South Africa vs Ireland - 3 Tests - June 2016

[Leonormous Boozer]

what about Ringrose? is he ready to be blooded yet?

Definitely, I'd hold him back for the first test though as he'll need extra time to learn the systems and what not before having a baptism of fire against South Africa. It's unfortunate that he doesn't fit the 23 spot well as he's be a great impact sub to come on at 13 for the last 20 minutes. You'll definitely see him in green by the end of the year if he avoids injuries though.

 

[Amiga500]

Kearney was still our best 15 this 6 nations when he played, Zebo made too many defensive blunders. Until Olding is ready, which he's not Kearney is our man.

Henshaw and Payne are both significant upgrades on either Simon "Positional Sense" Zebo or Rob "Linebeaks for Fun" Kearney at 15.

Unfortunately, Joe can't see beyond his immediate KPI or Rob Kearney has some bad photos of him or something.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Henshaw and Payne are both significant upgrades on either Simon "Positional Sense" Zebo or Rob "Linebeaks for Fun" Kearney at 15.

Unfortunately, Joe can't see beyond his immediate KPI or Rob Kearney has some bad photos of him or something.

Henshaw is a better centre, both 12 and 13, than he is a fullback. He was the best 12 in the 6 nations and his game at 13 was even better so his future is at centre. Payne could work but he doesn't really do what Schmidt wants from his fullbacks on his kick returns and doesn't have a strong enough kicking game so he doesn't really fit stylistically. A half crocked Kearney did well for us in the 6 nations and although he is one of the players wh will need replaced in the next 18 months he is still the most suitable player for the position at the moment, much like Best and Heaslip.

 

[Amiga500]

Henshaw is a better centre, both 12 and 13, than he is a fullback. He was the best 12 in the 6 nations and his game at 13 was even better so his future is at centre.

Fast forward 18 months.

Ringrose, Aki, Olding & McCloskey are all young centre options.

Zebo (and maybe TOH out west - although he's some defensive issues to sort) are our only full back options.


Kearney is over the hill and washed up already, his ability to boot the ball really high notwithstanding.

Payne could work but he doesn't really do what Schmidt wants from his fullbacks on his kick returns and doesn't have a strong enough kicking game so he doesn't really fit stylistically.

Are you for real?

Payne's tactical kicking game (as opposed to garryowens) is absolute light years ahead of Kearney!


Hopefully Joe will realise the world has evolved from relying on up and unders. I pray the IRFU let Ulster play Payne at 15 vs. you guys so you can get an idea of what we're missing.

Payne at 13 is competent. At 15 he is best in NH.

A half crocked Kearney did well for us in the 6 nations and although he is one of the players wh will need replaced in the next 18 months he is still the most suitable player for the position at the moment, much like Best and Heaslip.

Do you measure doing well by number of mistakes or by positive contributions? What about lack of positive contributions?

 

[profitius]

what about Ringrose? is he ready to be blooded yet?

He is in a different class to Payne already but we won't see him for Ireland until next season I'd say.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Fast forward 18 months.

Ringrose, Aki, Olding & McCloskey are all young centre options.

Zebo (and maybe TOH out west - although he's some defensive issues to sort) are our only full back options.

Henshaw is probably the only one of those who can be the best in the world in his position, he can't in fullback, keep him in the centre. Olding can play fullback and play it well too. Kearney is also a fullback option, younger than Payne too.

Kearney is over the hill and washed up already, his ability to boot the ball really high notwithstanding.

He really, really isn't. He might not make the linebreaks or have the blistering pace he used to but he's shown, when fit and on form, he's a far more intelligent player than he used to be. He's got better in defence, makes it over the gain line almost every time he comes into the line and kicks far more intelligently than he used to.

Are you for real?

Payne's tactical kicking game (as opposed to garryowens) is absolute light years ahead of Kearney!


Hopefully Joe will realise the world has evolved from relying on up and unders. I pray the IRFU let Ulster play Payne at 15 vs. you guys so you can get an idea of what we're missing.

Payne at 13 is competent. At 15 he is best in NH.

Well... yes. Payne kicks well but it's not what Schmidt wants from his fullback, he attacks the corners more oft than not which really doesn't suit our wingers. Fullback kicking in today's game is all about length, garryowens and line kicks, Kearney is better at all three.

Do you measure doing well by number of mistakes or by positive contributions? What about lack of positive contributions?

Both, Kearney makes few mistakes and has a lot of positive contributions too both through his boot and when joining the line. He's not the better of the two players right now but he suits Ireland better. If he does find form, he's better than Payne too.

