[2016 RBS Six Nations] Round 2: Italy vs. England (14/02/2016)

[Every Time Ref]

I'd expect England/Eddie are going to attempt to do what Ireland did in 2014: build a solid 9-12 point lead through low-risk forward play and then open it up after 60 minutes when Italy tire and lose their shape. Hoping to then put three or four tries on to make the scoreline look good.

I just hope that Mako finally adds some carrying ability to the pack and stops his brother having to do it all. I'm also interested to see if Itoje comes on at flanker or Jones changes both locks.

Oh and we don't concede three tries through sloppy defence like last year.

Against France Italy defended well in the tight but looked very exposed when the ball went wide quickly. Campagnaro can be a bit shaky in defence so JJ has to attack him - remember how he did him last year. I love JJ but his form has been mediocre since the injury during the World Cup, and he needs to step up, especially with Daly around. If he doesn't start looking dangerous against Italy I might have to reluctantly join the chorus shouting for him to be dropped.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Clifford to play @ 13 if injury happens.

TBH it would basically be like having Barritt and/or Burgess in the back field.

 

[Every Time Ref]

TBH it would basically be like having Barritt and/or Burgess in the back field.

Be realistic. What kind of idiot would do that?

 

[spartan32]

Clifford to play @ 13 if injury happens.

TBH it would basically be like having Barritt and/or Burgess in the back field.

Of course!! How stupid of me. And while we are at it why not put Itoje in for JJ and Launch in for Brown. With his height he'd be great in the air.

 

[TommiG88]

I get the idea that Eddie is looking to alter the pack before he changes the backs. I'm probably totally wrong.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

That back row - ok, quite effective against the Sweaties

Was it?
Binny was great but Robshaw and Haskell were 2nd best at the breakdown, 2nd best in carrying, and 2nd best in collisions

 

[JJFlash]

Was it?
Binny was great but Robshaw and Haskell were 2nd best at the breakdown, 2nd best in carrying, and 2nd best in collisions

Ok, but from the half that I saw, they tackled well, but why hasn't EJ dropped them?

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I'm hoping that this is Jones giving certain players there last chance, like lawes, robshaw, Haskell as a 7.

Really hope so anyhow.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Can't see how this would be Haskell's last chance since EJ was chuffing himself off in the press over how great The Brand is.

 

[Crapspray]

Against France Italy defended well in the tight but looked very exposed when the ball went wide quickly. Campagnaro can be a bit shaky in defence so JJ has to attack him - remember how he did him last year. I love JJ but his form has been mediocre since the injury during the World Cup, and he needs to step up, especially with Daly around. If he doesn't start looking dangerous against Italy I might have to reluctantly join the chorus shouting for him to be dropped.

True, and I think England could win by playing wide early, but I think Eddie will be keeping one eye on Ireland/Wales. So the first 60 will probably be how he looks to take on Ireland and Wales and the last 20 will be to run up a score and experiment with youngsters. Plus France only beat them by two points at home, so I'm not sure we should be taking tips.

Here's hoping JJ has a good game too. Though to be fair to him, he didn't have much to work with against Scotland. And was solid in defence.

 

[TommiG88]

I'm hoping that this is Jones giving certain players there last chance, like lawes, robshaw, Haskell as a 7.

Really hope so anyhow.

Really harsh on lawes, thought he looked good when he came on at the weekend.

 

[Every Time Ref]

True, and I think England could win by playing wide early, but I think Eddie will be keeping one eye on Ireland/Wales. So the first 60 will probably be how he looks to take on Ireland and Wales and the last 20 will be to run up a score and experiment with youngsters. Plus France only beat them by two points at home, so I'm not sure we should be taking tips.

Here's hoping JJ has a good game too. Though to be fair to him, he didn't have much to work with against Scotland. And was solid in defence.

I've always thought JJ's under-rated for defence. He's not someone who's going to make big momentum-shifting tackles, but he is solid, never misses tackles or gives a huge amount of ground, he uses his pace to drift very well and most importantly of all he communicates well and makes good decisions. People often talk about "defence" when they mean "tackling", but there's a lot more to defence than tackling.

As for attack though, you can write off one quiet day, and you can say that it's hard to shine when your team are playing poorly (as at Bath all year), there are mitigating circumstances for his loss of form but at the end of the day it's been a long time since he's been the attacking threat he can be. You don't pick JJ for his defence, if he isn't making breaks and holding defenders then he isn't playing well.

