2014 QBE Internationals [EOYT] England

[TheSaffycen]

Right Lancaster was too naive to think that South Africa were going to let us have any time at the breakdown. He said that we will selectthe same team to show that his guys can do it, South Africa must have been ****ing laughing. All that done was meant they knew how we would play and all you have to do is go at our breakdown and we are ****ed.
For the Samoa game
1.Marler 2.Webber 3.Brookes 4.Attwood 5.Kruis 6.Haskell 7.Robshaw 8.Morgan 9.Dickson/Robson 10.Ford 11.May 12.Eastmond 13.Barritt 14.Rokoduguni/Watson 15.Brown

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Robson ain't in the EPS, I'd start Youngs.

I hope Roko is fit (no idea the extent of his injury). If he is then I think I'd go for Watson and Roko on the wings with May on the bench. I'd like to see Nowell involved but he's clearly behind Yarde in the pecking order so that's out of the equation.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Robson ain't in the EPS, I'd start Youngs.

I hope Roko is fit (no idea the extent of his injury). If he is then I think I'd go for Watson and Roko on the wings with May on the bench. I'd like to see Nowell involved but he's clearly behind Yarde in the pecking order so that's out of the equation.

Wigglesworth's left foot would compliment Ford, I would like to see him play. He gets the ball to the Fly Half quicker than anyone else and is the best kicker, he is unaware of threats coming from the ruck though and doesn't have much of a running threat.

 

[Maverick1987]

Right Lancaster was too naive to think that South Africa were going to let us have any time at the breakdown. He said that we will selectthe same team to show that his guys can do it, South Africa must have been ****ing laughing. All that done was meant they knew how we would play and all you have to do is go at our breakdown and we are ****ed.
For the Samoa game
1.Marler 2.Webber 3.Brookes 4.Attwood 5.Kruis 6.Haskell 7.Robshaw 8.Morgan 9.Dickson/Robson 10.Ford 11.May 12.Eastmond 13.Barritt 14.Rokoduguni/Watson 15.Brown

My team would be similar although I'd like to see Kitchener given a chance great pace, good line out powerful scrummager him and Attwood could forge a serious partnership also I'd play Youngs at SH . Who was the 3rd SH in the EPS ?

 

[ratsapprentice]

Dickson and Wigglesworth are the other sh's.

 

[goodNumber10]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

 

[Maverick1987]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

I feel the whole team would benefit with ford at 10 I'm not throwing the baby out the bath . It just makes sense Eastmond plays outside ford at club level and seems to have crafted a decent partnership with Barritt . Hopefully we can play more fluently with ford on the pitch . You will probably notice it when you get chance to watch that the tempo picked up when we swapped them . The only other change I'd love to see is Haskell for Wood . I fell like hask is better at the breakdown and more explosive . And in fairness I don't think 2 changes is going overboard tbh

 

[Geordie]

My team for the Samoa game.

1 Marler
2 Webber
3 Brookes
4 Attwood
5 Kitchener
6 Haskell
7 Robshaw (Bring Kvesic or Fraser on for a game at half time)
8 Morgan

9 Care (See how he goes with a more creative 10)
10 Ford
11 May
12 Eastmond
13 Barritt (But Bring Joseph on to give the Bath trio a run out. )
14 Watson
15 Brown

 

[j'nuh]

Robson is not really an option. He's dipped a lot this season. Kicking game decent, but he's slow to get the ball out and appears not to be communicating as well as Laidlaw with the rest of his team.

Also, can't believe anyone would drop May. His defence has been impeccable for England, and he's already shown what he can do with ball in hand. It's not his fault he doesn't get the ball all that much because our tactics are crap.

Watson goes back to the bench when Roko is available for me. Those two are the form wingers and they deserve to continue to be picked.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Yeah May has been suprisingly good in defence. I think it was the ABs game they had a 2 on 1 infront of May and rather than try to tackle, he just kept backpeddling and marking both until support came over to take the inside player so he could mark just the outside player. Lost some ground but ultimately the right choice as if he had dived in, it would likely have been a try.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

It's not the injured positions that are causing the major issues, though.
Wood, Care, Farrell - some of the first names on the team sheet.

