[2018 Six Nations] England Squad

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Top ones.

Joe Moody

 

[Which Tyler]

Still isn't an important part.

Props had to learn to pass when FHs had to learn to tackle.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The thing about Ford's tackling is that conceding a few metres but completing the tackle is far better than completely missing them. Most of the tries scored against us have been down to someone who isn't Ford completely missing a tackle, quite often from a run from a long way back. Even if they are caught, they concede FAR more ground that Ford does as a result of missing the tackle. If we are going to say what are the main causes of us conceding ground it is:

1) Poor defence close to the ruck, they just sit there waiting for someone to run at them and then don't double up in the tackle so get pushed back
2) Players running clean through the defence because the spacing is too big / forwards being too slow getting back into position (******* COLE)
3) Defending far too narrow and being beaten on the outside because the defence don't make the effort to drift once the ball is going wide. You can see sides passing across the field way behind the gainline and our forwards are all just slowly trudging across the field making minimal effort to properly drift across.

I'd say Ford being hit is also a failure of other players no getting into position fast enough. If the opposition have had time to get their biggest runner in Ford's channel then why the hell do we not have our big defenders also nearby?

We know Ford's defence is an issue that has to be managed, but he never shirks. If Cips had the same amount of bottle we could have been looking at a genuine world star rather than an unfulfilled talent. He's the one that got away.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Stat floating around Twitter:

Billy Vunipola in 2016 6N - 93 runs for 336m, 8 offloads, 25 defenders beaten.
England forwards in 2018 6N - 327 runs for 582m, 10 offloads, 24 defenders beaten.

 

[Scotty]

Stat floating around Twitter:

Billy Vunipola in 2016 6N - 93 runs for 336m, 8 offloads, 25 defenders beaten.
England forwards in 2018 6N - 327 runs for 582m, 10 offloads, 24 defenders beaten.

So billy is the england pack...

Were we stupid enough to build a gameplan around billy and he goes and we lose it? I know thats not the only issue but damn thats a big difference from 1 man to an entire pack.

 

[TheSaffycen]

You lose a world class battering ram, that has good hands and an awareness for other players, you would always look worse. But that is a truly shocking statistic. Get Armand, Ewers and though I don't like the idea of it, Michael Rhodes caps. Get a 6 who can run and tackle, Robshaw is either the right 6 for your system or out.

 

[RugbyMarvel]

The carrying problem isn't that hard to fix, the pack has just been so unbalanced.

With Mako, Marler/Hepburn, Hartley, George, Cole and Williams I felt we only had one true ball carrier in Mako from those 6 for the first 3 games.

Out of the 6 front rowers across the 23 you could include Mako, LCD and Sinckler who are all very good ball carriers. (From current squad)

So if half your front row options can carry, those metres made stats increase.

It's obvious that we are over reliant on whoever is at 8 to carry. Simmonds came on for Hughes and looked to play in the exact same way which was pointless. So for me for this weekend, stick Armand at 8, Simmonds at 7 and Robshaw at 6.

Armand hits tight, uses his strength.
Simmonds allows himself to get a bit wider and use his pace.
Robshaw focuses alongside the locks and front rowers who aren't huge carriers to hit rucks and latch on to those smashing it up.

You will then, not counting the locks, have Mako, LCD, Sinks, Armand, Simmonds as ball carrying options be it starting or from the bench.

In the future add Billy V, Hughes, Genge etc to the list and we suddenly look a lot more threatening.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

And then there were 29: Hepburn, Slade and Isiekwe released back to their clubs,
More squad trimming tomorrow

 

[Scotty]

So im guessing next is Armand and LCD will be gone, dont want to rock the boat seen as hask robshaw and hartley are fit.

 

[Nudger]

So Hartley and Daley fit
Mako Hartley Cole
Launchbury itojo
Robshaw Haskell Simmonds
Care Farrell
Teo in
Daley Watson brown

 

[Nudger]

So Hartley and Daley fit
Mako Hartley Cole
Launchbury itojo
Robshaw Haskell Simmonds
Care Farrell
Teo in
Daley Watson brown

Eddy's changes are pleasantly surprising

 

[Big_Grumper]

On a slightly different note did anyone catch the Highlanders/Crusaders game this morning (06:30 GMT)?

If ever there was a display of 'total rugby' this was it, and sadly it shows what we are lacking. The speed and ferocity with which both teams played was amazing, but it wasn't just hit and run. The Kiwi skill set is so far ahead of ours right now: the offload in contact; the execution of the turnover; the dynamism in attack and the aggression from both sides at the breakdown.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Right. Is it ridiculous to suggest capping Smith? Farrell's a far better 12 than 10 and IMO Te'o's a far better 13 than 12. All we need is a quality 10 and with the state we're in at the moment, what do we really have to lose by giving Smith a shot? To me he just seems like a better Ford, better playmaking, better ball running, much better defence. Give him a go Eddie, what's the worst that can happen?

 

[Giraffatitan]

Right. Is it ridiculous to suggest capping Smith? Farrell's a far better 12 than 10 and IMO Te'o's a far better 13 than 12. All we need is a quality 10 and with the state we're in at the moment, what do we really have to lose by giving Smith a shot? To me he just seems like a better Ford, better playmaking, better ball running, much better defence. Give him a go Eddie, what's the worst that can happen?

Not ridiculous at all. He's been the stand-out player in a **** poor Quins team with a lot of the same problems as england are currently having all year. Has to go to South Africa.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Right. Is it ridiculous to suggest capping Smith? Farrell's a far better 12 than 10 and IMO Te'o's a far better 13 than 12. All we need is a quality 10 and with the state we're in at the moment, what do we really have to lose by giving Smith a shot? To me he just seems like a better Ford, better playmaking, better ball running, much better defence. Give him a go Eddie, what's the worst that can happen?

Playing him before he's ready and ******* him up mentally for the rest of his career.... aside from that....

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Would call up Cipriani before Smith tbh

A players (old) age doesn't matter this far out from a world cup, were looking for a world cup side not necessarily a player who's gonna be around for 12 more years

 

[Big_Grumper]

Would call up Cipriani before Smith tbh

Agreed, though I'd take both to SA if fit and available.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Can someone specifically explain why George Ford is a problem please?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Can someone specifically explain why George Ford is a problem please?

I don't have huge issues with is defence as some people do. It's his game management, he's anonymous in big games. He does well vs SH teams but when it comes to tight, physical games vs the likes of Scotland and Ireland he just looks lost.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I don't have huge issues with is defence as some people do. It's his game management, he's anonymous in big games. He does well vs SH teams but when it comes to tight, physical games vs the likes of Scotland and Ireland he just looks lost.

How did that pan out today?

It's ******* absurd that people are pointing to Ford as being anything close to a primary issue with this team.