2021 British & Irish Lions Squad

[Welsh Exile]

Call it Xenophobic if you want, but I won't be. I'm inferring bitterness with a former employer and said former employers employees, not a hatred of an entire nation, which I absolutely do not think Gatland has in him.

Again, I think its fair that there's a shootout between Biggar and Farrell, but if one of them goes down someone has to come into a test 23, so would you rather 1 cap Smith who plays a different style of game and is a complete unknown quantity or Sexton in there? I know you've said should injury to Faz of Biggar happen Sexton would likely be called up and jettisoned in ahead of Smith, but why not have the guy more likely to play a test in camp right now, rather than...... I guess developing Marcus Smith? Why is that now a function of the Lions? The big issue I take with Gatland's comments around Sexton are that the reasons given, aka durablity do not hold water now with only 5 games to play, in which Sexton is likely to feature sparingly anyway. Meanwhile AWJ is likely to be brought back in after a shoulder dislocation which can have a pretty high re injury risk for 12 weeks after the initial incident. I am not trying to infer that AWJ will be let back on the tour if not fully fit, but Sexton who is currently fit being counted out for durability issues stinks to high heaven for me.

But his former employer is a sporting governing body that represents an entire country so a bit different, no?

And it doesn't stop there. The argument is that he's hates that organisation so much (again, an organisation that represents a country) that he discriminates against players of that nationality. What do you call that. Maybe we can both agree on prejudice? He's prejudiced against Irish people?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

They'd need to quarantine, wouldn't they?
Sexton has been in the Ireland camp's bubble, despite not playing - now they're free to go and get coughed on in the post office etc. (and aren't getting regular PCR tests)

I know that the reservers were asked to keep themselves isolated and available, but isolated at home is different to a strict team bubble, I'd say - especially with cases on the up worldwide again. I can't imagine them taking a risk on it

From what I heard Sexton was in camp to keep himself in a bubble in case of Lions call up (Well part of the reason). Now my source may be wrong on that but for me it makes sense.
So therefore more likely he was still in the bubble.
Although now obviously no point really.

 

[big ginger 8]

It's a joke. Considering the amount of vitriol that is aimed at Gatland from all nations and towards players like AWJ I don't think it's that bad. It is true as well. But I'll apologise if it makes you all feel better.

You're doing it to try and get a rise out the Irish posters you're arguing with, it has no relevance to the actual argument. I don't agree with the lads that Gatland is systemically anti-Irish (although I think he definitely has beef with Sexton) but it's part of their argument so of course they're going to talk about it. Although some of the stuff they're saying about Gatland is quite offensive to him personally they're not trying to get a rise out of you or anyone who would actually read this thread.

Before your childish comment what vitriol has been aimed at AWJ other than saying that the way Gatland has dealt with his situation in comparison with Sexton's may point to some hypocrisy? He does get a good bit on this forum but it's not really from the Irish contingent as much and it wasn't happening in relation to this argument.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

From what I heard Sexton was in camp to keep himself in a bubble in case of Lions call up (Well part of the reason). Now my source may be wrong on that but for me it makes sense.
So therefore more likely he was still in the bubble.

Ah, yeah - I meant going forward from now (i.e. WE was saying he's first on the list if Biggar/Farrell goes down injured, but it's not like he could fly in and play the next day)

The Ireland bubble is done now as their season is over - so he's just isolating at home now (which I image they'd have to treat differently to being in a camp's bubble)

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I hope Johnny's not isolating for it anymore. At some point you have to tell them to **** off, that point is being picked behind Smith.

Anyway, done with all this, I honestly can't believe some of the opinions and it comes across as an inability to see the wider picture to me but I have to respect them from posters I do respect, @Welsh Exile and @dullonien, and agree to [strongly] disagree.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

My take on the whole situation is the Smith is more similar to Russell than Sexton is and that was all there was to the decision.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Sorry I did respond to you @big ginger 8 but think I'll leave it there. Apologies for the comment and love to all.

 

[ncurd]

My take on the whole situation is the Smith is more similar to Russell than Sexton is and that was all there was to the decision.

