The Improvement of Tier Two Nations - In Particular Georgia.

[Jayatron]

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/rugbyw...0927.html#ambitious+georgia+building+rwc+2015


Interesting read. What do you all think?

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

I think Nijaradze is correct, more pressure must be put on tier 1 countries to play tier 2 countries on a more regular basis. With Lapasset's re-election as IRB president, this is an achieveable target.

I'd also like to see a Georgian team in the Amlin Cup- a composite side of the best players still plying their trade in Georgia. The more players who are exposed to a higher level, the better.

 

[Peat]

While there does need to be more games between tier 1s and tier 2s, the more important part of getting a tier 2 like Georgia to the required standard lies in getting the coaches over and then pushing the promising prospects into more competitive leagues. Which they have been doing, so credit there. I think there is a very limited benefit to players in playing these big matches if it is then not backed up by a high standard of coaching and opposition week in week out.

Also, unless there is a wonder generation of Georgian backs just about to bubble over that I am unaware of, they're so not making the quarter finals. It feels improbable enough for the Italians to target them at this stage, nevermind Georgia!

 

[Seaton]

While there does need to be more games between tier 1s and tier 2s, the more important part of getting a tier 2 like Georgia to the required standard lies in getting the coaches over and then pushing the promising prospects into more competitive leagues. Which they have been doing, so credit there. I think there is a very limited benefit to players in playing these big matches if it is then not backed up by a high standard of coaching and opposition week in week out.

Also, unless there is a wonder generation of Georgian backs just about to bubble over that I am unaware of, they're so not making the quarter finals. It feels improbable enough for the Italians to target them at this stage, nevermind Georgia!

I ask again, is it Hear Hear or Here Here?

Simply bigger opposition and getting your arse handed to you on a silver platter does little to improve the overall state of a country or clubs situation. Certainly provides little help when the generation of players that have 'improved' retires and there is nothing to follow up on.

 

[Seaton]

While there does need to be more games between tier 1s and tier 2s, the more important part of getting a tier 2 like Georgia to the required standard lies in getting the coaches over and then pushing the promising prospects into more competitive leagues. Which they have been doing, so credit there. I think there is a very limited benefit to players in playing these big matches if it is then not backed up by a high standard of coaching and opposition week in week out.

Also, unless there is a wonder generation of Georgian backs just about to bubble over that I am unaware of, they're so not making the quarter finals. It feels improbable enough for the Italians to target them at this stage, nevermind Georgia!

I ask again, is it Hear Hear or Here Here?

Simply bigger opposition and getting your arse handed to you on a silver platter does little to improve the overall state of a country or clubs situation. Certainly provides little help when the generation of players that have 'improved' retires and there is nothing to follow up on.

 

[racingmetrofan]

I think that big profile international games is the last thing that a tier two nation should get in their development. Most impotent is a competitive domestic league, and then access to a higher standard international league (e.g. the Amlin), then maybe even Heinekin qualification. Players don't learn their trade in the international team, 99% of the time it's their club coaches and the 22 or more club games at a reasonable standard each year.

 

[LittleGuy]

Last full cap meetings between Canada and the Tier One teams.

New Zealand: October 2nd 2011 RWC, previous to this was a match on June 16th 2007.
France: September 18th 2011 RWC, previous to this was November 12th 2005.
Wales: May 30th 2009
Ireland: May 23rd 2009
Scotland: November 21st 2008
Australia: September 29th 2007 RWC, previous to this was June 29th 1996.
Italy: November 26th 2006, (A match is scheduled for this June between the two sides)
Argentina: July 2nd 2005, (Also a win for Canada, this length of time is really surpising to me as we are both in the same IRB Americas region)
England: November 13th, 2004
South Africa: June 10th, 2000

 

[Jayatron]

I think Nijaradze is correct, more pressure must be put on tier 1 countries to play tier 2 countries on a more regular basis. With Lapasset's re-election as IRB president, this is an achieveable target.