 

[saulan]

Springbok squad for the matches to be announced this Saturday at 19:00:
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/bok-squad-named-on-saturday-20160523

 

[saulan]

Nick Mallett's suggested Bok squad for Ireland:

1 Beast Mtawarira
2 Adriaan Strauss
3 Frans Malherbe
4 Pieter-Steph du Toit
5 Eben Etzebeth
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Siya Kolisi
8 Duane Vermuelen (c) {Really don't think he can be captain, but they seemed to be speaking about him as a possible captain quite a bit last night)
9 Faf de Klerk
10 Pat Lambie
11 Lwazi Mvovo
12 Jan Serfontein
13 Lionel Mapoe
14 JP Pietersen
15 Willi le Roux

16 Scarra Ntubeni
17 Redelinghuys
18 Trevor Nyakane
19 Lood De Jager
20 Warren Whitely
21 Rudy Paige
22 Johan Goosen
23 Damian De Allende

Jantjies not there because of injury.

Gcobani Bobo's suggested team

1 Beast Mtawarira
2 Adriaan Strauss
3 Julian Redelinghuys
4 Eben Etzebeth
5 Pieter-Steph du Toit
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Siya Kolisi
8 Warren Whitely (c)
9 Rudy Paige
10 Patrick Lambie
11 JP Pietersen
12 Damian De Allende
13 Lionel Mapoe
14 Ruan Combrinck
15 Willie Le Roux

16 Malcolm Marx
17 Trevor Nyakane
18 Frans Malherbe
19 Lood De Jager
20 Kirsten (can't remember his first name)
21 Faf de Klerk
22 Garth April
23 Jesse Kriel

 

[TRF_heineken]

Nick Mallett's suggested Bok squad for Ireland:

1 Beast Mtawarira
2 Adriaan Strauss
3 Frans Malherbe
4 Pieter-Steph du Toit
5 Eben Etzebeth
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Siya Kolisi
8 Duane Vermuelen (c) {Really don't think he can be captain, but they seemed to be speaking about him as a possible captain quite a bit last night)
9 Faf de Klerk
10 Pat Lambie
11 Lwazi Mvovo
12 Jan Serfontein
13 Lionel Mapoe
14 JP Pietersen
15 Willi le Roux

16 Scarra Ntubeni
17 Redelinghuys
18 Trevor Nyakane
19 Lood De Jager
20 Warren Whitely
21 Rudy Paige
22 Johan Goosen
23 Damian De Allende

Jantjies not there because of injury.

Gcobani Bobo's suggested team

1 Beast Mtawarira
2 Adriaan Strauss
3 Julian Redelinghuys
4 Eben Etzebeth
5 Pieter-Steph du Toit
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Siya Kolisi
8 Warren Whitely (c)
9 Rudy Paige
10 Patrick Lambie
11 JP Pietersen
12 Damian De Allende
13 Lionel Mapoe
14 Ruan Combrinck
15 Willie Le Roux

16 Malcolm Marx
17 Trevor Nyakane
18 Frans Malherbe
19 Lood De Jager
20 Kirsten (can't remember his first name)
21 Faf de Klerk
22 Garth April
23 Jesse Kriel

Jannes Kirsten

Yeah look, all these guys are going to list a team they'd like to see. And most of us will agree with most of the selections they make, with the odd bad pick here and there (Scarra Ntubeni).

But I think it's a bit premature to list a team before the coach even announced the training squad on Saturday evening.

A lot can still happen, some of these guys can get injured and then what's the point.

 

[saulan]

Jannes Kirsten

Yeah look, all these guys are going to list a team they'd like to see. And most of us will agree with most of the selections they make, with the odd bad pick here and there (Scarra Ntubeni).

But I think it's a bit premature to list a team before the coach even announced the training squad on Saturday evening.

A lot can still happen, some of these guys can get injured and then what's the point.

My understanding was that both the squads are being announced this weekend and then both are in training camps together for two weeks. It was vague though so I definitely could have misinterpreted it.
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/bok-squad-named-on-saturday-20160523

 

[TRF_heineken]

My understanding was that both the squads are being announced this weekend and then both are in training camps together for two weeks. It was vague though so I definitely could have misinterpreted it.
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/bok-squad-named-on-saturday-20160523

That's my understanding as well.

We also don't know who will coach the emerging boks yet, and if they will be coached by the Bok team with a representative at the helm...

Favouritism will also play a part in which players are selected or not.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Ireland Squad

Forwards: Finlay Bealham, Rory Best (c), Sean Cronin, Ultan Dillane, Tadhg Furlong, Jamie Heaslip (vc), Iain Henderson, David Kilcoyne, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Sean Reidy, Mike Ross, Quinn Roux, Rhys Ruddock, Donnacha Ryan, CJ Stander, Richardt Strauss, Devin Toner

Backs: Keith Earls, Luke Fitzgerald, Robbie Henshaw, Paddy Jackson, David Kearney, Rob Kearney, Kieran Marmion, Luke Marshall, Conor Murray, Stuart Olding, Jared Payne, Eoin Reddan, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble

http://www.planetrugby.com/news/ireland-name-squad-for-south-africa-tour/

 

[Gavin]

Not a bad squad but disappointed to see no McCloskey there.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

McCloskey has been muck post 6n. Would have liked Ringrose but Olding makes more sense at the moment, depth in the 2nd row and backrow isn't great by any means.