Its certainly the outward justification but I still don't buy it unless it was a very flippant decision.

Russell is unlikely to start the tests, he's unlikely to even be on the bench. I don't think this a particularly controversial assertion, especially as 4 years ago both Ford and Russell were not there and we were reliant on 'similar' players in Biggar, Farrell and Sexton. So having a diffrent player wasn't an issue in the past why is it now.

Plus I don't know how any conversation where Smith's sheer inexperience against Sexton doesn't come up and how you even begin to justify it. There's no evidence Smith can do it at international level what he does at domestic it become a massive gamble. Then you factor in your starting players can both get postive COVID tests so you have to play the inexperienced guy with no cover.

So whilst that might be the justification when you factor in all the other side conversation you should be having it becomes baffling it was a good enough justification.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Anyway, press conference delayed until 12:45 so let's all join hands hands and pray for AWJ to get a clean bill of health. Now if that isn't something to unite us all I don't know what is.

 

[General Melchett]

Ok so we're all agreed that Gatland is a fat brick.

The scenes on this thread if Biggar or Farrell get injured and Sheedy or Hastings get called up.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Ok so we're all agreed that Gatland is a fat brick.

The scenes on this thread if Biggar or Farrell get injured and Sheedy or Hastings get called up.

Now if that happens I will be fully behind my Irish brothers.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

So I was looking at images coming out of South Africa last night and saw this

Gatland is going too far now

 

[anderton46]

You could make exactly the same argument for AWJ who almost certainly isn't fully fit.

My argument was actually quite the opposite to that though. So I'm confused. I said full fitness is irrelevant, form and ability is more important. Loads of rugby players carry ****les and injuries into games. There's probably a very low % who are genuinely perfectly fine.

 

[ncurd]

My argument was actually quite the opposite to that though. So I'm confused. I said full fitness is irrelevant, form and ability is more important. Loads of rugby players carry ****les and injuries into games. There's probably a very low % who are genuinely perfectly fine.

Yup an on form and ability AWJ is nowhere near where he was in the past, I know for Welsh fans its hard to see as he's your one good lock.

 

[anderton46]

Yup an on form and ability AWJ is nowhere near where he was in the past, I know for Welsh fans its hard to see as he's your one good lock.

And Sexton is at the same level as he was in the past? What argument are you trying to make. All very odd. We were very much talking about Sexton. But ok.

 

[BiggusLaddus]

AWJ...
...one good lock.

But Adam Beard and Cory Hill are both B&I Lions...

 

[ncurd]

And Sexton is at the same level as he was in the past? What argument are you trying to make. All very odd. We were very much talking about Sexton. But ok.

The point is if the argument is AWJ should be starting with one arm who has isn't as good as he once was why is that a mark against Sexton even being called up?

 

[AlRums]

AWJ doesn't have to be fully fit as we saw in 2019 when we thrashed Ireland in the GS game. AWJ done his knee ligaments in that game really early on and still played the rest of the game. Oh, and did I mention we thrashed Ireland that day with an AWJ with 1 knee.

You were playing 14 men at the time

 

[anderton46]

The point is if the argument is AWJ should be starting with one arm who has isn't as good as he once was why is that a mark against Sexton even being called up?

I presume because they play different positions? Your angle is ludicrous. Maybe Gats sees him as a great leader and doesn't actually expect him to start but wants him around the environment?

Sexton meanwhile, is a 10, and there are better options who haven't been as injury prone and out of form as him. Stop your babbling lol

 

[ncurd]

I presume because they play different positions? Your angle is ludicrous. Maybe Gats sees him as a great leader and doesn't actually expect him to start but wants him around the environment?

Sexton meanwhile, is a 10, and there are better options who haven't been as injury prone and out of form as him. Stop your babbling lol

If Gats wanted him in the environment why didn't AWJ travel to SA in the first place?

Your second sentence is complete nonsense, Sexton isn't as good as he once was but the idea any of fly-halves that were taken were clearly better is ludicrous.