Test Match 3: All Blacks v British & Irish Lions (Auckland)

[nik]

Draw was probably a fair result over 3 tests but NZ imo were quite underwhelming in all 3 tests. They should have put the Lions away quite comfortably who, could themselves have won the series with more composure in the final 3rd. Would keep the 3 test series but in future if it's a draw after 3 tests we go into extra time.

I have been thinking about this. If it has to go to extra time then it has to be any of the three tests not just the third. For example team A wins 1st test, 2nd test is a draw and team B wins the 3rd test - the series is drawn. So extra time applicable in all 3 tests.

 

[nik]

Draw was probably a fair result over 3 tests but NZ imo were quite underwhelming in all 3 tests. They should have put the Lions away quite comfortably who, could themselves have won the series with more composure in the final 3rd. Would keep the 3 test series but in future if it's a draw after 3 tests we go into extra time.

I have been thinking about this. If it has to go to extra time then it has to be any of the three tests not just the third. For example team A wins 1st test, 2nd test is a draw and team B wins the 3rd test - the series is drawn. So extra time applicable in all 3 tests.

 

[ncurd]

Eh I'm a Cricket fan I'm perfectly happy with the concept of a draw.

 

[JonoCymru]

I have been thinking about this. If it has to go to extra time then it has to be any of the three tests not just the third. For example team A wins 1st test, 2nd test is a draw and team B wins the 3rd test - the series is drawn. So extra time applicable in all 3 tests.

Fair point, yes. If I was Romain at full time yesterday the rule book would have gone out the window. Get both teams and captains together along with both sets of management. Do you want to continue and play extra time? You've got 5 minutes to decide. I feel both would wanted to continue and the fans. A draw is neither here nor there for either side and Drawn series should be scrapped in future tours.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Eh I'm a Cricket fan I'm perfectly happy with the concept of a draw.

I'm happy with the draw as well, not a big fan of extra time unless absolutely necessary (cup knockouts).


It's why I'm also fine with the idea of a 4 test series with a match at each home nation stadium vs a touring SH side.

 

[valley commando]

Been watching this thread for a while and surprised how bitter some have become, i mean what did people expect with gatland as coach??? really?? He has a record of picking players he has a personality with or lick his ass I should know being welsh trust me, alyn wyn should be nowhere near that team , his god awful form for the ospreys confirms this, but again gats alawys picks his bum boys, I cant shoot warbs down as much but hes nothing special then again I didnt see anyone else claiming that jersey. Thank god liam got the chance to shine at full back and I think overall he was worthy of his selection , JD2 definately deserved his selection without doubt, Im just sick of all the welsh hatred bitterness in this tournament, its not like the WRU appointed gats as coach , its nothing to do with the WRU . Infact its RFU who appoint that call so start blaming yourseleves before anyone else.. also on selection, Scarlets won the pro 12 this year and demolished leinster and Munster in the process and the. Scarlets are predominantly Welsh team, Owens , jon Davies , steff Evans etc, before your English lads go bashing us Welsh it was your rugby union that decides the coach so **** off?.. as far as select too s are merited well we did beat the Irish and lost at the death to an English team in acendancy ,not so bad this ,6 nations was closer than any before so do t make out like England were dominate . England can't say they would beat the all blacks until they play them and until then the ABs are the no1 team in the world still.

I disagree with the Gatland comments we were pretty average when he came to Wales, he's improved the players but more importantly he's improved the attitude and professionalism of the 1st class game in Wales. Warburton is a fine player that you only really appreciate if you watch a few times in replay when fully fit he would walk into most sides, I also like the way he leads a team.
But you have hit the nail firmly on the head with the rest of your post, we used to get anti Welsh comments from just England but the Scots and Irish have joined in over the last couple of seasons.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I wouldn't be against the idea of a longer 4 match series if it encouraged the use of a larger squad, for example in this lions squad we had a ton of top players who never featured at all in a match 23. However, assuming that most coaches would still attempt to pick the same ish match squad it doesn't seem feasible to have 4 80 minute tests within 3 weeks. Not good for player welfare.