Our notable injuries are in the front and second row - but our front and second row (starters and replacements) have gone very well so far.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

Isn't the point more that we have lost 5 consecutively? Plus no wins in 5 against the Boks, 1 in 6 against the Kiwis.
I haven't read thoroughly but at this point noone is suggesting imprisoning the coaching team...
The cause for worry is more the decision making of coaches, and the lack of direction or innovation with our backs than the fact that we've lost, anyway.

I still believe Lancaster has been the right bloke for the job. Having said this, we all know that it is easier to turn a well resourced side (players,money) from a poor/average team into a good side. This is what Lancaster has donevwell. The harder change is turning a good side into an excellent side. This is the task Lancaster has now. It takes someone with real vision and skills to get that final 20% out of a side, and for me, the jury is out regarding whether he can be that man.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Lancaster continues to pick the wrong players and the wrong tactics.

Lancaster lost us some 6 nations game with his bench choices and this round of games showed he doesn't have the balls to make the big calls.

Ford, eastmond and JJ should have started against New Zealand.
Someone other than wood should have been looked at for the South Africa game.
Morgan should have started!!!!

And our aimless kicking has continued for 3 years!

We arn't going to win a World Cup with Lancaster in charge

 

[Peat]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

You're never as good as you think, or bad as you think...

Individually, the last couple of matches haven't been *that* bad. But then I don't think the course were on eight months ago was that great.

I reckon we'll win 3 or 4 Six Nations games. I wouldn't be surprised if we reached the World Cup semi-finals. But our ability against other top teams is in serious question, which is why a Grand Slam would be a bit of a surprise.

We are doing the same things wrong, just we're getting punished more for them by a higher standard of team.

We don't protect our own ball well enough. We don't shift the ball well enough and smartly enough. From there we are getting all sorts of problems.

There needs to be serious consideration of what is going wrong repeatedly and what we need to do to fix them - there is, for my money, an awful lot of bathwater there.

edit: Just like to add that, while we're facing serious injuries that are hampering us, so are many other teams. 25pc of a squad unavailable is the new normal. A coach who can't get teams with injury problems to perform has no business being at the top end of the game.

 

[j'nuh]

still haven't had time to watch the game, so posting a bit blind here, I get we haven't played to our hoped potential but we shouldn't forget this team is held together with sticky tape and band aids right now, we've got a lot of very good players - world class even, coming back in the new year for the 6nations etc... do we really feel we've veered that far off course to where we were 8 months ago when we were playing with confidence and width?

but are we really all wanting to chuck the baby out with the bath water because we've had two disappointing results?

More like two years of disappointing results.

Lancaster took a poor team to the dizzying heights of mediocrity. The first year was good because he resolved the culture problem and there were steps forward. This, I give him credit for.

But ignoring that freak New Zealand game, has England ever played good? I can't think of a single good performance. We are only showing signs of improvement in the front 5, the rest has remained completely static or gone backwards over the last two years. What's most discouraging is that the coaching team has not made nearly enough of an effort to tackle the problem areas. We got destroyed in the breakdown when we lost 30-3 to Wales a-year-and-a-half ago, and it still remains a problem in most games we play. We have relied solely on Tuilagi's bosh in attack, and we look similarly out of ideas three years into Lancaster's rule. (Despite having players who impress in attack for clubs week-in, week-out!)

Why don't the coaches tackle the problem areas? Well, the interview with Lancaster after this game was revealing: "we'll not panic nor lose our nerve nor deviate from the course we're on". We need to deviate from the course we are on. What hope do we expect when the coach seems to ignore these problems, hope they go away on their own?

 

[Peat]

https://twitter.com/englandrugby - scroll down to the Mike Brown video - I think it sums it up.

 

[TommiG88]

More like two years of disappointing results.

Lancaster took a poor team to the dizzying heights of mediocrity. The first year was good because he resolved the culture problem and there were steps forward. This, I give him credit for.

