horses for courses but as said by others, Smith/Farrell together doesn't really seem to work, Smith can't be creative effectively and Farrell is in the wrong position.

Mitchell looked a better delivery at 9 when he came on, England just have to develop a style of play that works for them and who they have available. Smith needs the right people outside him otherwise it's pointless.

I also think England have a real lack of direction coming from 9. When Scotland play you often hear Ali Price or Ben White screaming at the forwards where to position themselves at rucks with Russell screaming at the SH when it's on. It just feels a bit rudderless at 9/10 for England but that doesn't excuse the forwards who were mostly poor at doing the basics against France.

 

[Zed]

Smith exposed as the fraud we knew he was.

shockbait

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

I also think England have a real lack of direction coming from 9. When Scotland play you often hear Ali Price or Ben White screaming at the forwards where to position themselves at rucks with Russell screaming at the SH when it's on. It just feels a bit rudderless at 9/10 for England but that doesn't excuse the forwards who were mostly poor at doing the basics against France.

Mad that they should both be playing for England

 

[General Melchett]

Mad that they should both be playing for England

Price has been at Glasgow for years but White slipped through the net and that was on Eddie who was too busy trying to get Youngs up to 500 caps.

 

[retired9]

Price has been at Glasgow for years but White slipped through the net and that was on Eddie who was too busy trying to get Youngs up to 500 caps.

White has been pretty decent this 6N I've been impressed, his pace is excellent.

 

[BrokenWing]

So I've finally got round to watching this and while England obviously got their pants pulled down it actually wasn't as bad as I was expecting. 20mins in and I realised I'd been watching the opening scene of Saving Private Ryan.

FIFY.

 

[Scotty]

Smith exposed as the fraud we knew he was.

Fraud? Explain or are you a troll?, because thats a stupid idiotic thing to refer to him as even if you dont think he's a good player.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Price has been at Glasgow for years but White slipped through the net and that was on Eddie who was too busy trying to get Youngs up to 500 caps.

Yeah idc, it's just a funny joke I like to make about how none of the Scotland squad are actually scottish.

Like literally none of them