2011 RWC - Any bolters for the All Blacks and Who will miss out?

[Dizzy]

I believe this will be the World Cup Squad,
I hate to have left out Gear but, this super rugby competition, he has done more bad than good.

Owen Franks, Ben Franks, Tony Woodcock, John Afoa
Keven Mealamu, Andrew Hore, Hika Elliot
Brad Thorn, Ali Williams, Sam Whitelock
Richie McCaw, Jerome Kaino, Adam Thompson,
Kieran Read, Liam Messam
Jimmy Cowan, Piri Weepu, Alby Mathewson
Daniel Carter, Aaron Cruden,
Sitiveni Sivivatu, Joe Rokocoko, Zac Guildford, Ben Smith
Ma'a Nonu, Conrad Smith, Sonny Bill Williams
Mils Muliaina, Cory Jane, Isaia Toeava

 

[Dizzy]

Actually I will remove Ben Smith from that squad and add Victor Vito to the number 8's

 

[Darwin]

Actually I will remove Ben Smith from that squad and add Victor Vito to the number 8's

I don't think you will be too far off with that squad. Though it would be possible for them to go in with only three locks (and six loose forwards), I think it is far more likely that they will take four locks with only 5 loosies (as they did during the EOYT). I'd say Anthony Boric will definitely make the squad, as he was impressive for the AB's last season, and has probably been NZ's most consistent lock throughout the Super Rugby season.

I think the AB selectors are more likely to take Ellis than Mathewson (because of the skills they want their halfbacks to have), but personally I'd prefer Mathewson. I'm not sure about Cruden, but I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he was picked. Assuming Kahui is fit (which is far from guaranteed) I'd say he will be included as well.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

I'm predicting:

Afoa, Franks, Franks, Woodcock
Hore, Mealamu, Elliot
Thorn, Whitelock, Williams, Boric
McCaw, Messam, Kaino, Read, Thomson
Weepu, Cowan, Ellis
Carter, McAlister
Williams, Nonu, Smith, Kahui
Sivivatu, Jane, Toeava, Gear, Muliaina

The only spots I'm unsure about are the back up first five and the outside backs.

Ellis is all but guaranteed the last halfback spot.

 

[Darwin]

I'm predicting:

Afoa, Franks, Franks, Woodcock
Hore, Mealamu, Elliot
Thorn, Whitelock, Williams, Boric
McCaw, Messam, Kaino, Read, Thomson
Weepu, Cowan, Ellis
Carter, McAlister
Williams, Nonu, Smith, Kahui
Sivivatu, Jane, Toeava, Gear, Muliaina

The only spots I'm unsure about are the back up first five and the outside backs.

Ellis is all but guaranteed the last halfback spot.

That's exactly the same squad I'm predicting. Personally I would like to see Todd, Slade, Guildford, and Ben Smith involved, but it's unlikely to happen.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I think you will find that you are disagreeing with dan the man. To be fair we are the only two people who support the Highlanders, so we are perhaps easy to confuse

Not true Darwin!

 

[Darwin]

Not true Darwin!

Sorry Jabby, I forgot about you!
Indeed there are three people who are unfortunate enough to support the Highlanders (excluding anyone else that I have missed )

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

That's exactly the same squad I'm predicting. Personally I would like to see Todd, Slade, Guildford, and Ben Smith involved, but it's unlikely to happen.

I'd prefer to see Leonard, Todd and Ben Smith too, I think.

But it'd be hard to leave someone else out at the expense of Smith.

 

[Dizzy]

One halfback I would love for them to take is Brendon Leonard, very under rated and he very rarely makes the wrong decisions

 

[lance2010]

I'm predicting:

Afoa, Franks, Franks, Woodcock
Hore, Mealamu, Elliot
Thorn, Whitelock, Williams, Boric
McCaw, Messam, Kaino, Read, Thomson
Weepu, Cowan, Ellis
Carter, McAlister
Williams, Nonu, Smith, Kahui
Sivivatu, Jane, Toeava, Gear, Muliaina

The only spots I'm unsure about are the back up first five and the outside backs.

Ellis is all but guaranteed the last halfback spot.

I don't think McAllister will make it in i'm going with Cruden... Read what Graham Henry has to say about a few guys chances.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/rugby-world-cup/5149815/Henrys-plan-for-World-Cup-call-me-loyal

 

[Larksea]

Though I think leonard was still an outside chance for selection even though he's had a very impressive year. I think kicking is going to be critical and Henry is making noises about that too and Leonards kicking has been superb maybe the best in NZ from 9 and the rest of his game has been great too which makes me think he is a good chance.

