I'm guessing it'll be like every other match. Both teams have to agree to have it closed, otherwise it's open.
Hopefully the weather will be nice, and it'll be open regardless.
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How confident are you about your country in the World Cup?
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I'm guessing it'll be like every other match. Both teams have to agree to have it closed, otherwise it's open.
Hopefully the weather will be nice, and it'll be open regardless.
That is a good question!
I'd imagine the WRU don't have a say in it as it's technically a tournament solely hosted by England - my money's on WR having the final say (maybe after consulting both teams?) as otherwise England could open up the roof, if the weather was terrible, and make it's rivals play in the muck.
Its not the 1980's anymore. Ive never read any example of "hooliganism" in rugby, cricket, tennis, snooker etc etc etc and football is way better than it used to be. There are some morons about but compared to the stuff you read about in other nations, take the recent River Plate v Boca Juniors game as an example, that stuff doesn't happen here.
There are things you can level at English sport. Hooligan fans just is not one of them
Rich Taff
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Damn, that could cause some interesting legal argument.
Usually, the away team has to agree to close it if Wales want to. However, with this being a world cup in 'England', will Wales also be regarded as the away team?
Jeeez, and I thought the Aussies were exaggerating when they said that the neighbouring little Island was full of people with chips on both of their shoulders!!
That's what I was thinking. I don't think WR is as bad as FIFA, but it makes me wonder who will be the decision makers.
For instance when the FIFA World Cup was held in SA, FIFA had it's own temporary courts, and they had hearings regarding incidents at the stadiums and parking lots. SA's government, nor the Stadium's governing body had any say in those matters. FIFA even supplied their own Judges...
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Look at your posts, they speak for themselves. Petty little troll.
MotherRucker1
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Really? Based on one poster?
The rest of us just have a difference of opinion when using the term 'cheater.' To me, failing to meet the referee's interpretation of whether someone joined the gate correctly, didn't time something properly, or didn't support your own body weight in the heat of the moment doesn't mean you are worthy of such a label. Otherwise anybody, accidentally doing anything, or even putting the slightest foot wrong is a cheater and that's just nonsense.
Blatantly holding a player back so he can't chase his chip kick, or purposefully obstructing like we saw one Chiefs prop do earlier this season are more along those lines. The difference is, you aren't genuinely attempting to do anything other than break the rules. If you hold someone back by the collar then you're not trying to pilfer the ball or making an effort to meet the required standards - you're just being an ass.
Just going to ignore the barbs about moaning about the referee. I've been part of rugby forums for a long time, not just this one, and New Zealand always gets thrown under the bus for something. So and so gets away with murder, New Zealand steals P.I players, Eden park makes a referee bias, the haka shouldn't be allowed. There is a load of twaddle on all sides.
True, but then you get guys who are habitual in not joining the gate correctly, didn't time something properly (or perfectly), or not supporting their own body weight. IMHO guys who do this time and time again are "cheating". I say it in inverted commas as I don't necessarily see it in a negative connotation, but rather that hey have figured out how to outsmart the referees and opposition players, to such an extent that they win the game sometimes single-handedly for their team.
But it's nonetheless cheating, and in time cheaters are always caught out. And I think it's now suddenly happening with Mccaw. Referees have been very strict with him specifically and I think all the referees studied his habits and how he tries to manipulate the game. I hope that the referees do this to all the "cheaters" and not just target Mccaw as that would also set a very bad precedent.
MotherRucker1
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I don't think you're necessarily wrong, but if we use that sentiment then it becomes "is that guy living up to his reputation and being habitual, or was that a genuine effort gone wrong?". Then all we're doing really is speculating. I think there a pretty fine line and distinction there, each instance has to be judged on it's context and the player's purpose. It's not really an argument I'm focusing on McCaw, just anyone in general really. Pocock faces similar challenges, and I just see him as a guy trying to be competitive. The cheater thing seems overly simple to me - it reminds me of that stupid George Bush quote "I don't do nuance!"
I agree with the second part, but for different reasons. I think McCaw is becoming older, slower, and the core body strength isn't what it use to be which is impacting his ability at ruck time. I think the referees are actually cracking down on everybody anyway - there is such a myriad of rules, which we've talked about in the Super Rugby threads.
