[2020 Six Nations] France vs England (02/02/20)

[Vieux Talonneur]

What I would like to see out of that squad I guess:

Genge
George
Sinks
Kruis
Itoje
Curry
Underhill
Ludlam
Heinz
Faz
May
Manu
JJ
Thorley
Watson

Mako
LCD
Stuart
Ewels
Lawes
Youngs
Devoto
Daly

Genge needs minutes, with the WC over theres not point sitting him behind Marler and we know what Mako can do.
Big call playing Stuart for the opener but with no Williams in the squad its sink or swim, I imagine Sinks will play 60+ mins.
Kruis is off to Japan so I would tend to put Lawes in starting but then there is no one at all who can cover backrow on the bench.
Ludlam has a little experience playing 8, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the rumours about Curry at 8 be true.
Heinz>Youngs
No Ford because if you are bringing in new backs then completely swapping your play-maker system halfway through it just makes things messier.
I want to see Devoto come on for Manu at some point.
Watson at fullback because you just would if you could - but it won't happen.

Watson's not in the squad....

 

[Roady26]

Oh I missed that, 11.) May 14.) Thorley 15.) Daly 23.) Furbank?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I've never felt less enthused about a 6N tbh. Start of a RWC cycle should be looking to the future.

"Who's gonna take over from youngs? Ah, a 42yr old kiwi. Ok."
"Right Binny is injured let's have a look at our depth at 8. Ah, ok, we'll play an openside there instead. With a lock at 6, despite our backrow having probably the best depth it's ever had."
Let's not bother looking at fullback either, just shoehorn someone in who is provably bad at the fundamentals of the position at both club and international level.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Besides potentially moving Curry to 8, I cannot understand Jones' obsession with locks at 6. It isn't even marginal, it's a proven failure. Every team that has tried it has failed. It is passable at club level but simply does not work at international level. At the start of his tenure we were struggling for good flankers but we now have an abundance of young and highly skilled ones available, with Curry and Underhill already being proven as a strong combo and with years ahead of them. Why **** around with that when the difference between our flankers in 2018 vs 2019 was like night and day. Get a combo that instantly clicks and gets people talking about potential world class talent and comparing to Hill and Back and then straight away try to bugger it up with the biggest back row failure in recent years for England.

 

[Roady26]

Besides potentially moving Curry to 8, I cannot understand Jones' obsession with locks at 6. It isn't even marginal, it's a proven failure. Every team that has tried it has failed. It is passable at club level but simply does not work at international level. At the start of his tenure we were struggling for good flankers but we now have an abundance of young and highly skilled ones available, with Curry and Underhill already being proven as a strong combo and with years ahead of them. Why **** around with that when the difference between our flankers in 2018 vs 2019 was like night and day. Get a combo that instantly clicks and gets people talking about potential world class talent and comparing to Hill and Back and then straight away try to bugger it up with the biggest back row failure in recent years for England.

I guess PStD is kind of an exception though he is so lean and mobile and such a master at shi*t-housery that I class him as an out and out 6. I'm not really a fan off Barrett for NZ at 6 either. Lawes' failings at the breakdown and lack of mobility in 16/17 was amplified by the fact we had quite a slow pack and no proper openside but I would have thought 18 showed that he just isn't the right fit for England there. We have so much class coming through all across the backrow that I don't see the point in having him there. I still rate Lawes and with Kruis leaving then why not put him in the 2nd row and play a proper backrow - doesn't make any sense. If he has to cover 6 to see out a game because of injuries or something then that's different but we should move on from trying him there now when there are exciting option coming through.

 

[duncanb]

Eddie seems to prefer the lock \ 6 to the back row/ lock in Emergency.
With Maro and Courts he can afford to do it.
Bar Ted Hill I doubt anyone of CurryHill Ludlow could be emergency 2nd Row.
Probably makes the Drombrat no inclusion in squad a bit more surprising.
For me would have included Hill over Ewels for last 25.
Think Genge and one of JJ or Devoto will not make the 23.
For me.
Daly
Thornley
Tuilagi
Farrell
May.
Ford
Youngs
Marler
LCD
Sinks
Maro
Kruis
Laws
Curry
Ludlow

Mako
Stuart
Dunn
Ewels
Underhill
Heinz
Devoto
Furbank

No my personal favourites but what I think will show up.

 

[Scotty]

Genge
LCD
Sinks
Itoje
Kruis
Curry
Underhill
Ludlam

Heinz
Faz
May
Manu
JJ
Thorley
Daly

George
Mako
Stuart
Ewels
Lawes
Youngs
Ford
Furbank(Daly is centre cover so we need back row cover hence him over Devoto)

Leaves
Marler(covers THP/LHP on the day)
Devoto

I havnt looked at other peoples squads so if ive done similar then oh well. I dont want a lock in the back row. I want to see what a mobile back row looks like and how it handles this big french pack. I assumed EJ wanted to test what life is like without Billy. Not if a lock works at 6 which they dont...

