2014 6 Nations: England vs Wales (Round 4)

[ratsapprentice]

The way they use their bench directly relates to who they pick.

They want continuity because the team needs it - whether they are chasing a game or closing it out.
Teams need quick, accurate delivery of ball to their FH. Their selection and use of the bench guarantees this.

All this is still irrelevant as Youngs is woefully out of form.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Perhaps worth remembering that Dicksons choice on the bench isn't tactical. It should be taken as Lancaster saying Dickson is currently the 2nd best English scrum half.

lancasters not the sort of man to make tactical SELECTIONS. He seems to believe in merit very strongly. I don't think you'd ever see him, for example, playing both Vunipola and Morgan i nthe back-row, As sarries might, purely to counteract the physicality of a particular opposition.

I personally don't disagree wit hthe ida that Dickson is our 2nd best nine right now. All the others have their foibles. I also don't see what Wigglesworth brings that Dickson doesn't?

 

[goodNumber10]

Exactly, and i'm saying that we'd be better maintaining continuity than bringing on Dickson, who will slow a game down.

Putting the youngs debate aside for the moment, England for me, are at their best when they have a 9 who can snipe and keep the fringe defences interested and narrow, and an off form youngs is better at that than Dickson. Dickson comes on and changes the entire shape of the game to something completely opposite to that we've just run for the last 60 minutes, Farrel deepens up and we slow right down - when actually we've got teams on the ropes.

What would have happened if Ford had had to come on? Playing him outside of Dickson would have been a disaster.

i'm very happy with England right now, i just am not happy with the backs options on the bench... as i said, i'd rather have Wigglesworth over Dickson, but i'd still rather have an out of form Youngs over them both. Simpson needs to start upping his game as well.

 

[goodNumber10]

Perhaps worth remembering that Dicksons choice on the bench isn't tactical. It should be taken as Lancaster saying Dickson is currently the 2nd best English scrum half.

lancasters not the sort of man to make tactical SELECTIONS. He seems to believe in merit very strongly. I don't think you'd ever see him, for example, playing both Vunipola and Morgan i nthe back-row, As sarries might, purely to counteract the physicality of a particular opposition.

I personally don't disagree wit hthe ida that Dickson is our 2nd best nine right now. All the others have their foibles. I also don't see what Wigglesworth brings that Dickson doesn't?

Fair points.... but there has to be an element of tactics to the bench at least in the backs, purely because 3 covers 7.

 

[glawsfan]

Suprised no one has mentioned Dan Robson fast developing into a quality first choice 9 at Gloucester. Also seemed to leepfrog Simpson as the Saxons first choice. Has a great kicking game from the base and is tactically aware. Has decent pace and a good enough pass he would be an ideal player to come of the bench and make an impact. I would love to see him given a chance on the NZ tour especially as it looks likely one of the scrum halfs will feature in the premiership final. If he remains first choice at Gloucester next season I can see him breaking into the world cup squad as it is a position England are weak in.

 

[goodNumber10]

not a bad call that RE: Robson.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Robson is definitely the standout young English SH, I'd like to see him involved in NZ too.

With a bit of experience and consistency he has the skillset to be our number 1.

 

[glawsfan]

Only thing that worries me is if the rumours of us signing Laidlaw are true. I can't see us signing him to play FH and he wont want to be second choice at SH either. I hope Robson remains are first choice 9 next season as he is good enough to step up.

 

[Peat]

Dunno, Laidlaw is a pretty-good fly-half, and Glaws have no one else confirmed.

Arguing on Youngs vs Dickson is like betting your mortgage on a spelling bee in Cousinf**k, Alabama.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'm sure Laidlaw has said he only really wants to play 9 - can't see him going to a club if they've said he's gonna be a 10.
Unless it's a Foden situation, where he went to Saints under the promise of playing 9...

 

[Peat]

Oh, if he's said that, fair enough.

Hmm. Laidlaw is a pretty cool player to have around, but I'd quite like Dan Robson to walk out asap in those circs.

 

[Kevin Robarts]

Hey guys,

biggest and hardest game of the round to call. who's gonna win it?

 

[Aristodemus]

England

 

[Big Ewis]

dunno, am hesitating between England and Wales at the moment....

 

[Kevin Robarts]

You might think I'm mental for saying this but am beginning to feel that England have the better pack

Guess it all depends on whos injured cause the two squads are so evenly matched

Bummed about the ref. He should have been kicked out of rugby after RWC 2011

 

[Kevin Robarts]

the fact that Billy Vunipola is out injured could be massive

 

[Peat]

the fact that Billy Vunipola is out injured could be massive

Could be, but then it's arguable that his replacement Ben Morgan is a better player. He's certainly been making big contributions off the bench - not too worried about that.

It's who comes in for Morgan on the bench, and the possible effects of an early injury for Morgan, that potentially worries.

 

[McTallshort]

Suprised no one has mentioned Dan Robson fast developing into a quality first choice 9 at Gloucester. Also seemed to leepfrog Simpson as the Saxons first choice. Has a great kicking game from the base and is tactically aware. Has decent pace and a good enough pass he would be an ideal player to come of the bench and make an impact. I would love to see him given a chance on the NZ tour especially as it looks likely one of the scrum halfs will feature in the premiership final. If he remains first choice at Gloucester next season I can see him breaking into the world cup squad as it is a position England are weak in.

any one who can perform behind that ****te pack deserves a chance.

 

[Patchey]

Could be, but then it's arguable that his replacement Ben Morgan is a better player. He's certainly been making big contributions off the bench - not too worried about that.

It's who comes in for Morgan on the bench, and the possible effects of an early injury for Morgan, that potentially worries.

Morgan is a better all round player IMO. Billy is certainly a better carrier, but Morgan has better awareness, defense and contributes a tad more at the breakdown. He also carries very well.

I think Lancaster will bring in Kvesic and have Wood covering 8. Don't see him blooding Ewers or Dickinson against Wales at least.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Billy is a million times more consistent than Morgan, though.
I really like Kvesic, I just hope that if he comes on vs Wales it's for a flank, not with Morgan having to go and Wood going to 8. Our play is dependent on having a big big ball carrier in the pack.
That said Henry and Attwood are both hard carriers.