I'd also like to see a Georgian team in the Amlin Cup- a composite side of the best players still plying their trade in Georgia. The more players who are exposed to a higher level, the better.

I have to agree here. Getting an Georgian team into the Amlin is so important. The establishment of a professional league is great but the next step is some cross boarder competition, like the Amlin.

Follow that up with some home tests against some Tier One nation, like England, who they pushed pretty far in the RWC, you have all the components for Georgia to bridge the gap. Lessons will be learned, win or loose.

There will be some nations that will close the gap, Georgia will be one.

 

[welshglory]

It was great to see all the lower ranked countries put in good performances. But unfortunately since this world cup lost money rather than make it there will be less money to go these countries to continue to develop.
To add insult to injury Laurie Mains the former allblack coach claimed before the world cup that since the AllBlacks are the no1 in world rugby they are entitled to a greater share of the profits from the world cup. Talk about greedy *******.

 

[Croket66]

Future is bright for Georgia.

Here is a list of players to follow :

Loosehead Props :
Vasil Kakovin (CA Brive, Top14) - only 22 years old, he is in the Top14 best XV of the mid-season by rugbyrama and Midi Olympique
Davit Khinchagishvili (CA Brive, Top14) - 29 years old and 9th season in Top14 for this experimented prop
Anton Peikrishvili (Castres Olympique, Top14) - 24 years old, he played all Heineken Cup games for Castres this season
Goderzi Shvelidze (Montpellier HRC, Top14) - 33 years old and 11 Top14 seasons
Mikheil Nariashvili (Montpellier HRC, Top14) - only 21 years old, he played all Heineken Cup games this season
Zurab Zhvania (Stade Français, Espoirs U23) - 20 years old, he actually plays a good season for Stade Français U23 team

Hookers :
Irakli Natriashvili (CA Brive, Top14) - 27 years old, for his first season in Top14, he played 13 of the 14 games of his team
Aksventi Giorgadze (Stade Toulousain, Top14) - 35 years old, after 6 seasons for Castres, he signs for Toulouse as medical joker of Gary Botha
Giorgi Lomtadze (Bradford & Bingley, National League 3) - 19 years old, he plays for the Bees senior squad

Tighthead Props :
Giorgi Jgenti (Montpellier HRC, Top14) - 26 years old, he is in the Top14 best XV of the mid-season by rugbyrama and Midi Olympique
Davit Zirakashvili (ASM Clermont, Top14) - 28 years old, the 2010 Top14 champion plays his 8th season for Clermont
Davit Kubriashvili (RC Toulon, Top14) - 25 years old, he played 76 games in Top14
Beka Shekhlashvili (SU Agen, Top14) - 25 years old, third Top14 season
Val Rapava (Saracens Storm, Aviva A-League) - 19 years old, this former n°8 signs for Saracens after a good season with the Western Province U19 as prop
Levan Chilichava (RC Toulon, Espoirs U23) - only 20 years old, he played one game in Amlin Cup this season
Giorgi Jashitashvili (ASM Clermont, Espoirs U23) - 22 years old, he plays with Clermont U23 team

Locks :
Levan Datunashvili (Stade Aurillacois, ProD2) - 28 years old, he is the first choice in his club
Konstantin Mikautadze (RC Toulon, Top14) - only 20 years old, he scored his first Top14 try against Agen. He also played 2 Amlin Cup games

Third Row :
Mamuka Gorgodze (Montpellier HRC, Top14) - 27 years old, he was elected "Best foreign player of the Top14" by Midi Olympique
Dimitri Basilaia (Valence d'Agen, Fédérale1) - 26 years old, he made and impressive RWC and scored one try against England, maybe a future Top14 player
Giorgi Chkhaidze (AS Saint-Junien, Fédérale1) - 30 years old, actually in Federale1, he played in Top14 last two seasons
Vito Kolelishvili (ASM Clermont, Espoirs U23) - 22 years old, he made a good RWC 2011

Scrum Halves :

Fly Halves :
Merab Kvirikashvili (AS Saint-Junien, Fédérale1) - 28 years old, considered like the best georgian back