On a related note I'm interested in the idea of limiting the number of minutes that can be played per player in tournaments and leagues to encourage player welfare as well as more squad rotation. However, I get that this disadvantages smaller squads of squads with fewer resources.

 

[valley commando]

I wouldn't be against the idea of a longer 4 match series if it encouraged the use of a larger squad, for example in this lions squad we had a ton of top players who never featured at all in a match 23. However, assuming that most coaches would still attempt to pick the same ish match squad it doesn't seem feasible to have 4 80 minute tests within 3 weeks. Not good for player welfare.

On a related note I'm interested in the idea of limiting the number of minutes that can be played per player in tournaments and leagues to encourage player welfare as well as more squad rotation. However, I get that this disadvantages smaller squads of squads with fewer resources.

Maybe they should introduce a squad must for example have a squad of 35 players all teams registering an equal number of players for each competition (I think they use a similar criteria in the European Cup comps.

 

[JonoCymru]

In terms of future Tours, how likely is it Argentina would be included? Would they have to win a Championship or RWC to be considered ''Worth it''? Do you then make a Lions tour every two or 3 years to accommodate the new 4th team? It must be on the agenda somewhere down the line. They're playing consistently with the big boys now.

 

[munstermuffin]

In terms of future Tours, how likely is it Argentina would be included? Would they have to win a Championship or RWC to be considered ''Worth it''? Do you then make a Lions tour every two or 3 years to accommodate the new 4th team? It must be on the agenda somewhere down the line. They're playing consistently with the big boys now.

Argentina won't be considered as they're not good enough. And don't have teams good enough to supply tour games. Also can't be a gap less than 4 years as it'd impact world cups and summer tours

 

[JonoCymru]

Argentina won't be considered as they're not good enough. And don't have teams good enough to supply tour games. Also can't be a gap less than 4 years as it'd impact world cups and summer tours

Yeah, just read an article they have a shortage of clubs so a full tour isn't practical. There was/is talk of a test v Argentina on the SA tour, though.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Enjoyed reading your posts mate.

...and I yours, a Bro-mance is born, Lol.

One last question. "The Jones Boy" - what's that about? Some sort of homage to Ian Jones.

The Kamo Kid? I have a house a few miles from Kamo in Whangarei. I'm moving the family there in late November later this year.
Close, but no banana.

Michael Jones.
For me the greatest natural rugby player I have ever seen. (Former Auckland and All Black coach John Hart called him the greatest rugby player ever)
An incredible competitor, a rugby world cup winner who asked for no quarter and didn't give any, but off the park was a complete gentleman, and a compassionate intellect.
His long career saw him pick up half a dozen nick names as he transitioned from an explosive debut as a lean youngster to when he filled out and went from 7 to blindside and occasionally no.8.
His first nick name was a label applied when he first burst open our screens with an electrifying amalgamation of pace, anticipation and a complete disregard for his own well being.
He was the first truly modern (sniffer) open side flanker spanning the amatuer to professional cross over.
They called him, 'The Jones Boy'.
He's my rugby hero above all others.
NZ is a bit weird in that no.7, open side flanker, is strangely revered above all other positions.
You would think it would be a glory boy spot like first five eighth (no.10 to the rest of the world)
Luminaries like Dan Carter, Frano Botica, Andrew Mehrtens, Grant Fox, Carlos Spencer the list goes on especially if you add in the great first fives from around the world like Noddy Lynagh, Naas Botha, Hugo Porta, Johnny Wilkinson, Rob Andrew, Phil Bennett, Joanthan Davies, Joel Stransky, Mark Ella, Stephen Larkham, Ollie Campbell, Barry John, Neil Jenkins... magical players.
Yet in NZ no.7 still holds a special place in the heart of the rugby fraternity.
Younger folk give their allegiance, understandably, to the great McCaw, and why wouldn't they?
Some older boys might opt for 'The Black Panther', the great Waka Nathan, or Graham Mourie, the father of modern flankers.
My choice remains the same...
He could have had many more caps and tries but he refused to play on Sundays because of his religious beliefs.

 

[munstermuffin]

Yeah, just read an article they have a shortage of clubs so a full tour isn't practical. There was/is talk of a test v Argentina on the SA tour, though.