I agree with the second part, but for different reasons. I think McCaw is becoming older, slower, and the core body strength isn't what it use to be which is impacting his ability at ruck time. I think the referees are actually cracking down on everybody anyway - there is such a myriad of rules, which we've talked about in the Super Rugby threads.
goodNumber10
International
You're comparing one off incidents to people who habitually play the referee by obstructing and breaking the rules. There is no grey area here, if you knowingly break the rules regardless of Referees interpretation then you are cheating. If you condone such behavior then you condone cheating.
Playing the ref doesn't mean cheat, doesn't mean step outside the laws just because you can get away with it.
What it actually means is adapt your game to adhere to his law interpretation, not take advantage of things he doesn't ref. If he's pinging you for going off your feet, you stay on your feet and go past the ball, if he's pinging you for coming in from the side you get there earlier and work harder to come through the gate.
This is a subject that comes up time and time again in regards to coaching, do you coach your players to bend the rules (cheat) or do you coach them to the law and give them the skill set to adjust when things change.
I find it amazing so many people condone cheating (especially as they are normally the first to moan about it)
Someone should edit the thread title to this.
goodNumber10
International
it's not really though is it?
It's a pretty important discussion in the context of the sport; is cheating ok?
We all complain about Ref's interpretations of or not enforcing the law, yet pat people on the back for taking advantage of breaking those self same laws. How does that work then?
The game is complicated enough without people breaking the rules to win.
No, it's you and a few others trying to hold a sensible debate about an issue completely tangential to the thread title in the middle of a load of twaddle. I stand by my statement.
goodNumber10
International
hahaha! fair enough
I don't condone it, especially as my team usually are at the wrong side when it comes to this (Bryce Lawrence springs to mind).
But it is part of the game, and I have to, just like other rugby fans, that it's part of the game and accept that the necessary steps are being taken to prevent it.
It is also an important part of discussion as it is an integral part of the setup of teams going into the World Cup.
If players such as Mccaw and Pocock become liabilities for their teams, would they still get picked? Would the team play a style of rugby to assist their players in trying to get the ball or penalties by "cheating"?
Unol Daleithiau
Academy Player
Wales are not regarded as an official host, so technically yes. From what I understand the procedure will be like now, both sides must agree to have it closed. It will be open by default.
LiRFCMatt
Bench Player
Anyway England will win the World Cup.
Unol Daleithiau
Academy Player
I do not even see England advancing to the Quarter-Finals. I am being honest, I think England will finish behind Australia and Wales in 3rd place of the pool.
Well I just realised I pushed the wrong button.
In my defense, I'll say that I already knew about Ireland/ british islands question, I even readed A Modest Proposal; I can only offer as an excuse that it was and innocent and inintencional sentence, product of the commom generalization, although probably rude and gross, of the "little islands over there". It shows that I can be a little unscrupulous sometimes, but I didn't do it with offensive intentions. I apologize.
About McCaw, I still consider him a cheater, simply by the definition of cheater, which is somebody who plays behind or above the rules. But then again, we all agree to stick to the referees criteria, and if they didn't see anything punishable then it's not.
But rugby is and extremely hard to referee sport, probably the hardest I know, and we see things on tv that are not visible to guys on the field, that is why many people think McCaw is a cheat or similar and the referees can't catch them.
In my defense, I'll say that I already knew about Ireland/ british islands question, I even readed A Modest Proposal; I can only offer as an excuse that it was and innocent and inintencional sentence, product of the commom generalization, although probably rude and gross, of the "little islands over there". It shows that I can be a little unscrupulous sometimes, but I didn't do it with offensive intentions. I apologize.
About McCaw, I still consider him a cheater, simply by the definition of cheater, which is somebody who plays behind or above the rules. But then again, we all agree to stick to the referees criteria, and if they didn't see anything punishable then it's not.
But rugby is and extremely hard to referee sport, probably the hardest I know, and we see things on tv that are not visible to guys on the field, that is why many people think McCaw is a cheat or similar and the referees can't catch them.
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