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World Cup 2023 Forum Awards

Cruz_del_Sur said:
I get AD is a freak, an unbelievable player. But are we really comparing him to DC?
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Suspect AD's a better 10 than DC was 9. 😀

You can only make valid comparisons at career end. But what's been won as part of a team isn't really valid in itself as that depends on the calibre of all the other players. I mean blimey I could have played 10 for DC's ABs…..
 
Jer1cho said:
Etzebeth was a raging bull loose Canon in the beginning. Look at him now at 31... Peaking and showing a huge rugby brain.
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Hmm, he was a raging bull and a bit of a card risk, but he was always rated one of our best. He was a monster in schoolboy rugby and at Varsity Cup (played a key role in the Ikeys 2011 ***le win). I do agree that he has added more nuance to his game in knowing dark arts of rucks (that ruck awareness vs England last year I think) and always being the player to come in and go for the ball when the ruck is over (I credit the Kolbe try this weekend to him - it was his well timed tackle on Dupont that caused that). But he has also maintained that raging bull ability in how he plays - see his try vs France.

He has probably been our best player consistently for the last ten years, and those test caps reflect that (even though we had that Covid loss of two years - He will have 119 caps by the end of this World Cup and likely has another cycle in him).

Sorry, completely went off on a tangent from your post for a Etzebeth appreciation piece
 
Chalk and cheese like comparing Etzebeth and saying he's no Dan Carter.
 
Vieux Talonneur said:
You can only make valid comparisons at career end.
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Well, let me put it this way: AD would have to win his next two world cups so that at the end of his career he could be in the same conversation as DC. He'd also need to win a couple of player of the year awards too.

And let me be clear, this is by no means a jab at AD. He is phenomenal, but that is just not enough if the benchmark is DC.
 
Jer1cho said:
He is amazing, but like on a GOAT list people putting him in the top 10 ahead of...
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I was thinking along those lines. Joost, George Gregan, Gareth Edwards, Fourie, Kirk, Berbizier... that's a hell of a roster to disregard.

Fourie's case is an interesting one. He is imo Top 2 most underrated players ever. He had everything and won everything he set his mind to. AND he had Joost's shadow lurking on everything he did or accomplished. Yet he excelled, again and again and again.
The only explanation I can think of is that he never played in Europe so half of Rugby's followers aren't really aware of how good he was (other than watching him on wcs, naturally).
 
Cruz_del_Sur said:
Well, let me put it this way: AD would have to win his next two world cups so that at the end of his career he could be in the same conversation as DC. He'd also need to win a couple of player of the year awards too.

And let me be clear, this is by no means a jab at AD. He is phenomenal, but that is just not enough if the benchmark is DC.
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DC only won world cup, he didn't play a single knock out game in 2011. He has a winners medal but its definitely more a technicality than saying he won two world cups.
 
Just so i understand this correctly: you are arguing that saying he won 2011's wc is technically correct but not really bona fide as he only played 4 out of the 7 games?
Do I understand your argument correctly?

I take it you dont consider, dunno, the likes of Frans Steyn a double WC winner then?
If the sub of a team that wins the WC plays more games but fewer minutes than Carter in 2011, did he really win it?


As pedantic and silly as these questions sound, they all are inevitable if you open that box.
 
Cruz_del_Sur said:
Just so i understand this correctly: you are arguing that saying he won 2011's wc is technically correct but not really bona fide as he only played 4 out of the 7 games?
Do I understand your argument correctly?

I take it you dont consider, dunno, the likes of Frans Steyn a double WC winner then?
If the sub of a team that wins the WC plays more games but fewer minutes than Carter in 2011, did he really win it?


As pedantic and silly as these questions sound, they all are inevitable if you open that box.
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He only played in two games of the seven both in the group stages. I remember a lot of the talk in 2015 was about him hopefully properly winning it as he hadn't really done so 2011 even from AB fans.
 
ncurd said:
He only played in two games of the seven both in the group stages. I remember a lot of the talk in 2015 was about him hopefully properly winning it as he hadn't really done so 2011 even from AB fans.
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a lot? i was here for both those RWCs and dont remember any such talk, in fact this is the first i remember anyone suggesting he didn't "really" win in 2011
 
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Ragey Erasmus said:
New category: Biggest thread derailer. I nominate all the above.

Honourable mention: The Irish when a whole thread gets Irished.
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not even close, i doubt anyone has even blocked anyone else yet...early days yet
 
Kiwiwomble said:
i was here for both those RWCs and dont remember any such talk, in fact this is the first i remember anyone suggesting he didn't "really" win in 2011
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Well if you guys wanna call a double world cup winner a guy played two games in one sure go for it.

I'm mainly bantering here. DC was a superb player and one of the best of his generation. It was tragedy he got injured that year.

Just remwmber Wilkinson played in twice as many finals but has half the world cup winners medals.
 
ncurd said:
Well if you guys wanna call a double world cup winner a guy played two games in one sure go for it.

I'm mainly bantering here. DC was a superb player and one of the best of his generation. It was tragedy he got injured that year.

Just remwmber Wilkinson played in twice as many finals but has half the world cup winners medals.
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unless we're going to start giving medals to only those that play in the actual final then this all seems a bit weird, there will be loads of squad players that never played in the knockout stages

really coming across like some stretch to take a swipe at DC for some reason, did he not sign your jersey after a game or something?
 
Kiwiwomble said:
unless we're going to start giving medals to only those that play in the actual final then this all seems a bit weird, there will be loads of squad players that never played in the knockout stages

really coming across like some stretch to take a swipe at DC for some reason, did he not sign your jersey after a game or something?
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If I'm honest I don't like all squad members get medals. But I appreciate why it happens.

Anyway this just because someone said AD needed to win two world cups to be DC equivalent. And AD was vastly overrated (with a whole bunch of incorrect statements). I have nothing against DC other than I'd have McCaw in my side over him as best ABs player I've watched (in a side of can only pick one player from each nation).
 
ncurd said:
If I'm honest I don't like all squad members get medals. But I appreciate why it happens.

Anyway this just because someone said AD needed to win two world cups to be DC equivalent. And AD was vastly overrated (with a whole bunch of incorrect statements). I have nothing against DC other than I'd have McCaw in my side over him as best ABs player I've watched (in a side of can only pick one player from each nation).
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So which 23 nations are you picking from? Going strictly by Rugby World Rankings, or your own flavour of nation selection?

I'm interested to know which position the player from Russia is taking.
 

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