[2015 Six Nations] England vs France (Round 5)

[Raggs]

Scotland x2 (not passing, blocking)
Wales (I think) he got caught on our 22 when if he'd passed it, it may have been on.

His carrying also varies a lot, sometimes he just doesn't make the yards (and it's not only when he's been targeted).

He's the best option we've got atm, and if we're going to introduce Tuilagi at 12, he's also the best guy to keep us running similar patterns (and limitations).

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There was another penalty too I believe against Scotland, equally daft if I recall.

 

[French TommyGun]

Spedding - Huget, Mermoz, Fickou, Nakaitaci - (o) Plisson, (m) Tillous-Borde - Le Roux, Goujon, Dusautoir - Maestri, Flanquart - Mas, Guirado, Debaty

On the bench: Kayser, Slimani, Atonio, Taofifenua, Chouly, Kockott, Talès, Bastareaud

Should have Picamoles instead of Chouly. If we're trying to turn the French team into a human wrecking ball when the bench comes on then Picamoles at the back of the pack would have been the icing on the gâteau!

 

[Raggs]

I'd have thought running Bastareaud at Ford, off of set pieces (especially scrums) would have been a smart plan for the first 50. Always felt you're better off getting pace and agility on late in the game, when tired bodies can still stand in the way of a bulldozer, but can't move fast enough to catch a flyer.

 

[Maverick1987]

Yeah, Mr. Consistently Mediocre. Something that no one mentions these days is that it took Robshaw until he was 25 to actually start for England. Can you (not you, good no 10) think of any other 'world-class' forwards who took this long to break through? Neil Back perhaps, but that was because he was a midget, and they thought midgets were bad in those days. How old was Richie McCaw? Michael Hooper? I think the fact that he wasn't 'world-class' until he was in his mid-20s shows that he is simply an average player who works very hard.

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And before you blame Johnson poor selection skills, Johnson has almost the same win-loss ratio as Lancaster, so why should we trust Lancaster's judgement over his, or over that of Gatland, who is obviously a better manager?

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I was trying to think of a comparable player, and the best one I can come up with is Martin Corry - who was also made England captain despite only ever being an average player.

You're crazy . Robshaw leads from the front makes his tackles is a very useful part of the line out makes the odd turnover . I really like him . Not sure how many tackles he made against Scotland but his count was at 60 tackles for 3 games .

If it was my choice I'd pick

6. Robshaw
7. Armitage
8. Billy V/Morgan (Billy's improvement has made this a really tough call)

 

[Patchey]

Team out. Parling starts, Attwood dropped altogether, Easter on the bench.

No other changes.

 

[michaelbolton]

Team out. Parling starts, Attwood dropped altogether, Easter on the bench.

No other changes.

Why just why?! Easter is a pile of crap anyway let alone instead of someone who actually plays there

 

[goodNumber10]

I'd have thought running Bastareaud at Ford, off of set pieces (especially scrums) would have been a smart plan for the first 50. Always felt you're better off getting pace and agility on late in the game, when tired bodies can still stand in the way of a bulldozer, but can't move fast enough to catch a flyer.

If Matt Scott can pancake Ford imagine what Basteraud will do... but Fickou isn't exactly small....

 

[Patchey]

Why just why?! Easter is a pile of crap anyway let alone instead of someone who actually plays there

No. No he is not.

 

[LiRFCMatt]

The England side:



No real surprises, disappointing to see Burrell stay in, I was secretly hoping for a Slade inclusion, but like I said I'm not at all shocked with Lancaster's choice for consistent selection at this stage, much in the same way that Ireland don't want to be messing around with their side even though they need to change something if they want to score enough points to win the 6 Nations.

 

[valley commando]

Spedding - Huget, Mermoz, Fickou, Nakaitaci - (o) Plisson, (m) Tillous-Borde - Le Roux, Goujon, Dusautoir - Maestri, Flanquart - Mas, Guirado, Debaty

On the bench: Kayser, Slimani, Atonio, Taofifenua, Chouly, Kockott, Talès, Bastareaud

Should have Picamoles instead of Chouly. If we're trying to turn the French team into a human wrecking ball when the bench comes on then Picamoles at the back of the pack would have been the icing on the gâteau!

Come on France

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

The England side:

View attachment 3738

No real surprises, disappointing to see Burrell stay in, I was secretly hoping for a Slade inclusion, but like I said I'm not at all shocked with Lancaster's choice for consistent selection at this stage, much in the same way that Ireland don't want to be messing around with their side even though they need to change something if they want to score enough points to win the 6 Nations.

I'd definitely say that dropping Attwood altogether is a surprise.

 

[Peat]

After about five seconds of thought, it wasn't surprising to me. Lancaster's always been lukewarm on him.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

After about five seconds of thought, it wasn't surprising to me. Lancaster's always been lukewarm on him.

Yeah, well Lancaster has never been one for tight-head locks. Surprising because he should have observed the difference he's made to our maul defence.
We would probably have lost against Ireland last year if it wasn't for him padlocking that last driving lineout.

