SURVEY: Japan or Singapore to be the 18th Super Rugby Team?

[Jaguares]

Congrats Japan!

 

[Superalexmarket]

It's official !! SANZAR CEO Greg Peters announced the inclusion of a franchise from Argentina and one from Japan to the SR, plus a new team from South Africa.

 

[iINDOMINUSxx]

i thought this was going to be too obvious tbh, the Japanese are simply much stronger than singapore but congrats

 

[smartcooky]

Japan it Is!!!!

An Italian rugby blog wrote an article saying that Singapore Rugby Union retired its entrace proposal to leave space to Japan,anybody can confirm it ?

Congrats Japan!

It's official !! SANZAR CEO Greg Peters announced the inclusion of a franchise from Argentina and one from Japan to the SR, plus a new team from South Africa.

i thought this was going to be too obvious tbh, the Japanese are simply much stronger than singapore but congrats

The reality is, it was a no-brainer. Japan is a much stronger rugby country in every respect; playing, supporting, covering. They are also hosting the RWC in 2019; what a snub it would be from SANZAR if Singapore were awarded a SR franchise ahead of Japan.

If Singapore ever were in the hunt, the dreadful spinal injury to Welshman Owen Williams probably killed it. He sustained the injury in the World Club 10's tournament held in Singapore's new National Stadium, where the ground conditions were very substandard and were the major contributing factor in the accident. As recently as last month, the playing surface was still a patchy, sandy mess...

http://www.establishmentpost.com/singapore-sports-hub-pitch-far-perfect-whos-blame/

NOTE: If you haven't already seen how Owen Williams got his injury, you're probably better off staying that way!

 

[Shaggy]

The reality is, it was a no-brainer. Japan is a much stronger rugby country in every respect; playing, supporting, covering. They are also hosting the RWC in 2019; what a snub it would be from SANZAR if Singapore were awarded a SR franchise ahead of Japan.

If Singapore ever were in the hunt, the dreadful spinal injury to Welshman Owen Williams probably killed it. He sustained the injury in the World Club 10's tournament held in Singapore's new National Stadium, where the ground conditions were very substandard and were the major contributing factor in the accident. As recently as last month, the playing surface was still a patchy, sandy mess...

http://www.establishmentpost.com/singapore-sports-hub-pitch-far-perfect-whos-blame/

NOTE: If you haven't already seen how Owen Williams got his injury, you're probably better off staying that way!

Is that stadium the same as "the sports hub" mentioned in this article, Cooky

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/63402136/Japan-Argentina-officially-join-Super-Rugby

It appears Singapore will get three games anyway

 

[goodNumber10]

the ground conditions were very substandard and were the major contributing factor in the accident. As recently as last month, the playing surface was still a patchy, sandy mess...

I would have thought the atrocious shirt collar yank and roll tackle that flipped him on his head at full pace was the major contributing factor not a sandy pitch.

It's a clearly less than optimal pitch but i don' think it can be blamed for what was essentially a freak accident from poor tacking technique.

 

[nickdnz]

So Super Rugby now officially covers Australasia, Africa, Asia and South America...

I feel now may well also be hitting the point of irreversible damage to Super Rugby. It's not that I'm unhappy with expanding - however expanding as they have will undoubtedly turn an already haphazard conference system, into a dog's breakfast. If they organized this in terms of a round robin system where every team just has to suck up a one-off additional trip to Asia/South America then I would be fine - but I'm not convinced that who meets at the end of the conference systems will accurately reflect the best teams in the competition. It's already BS frankly - where New Zealand gets punished for a strong conference - and teams which have earned less points still get a guaranteed top 3 spot - but now I'm not convinced the table will really reflect the quality of the teams at all. That said, I could be wrong as I don't have the Masters Degree in applied mathematics to know where any of the teams will in reality stand in the table..

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

TRF_nicknz, I hate to say it but I don't think you're wrong. Time will tell too what degree though.

 

[goodNumber10]

So Super Rugby now officially covers Australasia, Africa, Asia and South America...