But ignoring that freak New Zealand game, has England ever played good? I can't think of a single good performance. We are only showing signs of improvement in the front 5, the rest has remained completely static or gone backwards over the last two years. What's most discouraging is that the coaching team has not made nearly enough of an effort to tackle the problem areas. We got destroyed in the breakdown when we lost 30-3 to Wales a-year-and-a-half ago, and it still remains a problem in most games we play. We have relied solely on Tuilagi's bosh in attack, and we look similarly out of ideas three years into Lancaster's rule. (Despite having players who impress in attack for clubs week-in, week-out!)

Why don't the coaches tackle the problem areas? Well, the interview with Lancaster after this game was revealing: "we'll not panic nor lose our nerve nor deviate from the course we're on". We need to deviate from the course we are on. What hope do we expect when the coach seems to ignore these problems, hope they go away on their own?

Totally agree! I remember that wales game vividly when we turned up expecting to win with a back row of wood, robshaw and dowson. Then watching them get destroyed by wales. Very little has changed in that department and he ignores it. Wood or robshaw need to go as they're too similar. Farrell is totally off form with zero confidence, but he won't make the change. Our set of young of backs is the most exciting we've had for a long time and we are not playing to get them involved.

Marler
Webber
Brookes
Lawes
Attwood
Robshaw
Haskell
Morgan

Care
Ford
May
Eastmond
Barritt
Watson
Brown

Please?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

My team for the Samoa game.

1 Marler
2 Webber
3 Brookes
4 Attwood
5 Kitchener
6 Haskell
7 Robshaw (Bring Kvesic or Fraser on for a game at half time)
8 Morgan

9 Care (See how he goes with a more creative 10)
10 Ford
11 May
12 Eastmond
13 Barritt (But Bring Joseph on to give the Bath trio a run out. )
14 Watson
15 Brown

I would go with:

1) Mullan, 2) Webber, 3) Brookes
4) Kruis, 5) Kitchener
6) Haskell, 7) Kvesic, 8) Morgan
9) Youngs, 10) Ford
12) Barritt, 13) Joesph
11) Yarde, 14) Watson, 15) Goode

Bench: 16) Paice, 17) Waller, 18) Thomas, 19) Clarke, 20) Ewers, 21) Wigglesworth, 22) Slade, 23) Nowell

Doubt that would happen but that would be my team.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't think we would (or should) go for a full 23 switch out.

Assuming that Farrell is out and Roko is back then I think Lancaster will go for something like:

1. Mullan
2. Webber
3. Brookes
4. Kruis
5. Lawes
6. Haskell
7. Robshaw
8. Morgan
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. Yarde
12. Twelvetrees
13. Joseph
14. Rokoduguni
15. Goode

16. Hartley
17. Marler
18. Wilson (or....shudder.....Thomas)
19. Kitchener
20. Clarke/Ewers (Lancaster has a crush on Clarke, but he also likes having a genuine 8 option on the bench)
21. Dickson
22. Myler
23. Watson


Not what I'd have, but I could Lancs going for it.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I don't think we would (or should) go for a full 23 switch out.

Assuming that Farrell is out and Roko is back then I think Lancaster will go for something like:

1. Mullan
2. Webber
3. Brookes
4. Kruis
5. Lawes
6. Haskell
7. Robshaw
8. Morgan
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. Yarde
12. Twelvetrees
13. Joseph
14. Rokoduguni
15. Goode

16. Hartley
17. Marler
18. Wilson (or....shudder.....Thomas)
19. Kitchener
20. Clarke/Ewers (Lancaster has a crush on Clarke, but he also likes having a genuine 8 option on the bench)
21. Dickson
22. Myler
23. Watson


Not what I'd have, but I could Lancs going for it.

Wouldn't be too bad but I wouldn't want to see 12tress starting over Eastmond right now. Eastmond hasn't really done anything wrong so far and seems to be doing a fair amount right. He as good as set up a try that didn't happen due to Brown's error and has managed to get over the gain line better than 12trees despite being smaller. I can't recall seeing Eastmond fail defensively in the last 2 games.

Goode just no...