 

[Patchey]

After about five seconds of thought, it wasn't surprising to me. Lancaster's always been lukewarm on him.

England have always been lukewarm on him as well.

A little baffled that he was jettisoned all together all the same.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

England have always been lukewarm on him as well.

A little baffled that he was jettisoned all together all the same.

It's a pretty big statement in a sense, unless it's purely pragmatic to have impact players for points scoring purposes and frankly that's not Lancasters style.
But otherwise, if you're dropping him outright now with Launchbury out, what chance is there for him when Launch comes back?
It may sound premature but this could be it for Attwood for a while..

 

[Patchey]

It's a pretty big statement in a sense, unless it's purely pragmatic to have impact players for points scoring purposes and frankly that's not Lancasters style.
But otherwise, if you're dropping him outright now with Launchbury out, what chance is there for him when Launch comes back?
It may sound premature but this could be it for Attwood for a while..

It just doesn't make sense when viewed like that. Not saying you don't make sense, I just don't understand why England would take that view!

He's a monster who goes through a huge amount of work, often in areas where unless you know what you're looking for you can miss his contour button. He played poorly against Ireland but so did half our pack!

I think we all agree that Lawes/Launch is our best lock combo and that Lancaster sees it that way as well. But Attwood has so much to contribute as well, along with Parling and Kruis.

 

[LiRFCMatt]

It's a pretty big statement in a sense, unless it's purely pragmatic to have impact players for points scoring purposes and frankly that's not Lancasters style.
But otherwise, if you're dropping him outright now with Launchbury out, what chance is there for him when Launch comes back?
It may sound premature but this could be it for Attwood for a while..

He is still ahead of Kruis and Easter won't be around after this World Cup, I think Lancaster is pleased with Ester's ability to cover lock and 8 and needs him for this game. Maybe when we see the return of Morgan we will see Attwood back, but it is quite a nice selection problem having Lawes, Launchbury, Parling, Attwood and Kruis vying for spots in the squad, and thats not mentioning Itoje who is an absolute animal and will be romping his way in to the England side soon enough.

 

[msf]

No, Maverick, I'm not crazy, not unless everyone who is calling for Robshaw to be dropped for a real 7 is crazy...as for him playing 6, he isn't as good as Wood or Croft in the lineout, isn't a big tackler or carrier like Ewers or Fearns, so again he is the 'blah' option.

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As for Attwood, Patchey, if you think 12trees is good how can we trust your opinion? I think Attwood has been shown to be very one-dimensional at international level, he has improved the scrum for sure, and is decent in the lineout, but compared with Launchbury, Lawes, Kruis or Parling, his workrate is poor. I actually think Kruis was much harder done by, it doesn't make much sense to me to keep him on while bringing Attwood off, and then drop him completely from the squad while retaining Attwood in the first XV.

 

[LiRFCMatt]

No, Maverick, I'm not crazy, not unless everyone who is calling for Robshaw to be dropped for a real 7 is crazy...as for him playing 6, he isn't as good as Wood or Croft in the lineout, isn't a big tackler or carrier like Ewers or Fearns, so again he is the 'blah' option.

I have to say I think Robshaw is one of our most consistent, reliable and efficient players. Not exciting, but crucial to the side and everything that we need, as for not being a "big tackler" he is always at the top of our tackle count, it doesn't get much bigger. Let Vunipola carry the ball, maybe Croft over Haskell would add another ball carrying option and a stronger lineout, but I wouldn't even contemplate dropping Robshaw at the moment.

Haskell needs to step up to his club form as his place is in doubt right now, and Burrell has a lot of pressure on him and will need a massive game, but other than that our team is fairly set in stone, even when the likes of Corbs and Morgan are back to full fitness, it will be a while before they can prove themselves as worthy for that starting spot given the players we have now.

 

[Maverick1987]

No, Maverick, I'm not crazy, not unless everyone who is calling for Robshaw to be dropped for a real 7 is crazy...as for him playing 6, he isn't as good as Wood or Croft in the lineout, isn't a big tackler or carrier like Ewers or Fearns, so again he is the 'blah' option.

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As for Attwood, Patchey, if you think 12trees is good how can we trust your opinion? I think Attwood has been shown to be very one-dimensional at international level, he has improved the scrum for sure, and is decent in the lineout, but compared with Launchbury, Lawes, Kruis or Parling, his workrate is poor. I actually think Kruis was much harder done by, it doesn't make much sense to me to keep him on while bringing Attwood off, and then drop him completely from the squad while retaining Attwood in the first XV.

You are quoting people who are inconsistent at best for England . We need players who go quietly about their business . Not everyone can be the "star" player . I don't remember the last time Robshaw had a bad game . Like I said before we could maybe move him to 6 to accommodate someone more specialist at the breakdown or leave him at 7 and put someone like Ewers in at 6 but to drop him all together would be suicide imo

There is other players who aren't performing we need to see the back of first (Goode and 36) rather than talking about dumping our captain and regular best player on the day