But Henry has basically come out and said in situations where players are close in terms of slelection that players who have Signed with the NZRU for next year will be perfered.

Makes me wonder if that is going to hurt the chances of people like Leonard & Donald who are in close selection battles but have not signed for 2012 with the NZRU.

As far as bolters go Matt Todd would have to top the list

Below that would be others who have All Black experience like
Ben Smith
Crockett
Leonard
Guildford

Of the injured players sounds like Dagg has been setback the most he will be most likely to miss out because of injury.

 

[Larksea]

hard to get a read on the coaches but it's come out that the squad is basically picked and it may have been wane smith or henry that's said Dan Caters backup has been penned in and he's an experienced test player and a specialist first 5/8th and out of all the options the only one that actually fits that description is Stephen Donald.

 

[alex]

guess i'll make a probables v possibles team, for fun

----PROBABLES---- - - - - - - - - ----POSSIBLES----
1. T.Woodcock- - - - - - - - - - - 1. B.Franks
2. K.Mealamu - - - - - - - - - - - -2. H.Elliott
3. O.Franks - - - - - - - - - - - - -3. J.Afoa
4. B.Thorn- - - - - - - - - - - - - -4. A.Williams
5. S.Whitelock- - - - - - - - - - --5. J.Hoeata
6. J.Kaino- - - - - - - - - - - - - -6. V.Vito
7. R.McCaw- - - - - - - - - - - - -7. M.Todd
8. K.Reid - - - - - - - - - - - - - -8. L.Messam
9. P.Weepu - - - - - - - - - - - - 9. A.Matthewson
10. D.Carter - - - - - - - - - - - -10.Slade
11. H.Gear- - - - - - - - - - - - -11. Z.Guildford
12. S.Williams- - - - - - - - - - - 12. R.Kahui
13. C.Smith- - - - - - - - - - - - 13. R.Fruean
14. C.Jane- - - - - - - - - - - - - 14. I.Toeava
15. M.Muliaina- - - - - - - - - - - 15. B.Smith

16. A.Hore- - - - - - - - - - - - -16. C.Flynn
17. B.Franks- - - - - - - - - - - -17. N.Tialata
18. A.Boric- - - - - - - - - - - - -18. T.Donnelly
19. A.Thomson- - - - - - - - - - -19. L.Braid
20. A.Ellis- - - - - - - - - - - - - -20. B.Leonard
21. A.Cruden- - - - - - - - - - - -21. L.McAllister
22. M.Nonu- - - - - - - - - - - - -22. S.Maitland


did not include Israel Dagg/Daniel Braid due to injury, but did include Colin Slade. How inconsistent.

 

[DallyM]

guess i'll make a probables v possibles team, for fun

----PROBABLES---- - - - - - - - - ----POSSIBLES----
1. T.Woodcock- - - - - - - - - - - 1. B.Franks
2. K.Mealamu - - - - - - - - - - - -2. H.Elliott
3. O.Franks - - - - - - - - - - - - -3. J.Afoa
4. B.Thorn- - - - - - - - - - - - - -4. A.Williams
5. S.Whitelock- - - - - - - - - - --5. J.Hoeata
6. J.Kaino- - - - - - - - - - - - - -6. V.Vito
7. R.McCaw- - - - - - - - - - - - -7. M.Todd
8. K.Reid - - - - - - - - - - - - - -8. L.Messam
9. P.Weepu - - - - - - - - - - - - 9. A.Matthewson
10. D.Carter - - - - - - - - - - - -10.Slade
11. H.Gear- - - - - - - - - - - - -11. Z.Guildford
12. S.Williams- - - - - - - - - - - 12. R.Kahui
13. C.Smith- - - - - - - - - - - - 13. R.Fruean
14. C.Jane- - - - - - - - - - - - - 14. I.Toeava
15. M.Muliaina- - - - - - - - - - - 15. B.Smith

16. A.Hore- - - - - - - - - - - - -16. C.Flynn
17. B.Franks- - - - - - - - - - - -17. N.Tialata
18. A.Boric- - - - - - - - - - - - -18. T.Donnelly
19. A.Thomson- - - - - - - - - - -19. L.Braid
20. A.Ellis- - - - - - - - - - - - - -20. B.Leonard
21. A.Cruden- - - - - - - - - - - -21. L.McAllister
22. M.Nonu- - - - - - - - - - - - -22. S.Maitland


did not include Israel Dagg/Daniel Braid due to injury, but did include Colin Slade. How inconsistent.[/QUOTE

nice. although you've got B Franks in both teams. interesting also that Jimmy Cowen is omitted.