 

[Groundhog]

When Sean Reidy can make your squad it's a bad sign

 

[TRF_heineken]

Ireland Squad

Forwards: Finlay Bealham, Rory Best (c), Sean Cronin, Ultan Dillane, Tadhg Furlong, Jamie Heaslip (vc), Iain Henderson, David Kilcoyne, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Sean Reidy, Mike Ross, Quinn Roux, Rhys Ruddock, Donnacha Ryan, CJ Stander, Richardt Strauss, Devin Toner

Backs: Keith Earls, Luke Fitzgerald, Robbie Henshaw, Paddy Jackson, David Kearney, Rob Kearney, Kieran Marmion, Luke Marshall, Conor Murray, Stuart Olding, Jared Payne, Eoin Reddan, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble

http://www.planetrugby.com/news/ireland-name-squad-for-south-africa-tour/

Geez!

So when the 2 teams are on the field, we can just play one national anthem, Nkosi Sikelil' iAfrika...

 

[Gavin]

McCloskey has been muck post 6n. Would have liked Ringrose but Olding makes more sense at the moment, depth in the 2nd row and backrow isn't great by any means.

Whilst I agree, I think his confidence has been hit following his dropping after the England (?) game.

 

[Peat]

When Sean Reidy can make your squad it's a bad sign

Ain't kidding there. Although its a progressive selection over taking Henry imo.

Think Mick Kearney is hard done by.

edit: And Quinn Roux, whut?

 

[Amiga500]

So when the 2 teams are on the field, we can just play one national anthem, Nkosi Sikelil' iAfrika...

I second that.


Better than listening to that other muck.

- - - Updated - - -

McCloskey has been muck post 6n.

Yip - he's been reduced to a younger version of James Downey.

Ulster could easily play off him as well as Jackson with trailed runners, but yet don't seem to.

- - - Updated - - -

Forwards: Finlay Bealham, Rory Best (c), Sean Cronin Rob Herring, Ultan Dillane, Tadhg Furlong, Jamie Heaslip (vc), Iain Henderson, David Kilcoyne James Cronin, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Sean Reidy, Mike Ross, Quinn Roux Alan O'Connor/Pete Brown/Mick Kearney/Anyone, Rhys Ruddock, Donnacha Ryan, CJ Stander, Richardt Strauss, Devin Toner

Backs: Keith Earls, Luke Fitzgerald, Robbie Henshaw, Paddy Jackson, David Kearney Craig Gilroy/Matt Healy, Rob Kearney, Kieran Marmion, Luke Marshall, Conor Murray, Stuart Olding, Jared Payne, Eoin Reddan/Luke McGrath, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble Craig Gilroy/Matt Healy



None of those in red I would take. Replacements named - reasons are due to form, potential and age profile.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Whilst I agree, I think his confidence has been hit following his dropping after the England (?) game.

But that's his problem and not Schmidt's, if a player can't handle being dropped after a far from perfect defensive performance it's a bad sign.

I second that.


Better than listening to that other muck.

- - - Updated - - -



Yip - he's been reduced to a younger version of James Downey.

Ulster could easily play off him as well as Jackson with trailed runners, but yet don't seem to.

- - - Updated - - -

Forwards: Finlay Bealham, Rory Best (c), Sean Cronin Rob Herring, Ultan Dillane, Tadhg Furlong, Jamie Heaslip (vc), Iain Henderson, David Kilcoyne James Cronin, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Sean Reidy, Mike Ross, Quinn Roux Alan O'Connor/Pete Brown/Mick Kearney/Anyone, Rhys Ruddock, Donnacha Ryan, CJ Stander, Richardt Strauss, Devin Toner

Backs: Keith Earls, Luke Fitzgerald, Robbie Henshaw, Paddy Jackson, David Kearney Craig Gilroy/Matt Healy, Rob Kearney, Kieran Marmion, Luke Marshall, Conor Murray, Stuart Olding, Jared Payne, Eoin Reddan/Luke McGrath, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble Craig Gilroy/Matt Healy



None of those in red I would take. Replacements named - reasons are due to form, potential and age profile.

Healy? He's a turnstile who's effective against Pro 12 defences, not an international player. I agree that Gilroy should be in though and that Quinn Roux shouldn't be in the squad with AO'C given a go preferably.