I feel now may well also be hitting the point of irreversible damage to Super Rugby. It's not that I'm unhappy with expanding - however expanding as they have will undoubtedly turn an already haphazard conference system, into a dog's breakfast. If they organized this in terms of a round robin system where every team just has to suck up a one-off additional trip to Asia/South America then I would be fine - but I'm not convinced that who meets at the end of the conference systems will accurately reflect the best teams in the competition. It's already BS frankly - where New Zealand gets punished for a strong conference - and teams which have earned less points still get a guaranteed top 3 spot - but now I'm not convinced the table will really reflect the quality of the teams at all. That said, I could be wrong as I don't have the Masters Degree in applied mathematics to know where any of the teams will in reality stand in the table..

It's a shambles, I literally can't be bothered to follow it anymore as the conference system has kicked the ar*e out of it.

The round robin with play offs was the perfect solution. Even expanded if you just split into two pools of 10 and play a round robin, top two from each pool into semis, you'd have a better product than the current and future competitions. You can select the pools by seeding and then random selection, making those derby matches when they happen even bigger events. That way teams who are out of the play off still have something to play for in the seedings.

I think the English league should go a similar way as well, expand to 16 split into two pools of 8 play home and away for seedings and play off place.

 

[smartcooky]

Is that stadium the same as "the sports hub" mentioned in this article, Cooky

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/63402136/Japan-Argentina-officially-join-Super-Rugby

It appears Singapore will get three games anyway

It is and I sincerely hope that they get that pitch sorted by 2016

I would have thought the atrocious shirt collar yank and roll tackle that flipped him on his head at full pace was the major contributing factor not a sandy pitch.

It's a clearly less than optimal pitch but i don' think it can be blamed for what was essentially a freak accident from poor tacking technique.

There was no penalty and no citing for the player involved, so it wasn't that dangerous and the seriousness of the injury was blamed in the playing surface at the time .

This playing surface is clearly dangerous, sufficiently so that the NZRU called off the Maori All Blacks match v Asia Pacific Barbarians that was supposed to have been played at the venue last weekend.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/20/rugby-maori-singapore-idUKL3N0SF6KO20141020

It was also heavily criticised after two recent soccer matches were played there; Juventus v Singapore and Brasil v Japan)

 

[goodNumber10]

There was no penalty and no citing for the player involved, so it wasn't that dangerous and the seriousness of the injury was blamed in the playing surface at the time .

do you have alink to that please mate, i'd be interested to read it.

I know the player never got cited, i saw the games, and it's just a really poor challenge but essentially legal - i'm afraid I have a real bug bear about shirt collar tackles having seen my brothers arm broken in several places by one.

This playing surface is clearly dangerous, sufficiently so that the NZRU called off the Maori All Blacks match v Asia Pacific Barbarians that was supposed to have been played at the venue last weekend.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/20/rugby-maori-singapore-idUKL3N0SF6KO20141020

It was also heavily criticised after two recent soccer matches were played there; Juventus v Singapore and Brasil v Japan)

Oh, no argument there, it's awful, i just hadn't read anything about it being the major factor in the incident.

 

[dasNdanger]

I'm actually happy about this. Of course, it all depends on how many games are played, etc...but I'm guessing it's both a way to grow these up-and-coming teams with a prospect of these teams then growing their international game. Is Japan also joining the RC?


das

 

[smartcooky]

do you have alink to that please mate, i'd be interested to read it.

I know the player never got cited, i saw the games, and it's just a really poor challenge but essentially legal - i'm afraid I have a real bug bear about shirt collar tackles having seen my brothers arm broken in several places by one.

No I don't unfortunately. There was a short piece in the Sports section of the 6pm TVNZ News on the day it happened. Some players were asked about it and they definitely said that the surface was a major contributing factor. Apparently, the footing was unpredictable; you would be running and you could either slip on the sandy surface or your studs could "catch" unexpectedly on one of the many ridges of grass. They said it sometimes got worse if you tried to sidestep or change direction suddenly. I have looked through the TVNZ sports news archives but haven't been able to find it.

Also the footage of Williams' accident seems to have disappeared off the web. I have found a number of links to it and they are all dead. As I recall it, Williams did stumble just as he was tackled.

 

[RoosTah]

So Super Rugby now officially covers Australasia, Africa, Asia and South America...