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I do really hate Eddie Jones, he seems to do everything possible to try and screw up England teams.

Why can't we have a good coach who's normal?

 

[WarriorKelv]

Utterly depressed with the selection tbh. Includes no no. 8 and then drops our most physical back row player and the one who has the most experience as an 8 for a lock. I mean what is the guy actually thinking? I mean it's not like he is making small mistakes these are really peculiar mistakes

My personal team from the 25 would be
Genge LCD Sinkler
Itoje Kruis
Curry Ludlam Underhill
Youngs Farrell Tuilagi Joseph
Thorley Daly May

George, Mako, Stuart, Ewels, Lawes, Heinz, Ford, Furbank

But we all know Mako will start in the front row, Lawes, Underhill, Curry will be the back row and probably Marler will start as replacement even though we need to start bringing Genge forward.

 

[Scotty]

I do really hate Eddie Jones, he seems to do everything possible to try and screw up England teams.

Why can't we have a good coach who's normal?

Because normal ones get us knocked out of our own world cup and this one got us to a world cup final, for all his quirks he does get results. I trust it will come good in the end

 

[Nudger]

SA managed with de toit a second row playing wing forward

 

[TRF_Olyy]

If Lawes was half as good as PSDT I don't think anyone would have an issue with it.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

It's at least a good sign that Furbank is still in there; I doubt he'll start but at least EJ is looking at legitimate FB options.

I'm genuinely curious to see how Curry goes at 8 (if that is indeed what's happening). Personally don't mind it as an experiment; Pocock had never really played 8 before 2015 and Australia got to a RWC final with him playing there. I'd say Curry's far more suited to 8 than Pocock was, so it definitely has potential to be good. I just hope EJ doesn't insist on persisting with it if it does turn out to be a bust.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Because normal ones get us knocked out of our own world cup and this one got us to a world cup final, for all his quirks he does get results. I trust it will come good in the end

For me and this is a entirely personal view but I see Jones made the same mistakes as Lancaster and neither learned their lessons.

We got to the final yes, with a good win over the all blacks, but so Lancaster also managed a good win over the all blacks in his time.

The key things for me was that neither played seem to want to play a proper back combo, neither have settled on a 10 and neither have settled on a centre combo and neither have played I form players quick enough.

Im not sure if that is reflected on the type of English players available or both have similar faults.

I'm not seeing all this is fact, just how I see things.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Jones also has more talent to work with.

Times suggesting Furbank to start with Daly on the wing. A FB at 15, whatever next? An IC at 12? A no8 at 8, or getting really reckless a flanker at 6?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I said before that I hoped the All Blacks didn't paper over the glaring cracks in this England side but it looks like it is.

Everyone's obsessed with us reaching the final, ignoring that we only really looked good for 80mins vs New Zealand

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

We will see.
I thought we looked good against Australia also.

Comparing Jones Semi Final win to Lancasters November test win at home to the AB's is pretty reaching.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

We will see.
I thought we looked good against Australia also.

Comparing Jones Semi Final win to Lancasters November test win at home to the AB's is pretty reaching.

Ireland as well, but in the context of their season it definitely takes some of the sheen off.

I like EJ a lot and am by no means calling for his head, he just needs be held accountable for his crazy decisions and not just have them brushed off with "well we made the final"

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Ireland as well, but in the context of their season it definitely takes some of the sheen off.

I like EJ a lot and am by no means calling for his head, he just needs be held accountable for his crazy decisions and not just have them brushed off with "well we made the final"

I would just rather wait to see how those calls go before holding him accountable to them.

 

[NickBD]

Little harsh. I think any fan of any team would obsessed reaching the WC final The 80 against NZ was an all time England performance. I don't think that's papering over cracks. The WC just showed us the top 6 are pretty close in terms of quality imo. They can all beat each other.

On the posts above I think you guys are being a bit tough here. But I guess that's being an England rugby fan, either over confidence or just or total opposite. I wish he'd pick an 8 and another younger 9 but like the rest of the squad. I said it the England thread last year, everyone will want chance but considering the WC squad was youngish it was never gonna happen, even if he said he'd change it up. He will tinker but that'll start in Italy and then Japan. Patience

EJ has made mistakes every coach I could name has. But in a 4 year cycle 2 6N wins, a grand slam, 20 odd unbeaten run with getting to the World Cup final isn't half bad. Not sure you can say I hate EJ after that or compare his achievements to Lancaster.