 

[Rhyer]

1) Wyatt Crockett
2) Keven Mealamu
3) Owen Franks
4) Brad Thorn
5) Sam Whitelock
6) Jerome Kaino
7) Richie Mccaw
8) Keiran Read
9) Jimmy Cowan
10) Dan Carter
11) Israel Dagg
12) Ma'a Nonu
13) Conrad Smith
14) Isaia Toeava
15) Mils Muliaina

16) Corey Flynn
17) Ben Franks
18) Ali Williams
19) Liam Messam
20) Piri Weepu
21) Colin Slade
22) Rene Ranger

23) John Afoa
24) Charlie Faumuina
25) Andrew Hore
26) Anthony Boric
27) Matt Todd
28) Andy Ellis
29) Sean Maitland
30) Sonny Bill Williams

That would be my squad of thirty. I would love to take Roks and if there was one more place he would make it. I would pick Ranger on the bench as he can cover the wings and centre. The world cup is all about defence and territory which is why I chose three fullbacks in the starting XV as they will really need that ability to catch those high balls. Tony Woodcock is of course injured so hasn't been selected. Robbie Fruean just misses out because there are people who can cover 13 if needed as well as other positions but you need a specialist wing who is on form.

 

[Darwin]

1) Wyatt Crockett
2) Keven Mealamu
3) Owen Franks
4) Brad Thorn
5) Sam Whitelock
6) Jerome Kaino
7) Richie Mccaw
8) Keiran Read
9) Jimmy Cowan
10) Dan Carter
11) Israel Dagg
12) Ma'a Nonu
13) Conrad Smith
14) Isaia Toeava
15) Mils Muliaina

16) Corey Flynn
17) Ben Franks
18) Ali Williams
19) Liam Messam
20) Piri Weepu
21) Colin Slade
22) Rene Ranger

23) John Afoa
24) Charlie Faumuina
25) Andrew Hore
26) Anthony Boric
27) Matt Todd
28) Andy Ellis
29) Sean Maitland
30) Sonny Bill Williams

That would be my squad of thirty. I would love to take Roks and if there was one more place he would make it. I would pick Ranger on the bench as he can cover the wings and centre. The world cup is all about defence and territory which is why I chose three fullbacks in the starting XV as they will really need that ability to catch those high balls. Tony Woodcock is of course injured so hasn't been selected. Robbie Fruean just misses out because there are people who can cover 13 if needed as well as other positions but you need a specialist wing who is on form.

Agree with a lot of the squad. I'm sure the AB selectors will take a 16/14 split as they have throughout their coaching reign, though like you I would be tempted to go for a 17/13 split. Tony Woodcock is expected to be fit by RWC time, so is bound to be included in the squad.

 

[Rhyer]

Agree with a lot of the squad. I'm sure the AB selectors will take a 16/14 split as they have throughout their coaching reign, though like you I would be tempted to go for a 17/13 split. Tony Woodcock is expected to be fit by RWC time, so is bound to be included in the squad.

Okay, thank you for the information. I thought they usually took five props, which is why I did that.

 

[Rhyer]

1) Wyatt Crockett
2) Keven Mealamu
3) Owen Franks
4) Brad Thorn
5) Sam Whitelock
6) Jerome Kaino
7) Richie Mccaw
8) Keiran Read
9) Jimmy Cowan
10) Dan Carter
11) Israel Dagg
12) Ma'a Nonu
13) Conrad Smith
14) Isaia Toeava
15) Mils Muliaina

16) Corey Flynn
17) Ben Franks
18) Ali Williams
19) Liam Messam
20) Piri Weepu
21) Colin Slade
22) Rene Ranger

23) Tony Woodcock
24) Sitiveni Sivivatu
25) Andrew Hore
26) Anthony Boric
27) Matt Todd
28) Andy Ellis
29) Sean Maitland
30) Sonny Bill Williams

A bit revised. Sitiveni Sivivatu has been in very good form for the Chiefs after coming back from injury so he deserves a spot especially considering his experience. I don't think Tony Woodcock's experience will be enough to get him into the starting 22 unless it is against a tier 2 team. Wyatt Crockett's form is dangerously hard to ignore as he has been demolishing every prop one by one this year. John Afoa and Charlie Faumuina are very good props but the trio from the Crusaders clearly got the better of them when they last played. Obviously the starting 22 would change depending on what team you are playing against. If the game was against Australia I would swap Sitiveni Sivivatu in for Israel Dagg and put Israel Dagg on the bench over Rene Ranger.