Yes but that game would be treated as a tour game played in Europe like 2005.
And Lions will be careful not to overload games especially as the contract is up for renewal and looks like yours will be shortened with PRL threatening to withdraw English players

 

[munstermuffin]

Also for interesting stats.
Lions lead for all of 3 minutes in test games
Lions had 33% of ball over 3 tests
And had least amount of visits of any tier 1 team in to an opponents 22 in 2017 so far in test 3

 

[General Melchett]

The SBW red card decided the series and salvaged a draw for the Lions IMO. Had that not happened and the ref didn't downgrade his last minute call yesterday we could quite easily have been looking at 3-0.

 

[Saint Matt]

Everything is connected in rugby. NZ dropped some crucial ball yesterday but they were put under some decent pressure. The Lions got caught out a few times on the fringes but I thought the line speed around the ruck was strong in all three tests, unfortunately if you lose the ruck whilst defending that way, that can sometimes tie players closer to the breakdown and guys a bit wider find themselves isolated. I thought the players scrambled well and found ways to put themselves in the frame defensively. Lots of effort.

With the ball I thought we had them under the cosh at times, although NZ did probably have the better of it particularly in the first half. Amongst all the talk of NZ errors, we had two brilliant set piece opportunities in the second half that we blew and we had three HIA tests as well. Probably didn't keep hold of the ball well enough at times but as I say, defensively I thought both teams were strong around the breakdown. Some brilliant players on both teams, they had more understanding because they've played with and know each other. The Lions support players were waiting for the ball player to make the decision, a couple of weeks ago many of them wouldn't have even met.

I thought Itoje was awesome, for a young guy to come up against an experienced pairing and handle himself as well as he did showed true courage, he's got some future. I thought Warburton had a real go, Jonathan Davies was brilliant all series, some real good displays on both sides. Owen Farrell didn't have the best of games but steps up with 3 mins to go and hits a belter from 40 odd metres. Takes guts, same with Elliot Daly. Unbelievable kick.

I think they can proud of themselves, to come together in such a short period of time and draw a series is a fair effort. Both teams had opportunities on Saturday but probably didn't make the most of them.

Great series, loved it.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Michael Jones.

My choice remains the same...
He could have had many more caps and tries but he refused to play on Sundays because of his religious beliefs.

He suffered a really Nasty knee injury as well didn't he which meant he was ruled out for some time and when he returned he didn't have the same pace. Then reinvented himself as a 6, where he was also world class.

 

[Scotty]

What would have been different this tour if eddie jones was coach instead of gatland and onv replaced howley?

Part from launchbury getting a call up not the random welshmen

What do people think? Meaning difference in decision making, selection, dealing with media and in game man management? I think gatland failed on most of these points.

EJ for england takes the flak from media. Takes players off at 20 min if thwy playing bad. And other things and howley is just terrible as an attack coach

What do people think?

 

[JonoCymru]

I

What would have been different this tour if eddie jones was coach instead of gatland and onv replaced howley?

Part from launchbury getting a call up not the random welshmen

What do people think? Meaning difference in decision making, selection, dealing with media and in game man management? I think gatland failed on most of these points.

EJ for england takes the flak from media. Takes players off at 20 min if thwy playing bad. And other things and howley is just terrible as an attack coach

What do people think?

In terms of the media i think Gatland's had the last laugh. They've called him a clown, slagged him off and he's turned up to the presser wearing a red nose. A royal two fingers upto the media from him. You can say he's failed on certain points but he hasn't, really. He's succeeded and got a win and a draw against New Zealand with a scratch team. Whether Gatland can take this success and get Wales back on track, though remains to be seen.

 

[User1245]

I quite enjoyed this Test series. A real arm wrestle with lots of drama. The rugby wasn't the highest quality though.
As a neutral South African a draw was a great outcome. The All Black didn't win another trophy, and the Brits (and Irish) didn't win (sorry Wales, Scotland and Ireland but you're in bed with the Poms and we all know how they are when they win anything).

Great heart showed by the Lions to disrupt the All Black's natural game. That rush defence made them change their approach and it was particularly noticeable in the 3rd Test with the ball being shift away from the 10-12 channel with much urgency.