Centres :
Tedo Zibzibadze (CA Périgueux, ProD2) - 31 years old, he is actually the only georgian back at professional level
Merab Sharikadze (Gloucester, U19 team) - only 18 years old, he played for Hartpury College U18 team last year
David Losaberidze (Section Paloise, Espoirs U23) - 20 years old, former n°8, the powerfull centre played pre-season games with the senior squad
Giorgi Jimsheladze (ASM Clermont, Espoirs U23) - 22 years old, he played IRB Nations Cup for Georgia

Wings/Full Backs :
Saba Labadze (RC Toulon, U19 team) - 19 years old, he is the son of Grigol Labadze
Sandro Nijaradze (Gloucester, A-League) - 23 years old, very good seven player

 

[Peat]

Does the green mark uncapped players? Because we will poach Sharikadze and Rapava if they're any good and you don't before they've done three years. Without mercy or hesitation. That's the way England rolls.

Thanks for the information anyway.

 

[Croket66]

in green = players in a young category
Rapava and Sharikadze are uncapped but plays with Georgia U19
the georgian is proud, i'm not sure they prefer plays for England

 

[powerfulduck]

I'd like to see Georgia play a few tests against Italy before the next WC, I think in tblisi the italian's would struggle. But i agree a place in the Amlin for there top domestic team or a XV from there league would help them more.

 

[Bail]

Poaching Georgians is not easy. They're proud to contribute in the rise of their nation. Sadly, we can't say the same for Tim Visser and many others...

 

[Peat]

Poaching Georgians is not easy. They're proud to contribute in the rise of their nation. Sadly, we can't say the same for Tim Visser and many others...

Have there been attempts to half-inch some Georgian props for the French cause then?

I would prefer it if they were proud and built their nation, so good on them, and I hope that's what they all do. But England will ask if they're good enough and available, that is practically a given, and plenty of players have opted to play for a nation other than of their birth (while still being proud of it) in order to play international rugby at the highest level - plus you never know how they'll feel at the end of their formative years.

Hopefully my jokey warning (not a prediction) is wrong, but it wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Seaton]

Poaching Georgians is not easy. They're proud to contribute in the rise of their nation. Sadly, we can't say the same for Tim Visser and many others...

I just hope that when Visser plays for Scotland, that people will not go on about how we poached him from the Netherlands.

But I doubt they will care that Visser moved to Scotland to play internationals at the 'highest level.'

 

[HowieLO6]

One thing that would certainly help these Tier Two nations, and one that I thought (mistakenly?) was already being considered would be the inclusion of a plate-esque knockout at the World Cup.

Taking the games to the smaller, provincial stadiums, why not have those teams placed 3rd and 4th in the groups playing in a comparative knockout competition? Would give all involved a piece of silverware to strive towards, whilst giving the benefit of at least one additional game that would, hopefully, be a rather closer affair. I know i'd be keen to see a couple of these Tier Two nations slug it out for some silverware in a small, packed ground.

Just a thought.

 

[Nielsch]

How come Georgia produces so many props?

Also, a tier one nationa like Wales or Italy playing an away test against Georgia would surely mean a sold out Boris Paichadze stadium in Tblisi. Some have already pointed out that it is more important to have a team in the Amlin or whatever, but a high profile match in Georgia could spark a flame and mean a lot for grassroots rugby in Georgia.

 

[Nielsch]

Different situation all together. Visser playing for Scotland might actually do more for Dutch rugby than him playing for the Netherlands. He already gets some attention over here cause he's the only professional Dutch player and that attention will only increase when Visser debutes for Scotland. Who knows, they might even show a live Scotland match on Dutch television.

 

[Nielsch]

Everyone's talking about Georgia (and rightly so) but what about Canada? They beat Tonga at the RWC and drew 10.000 people to the BMO Stadium in Toronto for a match with the USA. They've got a professional rugby competition in place with the Americas Rugby Championship (at least I think) and they've got lots of players playing in Europe.