Test Match 3: All Blacks v British & Irish Lions (Auckland)

[Nubiwan]

Not from that range and out in front, it was a gimme.

He's missed a couple of them in fairness.

 

[munstermuffin]

He's missed a couple of them in fairness.

He's certainly not an assured kicker. Is he the best in NZ?

 

[Nubiwan]

Not from that range and out in front, it was a gimme.

He's missed a couple of them in fairness.

Really?
If you go back to the start of the series and asked the Lions fans if they would take a win, loss and draw they would have bitten your hand off.

Yes indeed, but if you as them now, there might be a few "what ifs....."

Fairly proud of the Lions achievement, and on the heals of Englands 3 game sweep of the Ozzies (which, at the time was a pretty big deal), then a decent 12 months for Northern Hem Rugby.

 

[The Jones Boy]

The NZ'ers are nothing special.

Oh dear....

 

[munstermuffin]

He's missed a couple of them in fairness.

Yes indeed, but if you as them now, there might be a few "what ifs....."

Fairly proud of the Lions achievement, and on the heals of Englands 3 game sweep of the Ozzies (which, at the time was a pretty big deal), then a decent 12 months for Northern Hem Rugby.

Add in Ireland beating All Blacks and Scotland beating Australia it's been superb 12 months

 

[The5thOfficial]

All I will say is wheather I'm right or wrong it's an opinion forum but if it's Valley Commando backing you up I will just leave it as well I won't argue with trolls.

On your longer post. I never disagreed he was unbeaten in series just how others may see it.

Again you keep inventing things but yoy seem to not understand the history and values.
And lastly I'm not sure what you meant by "Wales and Lions" bit but on regular posters some think Gatland has outstayed in Wales so I won't argue anymore as you seem to be like Valley Commando and trolling so best of luck

Hmmm! troll the trolls - seems to be the answer for those who don't have an answer!

So you're giving others opinions, not your own? I see!

Quite possibly Gatland is coming to the end of his Wales tenure, but he eluded as much in his post match interview. After the RWC in 2019 his phone is on.

Inventing things, such as? History and Values were invented way, way, way before the professional ere. Now its about results with that comradarie thrown in. The four nations gelled and took the ABs to a draw. Result. Ah, that word again, result! not the 'result' everyone wanted but a result!

I'm not a troll, I just say it as it is - maybe a simplified view, but hey ho! Explain to me how I have trolled? Or VC is this thread with regards to my posts, for that matter?

 

[Nubiwan]

Jeez you had that picture fairly handy mate.

Hmm - that was a bit uncomfortable..... .

 

[The Jones Boy]

Take a scratch side to play the AB's and draw the series, this makes him one of the greatest coaches of his generation.

It's true, when you look at what gatland has achieved historically, it's a major achievement.
He came away with a drawn series in NZ for the Lions.
That's no mean feat.

 

[munstermuffin]

Hmmm! troll the trolls - seems to be the answer for those who don't have an answer!

So you're giving others opinions, not your own? I see!

Quite possibly Gatland is coming to the end of his Wales tenure, but he eluded as much in his post match interview. After the RWC in 2019 his phone is on.

Inventing things, such as? History and Values were invented way, way, way before the professional ere. Now its about results with that comradarie thrown in. The four nations gelled and took the ABs to a draw. Result. Ah, that word again, result! not the 'result' everyone wanted but a result!

I'm not a troll, I just say it as it is - maybe a simplified view, but hey ho! Explain to me how I have trolled? Or VC is this thread with regards to my posts, for that matter?

Ok last reply
1. I've answered everything with rewson so again you don't agree fair enough.

2. Yes Gatland has said he's done in 2019. But I think he's gone stale with Wales now. Some Welsh fans think that too. If you don't agree. Again fair enough.

3. We obviously have different lessons and views on Lions again. You don't agree fair enough.

4. I think your trolling from looking at your posts etc. If I'm wrong fair enough but will let you ho now. Best of luck

 

[Bada-Bing!]

OK
The big difference between the 2005 and 2017 sides is that the 2005 Lions side was rubbish and they had a rubbish coach in Woodward.
The 2017 Lions were much better across the board and they had a much better coach.
Gatland's Lions side created pressure on the All Blacks that the 2005 Lions could never hope to match.
To look at BB and DC outside of that context is simply unfair.

Secondly, at this very early stage of BB's career, he's got a better running game than Carter, thats a big statement because DC was a super running first five but Barrett is another step up, he is faster and harder to tackle. His Garry Owen (up and under) is just as good as DC, his cross field kicking is just as good, but his place kicking is behind DC. That can come in time.
They can both tackle above their weight group.
I used to worry about DC getting crunched but he was remarkably resilient. BB is made of the same bendy stuff.
DC always played alongside the great McCaw.
BB doesn't have that kind of luxury.
He can ignite the backline but BB's backline is not settled or experienced, especially with SBW out of the picture. The cohesion isn't there and it's unfair to compare them when you have virtual debutantes coming into the back line. ALB has what 13? caps, Lamaupe 2, J Barrett 2. Combinations like Nonu and Smith take time and continuity to prepare and develop.
DC rarely if ever had three noobs in his backline.
DC is a legend, but Barrett is made of the same stuff, he just needs his team to catch him up.

