[2014 Mid-Year Tests] England

[McTallshort]

And by the look of him he ate it!

 

[Draggs]

Big props have no place in rugby.

 

[McTallshort]

unless they have fuzzy hair

 

[ratsapprentice]

How do you outplay someone who is on your own team, in a complimentary flanker partnership?

In the same way that a man of the match outplays the rest of his team - I found him to be far more impressive.

I'm not suggesting he should leapfrog anyone - but I haven't seen anyone do anything that suggests they could be a better openside than he is.
Haskell is playing very well - but him being seen as closer to a start than Kev would be yet another stat monster in place of the ever elusive English 7.
I like Haskell and I would have him over Johnson - but I really feel Kvesic is special and I want to see him play a big role in the senior side.

On him showing the classic openside specific skills - his link play when Gloucester have played well recently has been fantastic, but he's not really able to make any clean turnovers with any regularity because the Glos defence has been so abysmal.
Very few dominant tackles - and he is better off staying out of the breakdown to plug the gaps that are continually there in the Glos backline anyway.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Bear in mind that James Haskell has played in a woeful, directionless and often passionless Wasps side this season and still stood out to a huge extent, and thats coming straight back from injury.

I agree with this, we all called out for a fetcher and that is the only reason Kvesic got as much of a push as he did from fans. He does make a hell of a lot of tackles and is a good player, but Haskell can tackle as well and is a more physical specimen, Seymour is mini tank, Fraser is a great link -up openside. Personally Seymour and Haskell should be ahead of him on form.

 

[Patchey]

Seymour should probably be discounted from all future back row debate, simply because England will not pick him. If he was any other nationality (well maybe not a Kiwi) he's have 25+ caps easily by now. Oh well.

Haskell is a great impact option and did well for us when he was involved in the 2012 EYOT and 2013 6N. His major flaw is being a bit of a penalty magnet, although whether thats due to him actually infringing a lot or because he has a rep as a penalty machine I'm not sure.



Regarding the tour dates:
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_9255363,00.html

RFU appear to have cocked up and are trying to blame the IRB.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'd like to see Haskell come in for Johnson.
Nothing against Johnson, but Haskell has age and versatility on his side. He's also a genuine option at 8 (though I know he's not played there for a while), rather than shoehorning Johnson/Wood in there, in the event of losing one of Binny and Morgan pre-game, and the other mid-game.

 

[Peat]

I'd like to see Haskell come in for Johnson.
Nothing against Johnson, but Haskell has age and versatility on his side. He's also a genuine option at 8 (though I know he's not played there for a while), rather than shoehorning Johnson/Wood in there, in the event of losing one of Binny and Morgan pre-game, and the other mid-game.

You forgot to add physicality. Still haven't forgotten the difference Hask made in South Africa in Summer 2012.

 

[TheSaffycen]

He was brilliant vs South Africa, I remember that tackle on Mtwarria which just silenced the crowd i'm gonna try and find it because it just stopped him dead in his tracks. I can't find that one but this isn't bad either

 

[ratsapprentice]

Tip-tackle... red card.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

You forgot to add physicality. Still haven't forgotten the difference Hask made in South Africa in Summer 2012.

Very true.
I'd like to see one of him or Fearns in the EPS because we're missing an explosive/powerful flanker. It's a shame that they've both had so many injuries in recent seasons.

 

[McTallshort]

He was brilliant vs South Africa, I remember that tackle on Mtwarria which just silenced the crowd i'm gonna try and find it because it just stopped him dead in his tracks. I can't find that one but this isn't bad either

Umm always been a bit cynical about backrow players who look for the big crowd pleasing hit. Prefer someone one who grafts and does the donkey work but saying that Haskell is looking good this season. certainly pushing Johnson at the minute.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Is that what he's doing, though?
It's just part of his playing style - I wouldn't say SOB is a poorer player for his ability to absolutely ruin someone in a tackle.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Yeah that's hardly what you can call a crowd pleasing hit to be fair; it starts as just a good tackle (I know it doesn't really end as such as it's beyond horizontal) and it's hardly as if players relish tackling a 20 stone prop.

As Olyy says, Haskell has age and versatility on his side, and he also seems to thrive being a senior player in the wasps squad. He stands up and seems to lead well by example.
It also helps that he's giving away fewer penalties. He's carrying well at the moment which is hugely important imo; it's almost a waste being an 18 stone back-rower if you arn't making metres, and for a while Haskell wasn't. But he also steals more ball than either Robshaw or Wood ever have, or so it seems to me.

I'm certainly not advocating him to be a starter all of a sudden, but I am more than happy for him to play a role in the EPS and match day squads as a substitute (though he'll really struggle to achieve the latter)

 

[ratsapprentice]

You say he has age on his side... do mean relative to Johnson or generally - because I wouldn't say 29 was young.

 

[Aristodemus]

I would much rather have Haskell than Johnson on the bench, but I would much rather have many people over Johnson.

 

[Patchey]

I suspect we'll see if he has an England future when the tour squad is announced. If he can't make the first test squad then I suspect he wont make any squad under the current management.

 

[goodNumber10]

interesting view points imho:

The rugby paper on how they could have moved the dates over a year ago.

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/feat...n-heres-how-all-blacks-test-could-have-moved/

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I reckon Jamie Gibson should be ahead of Haskell and Johnson

Cant think why though.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I reckon Jamie Gibson should be ahead of Haskell and Johnson

Cant think why though.

Me neither.
He looked to be developing into a top drawer 7 at London Irish, now Tigers have turned him into an average 6.5. There are a whole host of players I'd have ahead of him, both at 6, 6.5 and 7.