I feel now may well also be hitting the point of irreversible damage to Super Rugby. It's not that I'm unhappy with expanding - however expanding as they have will undoubtedly turn an already haphazard conference system, into a dog's breakfast. If they organized this in terms of a round robin system where every team just has to suck up a one-off additional trip to Asia/South America then I would be fine - but I'm not convinced that who meets at the end of the conference systems will accurately reflect the best teams in the competition. It's already BS frankly - where New Zealand gets punished for a strong conference - and teams which have earned less points still get a guaranteed top 3 spot - but now I'm not convinced the table will really reflect the quality of the teams at all. That said, I could be wrong as I don't have the Masters Degree in applied mathematics to know where any of the teams will in reality stand in the table..

Agreed. I honestly just think this new format is nothing short of ridiculous and will almost certainly undermine the integrity of the competition. The appetite for Rugby in Japan is extremely limited and has actually been declining over the past decade... the Top League survives purely as a prestige project for wealthy companies who treat their team as an almost trumped up posh school side. Argentina I know less about and I am glad they're making some inroads, but at the same time I honestly would have been happy enough for us to just continue with our current more logical and symmetrical set-up whilst easing them in by introducing a lower tier Super Rugby comp.

 

[Jaguares]

Yeah, I'm not sure about the new system. I should be happy for the inclusion of Argentina but I don't know if the new system will work. The SA teams will benefit

 

[lynam1104]

On the sports hub pitch, I think Cooky is right it was a big factor for Willams injury. I was at the event and I had some friends playing in youth tournament, from what I could see and what they said it was rock hard, sandy and just in a really poor state. In fact the Maori All Blacks were supposed to play a game V the Asia Pacific Dragons there last weekend, but the MAB's canceled it due to the pitch. It will be fixed by the time Super Rugby arrives though, the government were making a big push for rugby and to have a snub like that has ****** them off. The issue os that while the stadium was ready in time for the the World Club Tens, the pitch needed about a few more months. It will be difficult to maintain the pitch at rugby playing standards, as in a day you can have 35 degree plus sunny and then monsoon bucketing down in a few hours. It can be done though.

 

[goodNumber10]

No I don't unfortunately. There was a short piece in the Sports section of the 6pm TVNZ News on the day it happened. Some players were asked about it and they definitely said that the surface was a major contributing factor. Apparently, the footing was unpredictable; you would be running and you could either slip on the sandy surface or your studs could "catch" unexpectedly on one of the many ridges of grass. They said it sometimes got worse if you tried to sidestep or change direction suddenly. I have looked through the TVNZ sports news archives but haven't been able to find it.

Also the footage of Williams' accident seems to have disappeared off the web. I have found a number of links to it and they are all dead. As I recall it, Williams did stumble just as he was tackled.

i've actually got the footage, as i have the tournament on video.

I can't watch the incident as it's not nice, mainly because of the outcome, he's trying to stay on his feet and the guy has his shirt. He drops his weight and Owens flips over and comes down on his neck.

very unpleasant.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Does this mean that the each team will play every other or will the same teams play the same teams each year?

Couldn't find the agreed format yet?

 

[ratsapprentice]

I can't watch the incident as it's not nice, mainly because of the outcome, he's trying to saty on his feet and the guy has his shirt he drops his weight and Owens flips over and comes down on his neck.

Yeah - like a running judo throw, just very unlucky. Pitch quality wasn't a factor from what I saw..

 

[Shaggy]

Does this mean that the each team will play every other or will the same teams play the same teams each year?

Couldn't find the agreed format yet?

There's an old thread in the super rugby forum, "Four conference system planned for 2016" that explains how the system will work, and why people aren't happy with it.

In a nutshell though an NZ conference of five teams, an Australian conference of five teams, two south African conference of three teams plus either the Argentine team or the Japanese team. The South African conference in the individual conferences play each other home and away, and all of the teams in the other conference once. Meanwhile the the New Zealand conference plays each other home and away, and the Australian teams do the same, they also play against three of the teams in the other Australasian conference once.

Five Australasian teams and Three South African teams go through to the quarter finals ... So no, the days of all of the teams playing one another are, unfortunately, gone