 

[Atco]

Right I feel like I need to stick up for Alex Goode here &, just to put on record, I am no fan of Saracens or the type of rugby they ply (even if undoubtedly an extremely effective type of rugby).

I agree Goode shouldn't be on the bench as he is only covers one position. This isn't on its own a bad thing but under the recent circumstance (having one of Watson, Nowell or May in the side as well as Brown) it makes little sense. In my opinion and many others it seems we need a specialist wing cover on the bench.

But I disagree entirely with those that say he doesn't deserve to be in squad for the following reasons.

He has played consistently well for Saracens for at least three seasons now if not more & has been nothing other than excellent this season. If we don't pick players in form from our premier league to represent our country then something is wrong with our game structure.

Personally I would either have him start ahead of Brown (who has had his worst start to a season for Quins in ages) or not at all. All this talk of him 'not being international quality' is a load of rubbish. Yes he doesn't have electrifying pace but he has a good turn of pace. He reading of the game is second to none, his positioning is excellent & he is extremely good under the high ball. His kicking out of hand is of consistently high quality. His range is excellent with his apprenticeship at 10 & because he reads the game so well it means he can cut an excellent line in attack. His passing range & ability, again honed playing at 10, is good off both both sides (Farrell certainly can't say that) & he often creates move space for others with his clever footwork.

All in all he does the basics better than any other full back in England. This is why he is in the squad and why he has been regularly over the past 3yrs. It has only been for Brown's excellence that he hasn't had more.

I know what the response will be to this but I believe that although Goode is not an international starter for all the reasons relentlessly aired, I think I know why he's an international replacement. He would come on in the event of an injury to a back. The reason the coaches want that insurance is his rugby brain. He's very grown up, calm and sensible. With him in the backs, the result might not be as threatening to the opposition but it would be like having one of the coaching team on the pitch. The loss of the injured player would not be so serious and you could feel confident that he would work out, pragmatically what would need to be done. He's a 'fail safe' especially with a 6:2 bench.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

That bench is bizarre. I can only think that it's nothing to do with this match and all to do with blooding new talent - 4 of the forwards have 5 caps between them...of which George has 4.

I know Launch was ill last week, but does anyone else think that he hasn't consistently hit his pre injury heights yet? I think we've only seen glimpses.

 

[JJFlash]

Agree, I don't think he's back to his best. Maybe if he comes on for the last 20 and puts himself about a bit, Eddie may put him back in the starting XV against Ireland.
We'll see.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Spartan, his name is Nowell, not Knowell and certainly not Oh well or know all either.

This game looks like it's going to be a case of play ugly the first half to tire the Italians out, make subs across the forwards and then open up with the backs in the last 30. EJ has apparently told the backs he wants them to be much more adventurous and would rather they have a go if they think they have a chance and fail than not have a go at all. A nice mentality but not very sensible if you haven't got the players who can support the backs operating like that. Hask and Robshaw will NOT be able to get to the breakdowns fast enough.

 

[spartan32]

Sorry rangerancher. Shall I don the dunce cap and expect a rough bumming in the heads office after class

 

[Every Time Ref]

Spartan, his name is Nowell, not Knowell and certainly not Oh well or know all either.

This game looks like it's going to be a case of play ugly the first half to tire the Italians out, make subs across the forwards and then open up with the backs in the last 30. EJ has apparently told the backs he wants them to be much more adventurous and would rather they have a go if they think they have a chance and fail than not have a go at all. A nice mentality but not very sensible if you haven't got the players who can support the backs operating like that. Hask and Robshaw will NOT be able to get to the breakdowns fast enough.

*insert folorn reference to Matt Kvesic*

- - - Updated - - -

Sorry rangerancher. Shall I don the dunce cap and expect a rough bumming in the heads office after class

Wow, someone just upped the anti!

 

[spartan32]

But public school antics aside I don't think Jones is overly worried about the breakdown in this match as the Italians don't really have anyone to challenge that area, and if you get some go forward ball there should be plenty of time and space for the backs.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

But public school antics aside I don't think Jones is overly worried about the breakdown in this match as the Italians don't really have anyone to challenge that area, and if you get some go forward ball there should be plenty of time and space for the backs.

You don't need to challenge the breakdown if the opposition are too slow to even get to it. Our backs can be extremely fast and all it takes is one of make a break and get isolated for a turnover. Most of our forwards barely get beyond a slow jog when a back makes a break, which is why our backs get isolated so much and we get torn to pieces if the ball is lost and run back at us, forwards completely out of position and making minimal effort to sort it out.