Izzy Folau

[Kiwiwomble]

…aaaand ignored

My biggest problem with a lot or religion is, why would anyone want to follow a god petty enough to puckish people for not worshiping him/her…like a god

and, if it is all true, people are going to get punished anyway, why do we need to feel like we need to make them fell like shot whilst they’re on earth

 

[mania]

…aaaand ignored

My biggest problem with a lot or religion is, why would anyone want to follow a god petty enough to puckish people for not worshiping him/her…like a god

and, if it is all true, people are going to get punished anyway, why do we need to feel like we need to make them fell like shot whilst they’re on earth

agree. im a christian and raised as one in a hardcore churchy PI family. but im wondering about this celestial popularity contest and it doesnt make sense to me. if youre a supreme being then ultimately arent they all worshipping you?

 

[McTallshort]

I think you know but I'll humour you: homosexuality is immoral and unrepentant sinners go to the bad bad place. Ultimately there's no satisfactory explanation if you believe otherwise but here's mine: it doesn't lead to procreation, it's mostly about pleasure (but also adult diapers) and it is a choice (not the desire, but the act). God believers will deny potential pleasure to be closer to God, whose metaphysical love is far greater than any earthly pleasure, and then God gives us earthly joys anyway like hetero marriage and kids or a fulfilling career or life hobby or whatever else it may be.

hard to pick out all the hypocrisy in that but each to their own I suppose.

 

[Welsh Exile]

hard to pick out all the hypocrisy in that but each to their own I suppose.

Yeah, he didn’t really do a much better job at explaining it than Folau who he was annoyed at for how poorly he expressed it. In fact, his was worse. Lol.

 

[ncurd]

Note to self: Any person suffering from infertility or anyone who has gone through the menopause must abstain from sex because it can't lead to procreation.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Note to self: Any person suffering from infertility or anyone who has gone through the menopause must abstain from sex because it can't lead to procreation.

But as you rightly pointed out, this starts with contraception. Look at Mother Thresa and how she is regarded as this great woman (saint even) but the amount of damage she did was horrific. The church still does.

When they want to join the rest of us in the 21st century it will be nice, I suppose. I’m not holding my breath though

 

[McTallshort]

Yeah, he didn’t really do a much better job at explaining it than Folau who he was annoyed at for how poorly he expressed it. In fact, his was worse. Lol.

I know, apparently you have to deny yourself earthly pleasures to be closer to god but then god gives you earthly pleasures? and homosexuality is a sin because it doesn't result in procreation but adultery, sex out of wedlock does often result in procreation but they are also sins? Who the hell makes this stuff up.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

And what if you suppress your physical desire for some one of the same sex…for your entire life….become completely depress and kill yourself…hell…may as well have had an enjoyable life and go to hell

 

[Welsh Exile]

Who the hell makes this stuff up.

Humans. A couple of thousand years ago. He he.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Humans. A couple of thousand years ago. He he.

And a few hundred years after the people they claim to be the gospels of died…

 

[McTallshort]

And what if you suppress your physical desire for some one of the same sex…for your entire life….become completely depress and kill yourself…hell…may as well have had an enjoyable life and go to hell

Now hell? Is that the one where you spend eternity on your knees praising a nasty, bigoted being or the one where Satan lives?

 

[ncurd]

But as you rightly pointed out, this starts with contraception. Look at Mother Thresa and how she is regarded as this great woman (saint even) but the amount of damage she did was horrific. The church still does.

When they want to join the rest of us in the 21st century it will be nice, I suppose. I’m not holding my breath though

Oh yeah its more deeply complicated than most things, as a liberal I have no issue with practicing religious types having their beliefs. I have the issue when they decide to enforce those beliefs on others which is where rhetoric like Folau's leads to..

I could give many examples a friend of mine went through the trauma of loosing her sister and the baby at childbirth. She is genetically susceptible to be at extremely high risk of the same occurring to her, yet people say she and her husband must practice abstinence for the their entire lives as the only defence for what might happen to her.

 

[McTallshort]

And what if you suppress your physical desire for some one of the same sex…for your entire life….become completely depress and kill yourself…hell…may as well have had an enjoyable life and go to hell

ah! if you get depressed and kill yourself you will also go to hell so not only are you buggered (pardon the expression) if you do act on your perfectly normal sexuality, you also come a cropper if you decide not to and kill yourself. Amazing to think Alan Turing is a double sinner to the Christian church.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

@Tallshort that was my point

 

[Welsh Exile]

Oh yeah its more deeply complicated than most things, as a liberal I have no issue with practicing religious types having their beliefs. I have the issue when they decide to enforce those beliefs on others which is where rhetoric like Folau's leads to..

I could give many examples a friend of mine went through the trauma of loosing her sister and the baby at childbirth. She is genetically susceptible to be at extremely high risk of the same occurring to her, yet people say she and her husband must practice abstinence for the their entire lives as the only defence for what might happen to her.

Agreed. I would fight and give my life for people to believe in whatever god they choose to believe in and naturally people should be free to practise that religion in a church or whatever as long as it doesn’t infringe on other people, as you rightly say. But they need to keep their more silly ideas to themselves (like contraception is evil etc) as shown by Mother Theresa this does more harm than good

What we 100% need to do is remove it from our education system though. That’s both state and private. Children aren’t born Christians or muslims or whatever and school is about education, I find it really sad we still have religious schools.

 

[Yulia]

Now hell? Is that the one where you spend eternity on your knees praising a nasty, bigoted being or the one where Satan lives?

You are terrible you'll go to hell for sure
I'm still looking for the "truth" I'd say, reading different religious books, opinions etc (brought Quran when I've been to Turkey and have just started to read it by the way) , but I try not to sin anyway

 

[McTallshort]

You are terrible you'll go to hell for sure
I'm still looking for the "truth" I'd say, reading different religious books, opinions etc (brought Quran when I've been to Turkey and have just started to read it by the way) , but I try not to sin anyway

Yeah I know, I coped for at least 3 on the list Folau put out and I'm not even gay!

To me religion is just a way of controlling the masses and obtaining power. I am sure there are good and holy people (like my Aunt and Uncle) but for the most part its a flawed concept.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Yeah I know, I coped for at least 3 on the list Folau put out and I'm not even gay!

To me religion is just a way of controlling the masses and obtaining power. I am sure there are good and holy people (like my Aunt and Uncle) but for the most part its a flawed concept.

There’s loads of good religious people. In fact, I’d go as far as to say the majority of religious people are good (but I hold the opinion most people at their core are good people religion or no religion)

A special thing that only religion can do, though, is make perfectly nice, decent people do or say horrible things. I have devout family members who are nice enough and you’d think they’re good people if you met them. Ask them about their views on gays and other religious dogma **** and then a of a sudden your opinion changes.

As Hitchens said, there’s nothing moral that a religious person can do that an atheist can’t. But there’s loads of abhorrent moral things that only religious people can do (genital mutilation, suicide bombers etc etc)

 

[Yulia]

@Tallshort "opium for the masses" ? Yes, I also think about it sometimes, but I believe there's something "bigger" than human life and our souls are going somewhere after the death anyway

 

[McTallshort]

@Tallshort "opium for the masses" ? Yes, I also think about it sometimes, but I believe there's something "bigger" than human life and our souls are going somewhere after the death anyway

yes I think there is something "bigger" too but I refuse to live my only life in a way that is dictated to me by group who have read an old book and made some very dubious conclusions.