I'm very surprised not many people have picked Israel Dagg. His form before injury was incredible! 7 tries is very good considering he has only played about half the games this year. Also considering we know what he can do after his performance against South Africa in 2010 in Wellington.

Crap song but you can't ignore class like this;

 

[Darwin]

1) Wyatt Crockett
2) Keven Mealamu
3) Owen Franks
4) Brad Thorn
5) Sam Whitelock
6) Jerome Kaino
7) Richie Mccaw
8) Keiran Read
9) Jimmy Cowan
10) Dan Carter
11) Israel Dagg
12) Ma'a Nonu
13) Conrad Smith
14) Isaia Toeava
15) Mils Muliaina

16) Corey Flynn
17) Ben Franks
18) Ali Williams
19) Liam Messam
20) Piri Weepu
21) Colin Slade
22) Rene Ranger

23) Tony Woodcock
24) Sitiveni Sivivatu
25) Andrew Hore
26) Anthony Boric
27) Matt Todd
28) Andy Ellis
29) Sean Maitland
30) Sonny Bill Williams

A bit revised. Sitiveni Sivivatu has been in very good form for the Chiefs after coming back from injury so he deserves a spot especially considering his experience. I don't think Tony Woodcock's experience will be enough to get him into the starting 22 unless it is against a tier 2 team. Wyatt Crockett's form is dangerously hard to ignore as he has been demolishing every prop one by one this year. John Afoa and Charlie Faumuina are very good props but the trio from the Crusaders clearly got the better of them when they last played. Obviously the starting 22 would change depending on what team you are playing against. If the game was against Australia I would swap Sitiveni Sivivatu in for Israel Dagg and put Israel Dagg on the bench over Rene Ranger.

I've mentioned a few times that I don't think the AB's can afford to take two specialist loose-head props in the Crockett and Woodcock, as neither is a bench option. Unless Crockett have overtaken Woodcock as NZ's premier loose-head prop (which on this seasons form could possibly be argued) I can't see him making the squad due to his lack of versatility. Crockett should his chance to push for a world cup squad in the tri-nations.

I'm very surprised not many people have picked Israel Dagg. His form before injury was incredible! 7 tries is very good considering he has only played about half the games this year. Also considering we know what he can do after his performance against South Africa in 2010 in Wellington.

Dagg hasn't been mentioned that much, as at this stage he may not even be back from injury in time for the RWC. He is apparently recovering well, but they still haven't given a definitive date as to when he will be able to play rugby again. I actually don't think his form before injury was that good; sure he scored a few tries and broke the line a few times, but his error-rate was incredibly high. He continually kicked the ball out on the full from outside his 22, his handling was poor, and he decision making let him down quite a bit. He can provide moments of absolute brilliance, but I would hate to have him starting at fullback in the crucial RWC game (though I think he is a great impact player to have off the bench if required). The AB's selectors do rate him very highly, so I'd imagine he will make the RWC assuming he gets back to full fitness

 

[Purdy]

New Zealand First XV

1. Tony Woodcock
2. Kevin Mealamu
3. John Afoa
4. Brad Thorn
5. Ali Williams
6. Jerome Kaino
7. Richie McCaw
8. Kieran Read
9. Jimmy Cowan
10. Dan Carter
11. Cory Jane
12. Ma'a Nonu
13. Robert Fruean
14. Rene Ranger
15. Israel Dagg

New Zealand Second XV

1. Ben Franks
2. Andrew Hore
3. Owen Franks
4. Tom Donnelly
5. Sam Whitelock
6. Adam Thompson
7. Daniel Braid
8. Liam Messam
9. Piri Weepu
10. Luke Mcalister
11. Hosea Gear
12. Sonny Bill Williams
13. Conrad Smith
14. Sitiveni Sivivatu
15. Mils Muliaina