The upcoming RC will be an excellent gauge of his ability to overcome theese issues and show his leadership skills.

BB doesn't yet have DC's control of the match/game management yet either. I've yet to see him go for a drop goal at a crucial moment in a big game. 15-15 would have been ideal to recognise to go for it. DC pretty much turned both RWC semi and final for ABs by dropping two fine ones. Something he realised only later in his career to utilise.

Not sure BB will ever be as good a place kicker as DC. I think Jordie will be the long term place kicker for the ABs either as a 12 or 15.

 

[The5thOfficial]

Ok last reply
1. I've answered everything with rewson so again you don't agree fair enough.

2. Yes Gatland has said he's done in 2019. But I think he's gone stale with Wales now. Some Welsh fans think that too. If you don't agree. Again fair enough.

3. We obviously have different lessons and views on Lions again. You don't agree fair enough.

4. I think your trolling from looking at your posts etc. If I'm wrong fair enough but will let you ho now. Best of luck

Just weird!

 

[The Jones Boy]

Add in Ireland beating All Blacks and Scotland beating Australia it's been superb 12 months

Nobody beats Ireland 29 times in a row.

 

[bushytop]

Gatland deserves credit he has preserved the Lions, he has achieved more than any Lions coach since Carwyn James, a scratch side v the AB's and a drawn series, however there are plenty of sour faced losers who would have rather we lost the series (heavily) pretty pathetic really. He has saved the Lions and should be thanked.

I think that Gatland was 'headhunted' during the 09 SA tour with a strong recommendation from Geechs that he could actually be the man to win a Lions series in NZ (post the 2005 disaster). BOD and Geechs have gone on record on the fact that in this modern professional age of rugby, the only way to be effective against NZ in particular, with a scratch side of egos is to go simple, efficient and consistent (what eventually became the much maligned 'Warrenball' jibe). It was thought that anything past a 'certain degree of complexity' would be too much to implement on such a short intensive tour. Well if this is correct, WG got the Aus tour as preparation and emerged successfully and with a lot more experience to boot. NZ was next...

I guess the experiment didn't quite come off but in the post 2005 Lions wasteland, I applaud both the foresight and attempt at implementation of such an 'ambitious' (seems slightly sarcastic given the consistently perceived method of play) long term plan.

 

[munstermuffin]

Nobody beats Ireland 29 times in a row.

Ha ha true. Was a great achievement for us though. And as I said I'm not sure if Northern Hemisphere have massively improved or NZ have gone back a bit but gap is closing. Look New Zealand are still #1 but gap closing

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Shame it had to end in such a poor display from both sides. Thought I was watching schools for a large parts of that contest.

That's what pressure does when there's a real prize at stake. For me the tension was far more enthralling than watching a try fest.

Bet this will stick in the memory longer than most AI, Championship or even 6N matches.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Nobody beats Ireland 29 times in a row.

Nice adaptation of the late Vitas Gerulaitis famous quote.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Nice adaptation of the late Vitas Gerulaitis famous quote.

I plagiarised it off an Irish friend of mine who sent it through after their famous victory in Chicago.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

I plagiarised it off an Irish friend of mine who sent it through after their famous victory in Chicago.

The Original quote is by Vitas Gerulitis after who finally won a match against Jimmy Connors at the 17th time of asking. But it works for Ireland.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Ha ha true. Was a great achievement for us though. And as I said I'm not sure if Northern Hemisphere have massively improved or NZ have gone back a bit but gap is closing. Look New Zealand are still #1 but gap closing

It's actually both.
NZ were always going to drop back from the high of 2015 when all those capped players departed simultaneously.
Great teams are cyclical.
We have had great players come along and help to plug the gaps but there is no Conrad Smith or Nonu and in this series we really missed the mercurial Ben Smith. His elan and experience would have been of grreat value.
So this new look backline of new players will take time to gel and compose itself with familiarity.

Ireland are improving under Schmidt, They can beat anyone on their day.
Wales are capable of beating anyone under Gatland
England are the fastest improvers under Eddie Jones, they are really coming on. They will be the ones to watch in Japan.
Scotland have been resurgent.
Aussie have dropped off
France are climbing back slowly
The Japies look to have turned a corner and they are coming back stronger again.

 

[The Jones Boy]

The Original quote is by Vitas Gerulitis after who finally won a match against Jimmy Connors at the 17th time of asking. But it works for Ireland.

Yeah I know, I remember watching the game on telly, yes, I am that old.