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SOB lays into Gats

The Alpha Bro said:
Certainly easier to win 3-0 when the coach doesn't decide to pick the squads most limited player at 12, second best 10 with a backrow that proved to have little balance to hand the first test to NZ...
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I apologise. I'm merely a rugby fan
 
The Alpha Bro said:
Certainly easier to win 3-0 when the coach doesn't decide to pick the squads most limited player at 12, second best 10 with a backrow that proved to have little balance to hand the first test to NZ...
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i bow to your international coaching experience. i imagine it would be a piece of cake for you to tour NZ and win 3 nil as well as beating all the superRugby sides. ireland must be crawling with millions of keyboard warriors that could do a better job.

gatland may have exceeded expectations but he still shouldve done more
 
mania said:
i bow to your international coaching experience. i imagine it would be a piece of cake for you to tour NZ and win 3 nil as well as beating all the superRugby sides. ireland must be crawling with millions of keyboard warriors that could do a better job.

gatland may have exceeded expectations but he still shouldve done more
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Look I'm no genius, this was my reaction to the 1st test side;

The Alpha Bro said:
That 10 - 12 - 13 axis won't create nothin'. Good back row and back 3, Wyn Jones is stupid, apart from that there's nothing outrageous but I wouldn't call it right.

NZ by 14+
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The back row wasn't good at all... (Final score was 30-15 in case you forgot!)

P.s. "Could you have done better?" Is a rather childish red herring when those who you're arguing against are merely saying that there's coaches who'd have done better.
 
The Alpha Bro said:
Look I'm no genius, this was my reaction to the 1st test side;

The back row wasn't good at all... (Final score was 30-15 in case you forgot!)

P.s. "Could you have done better?" Is a rather childish red herring when those who you're arguing against are merely saying that there's coaches who'd have done better.
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ok i genuinely apologise then. im totally down for discussion and exchange of ideas.
the "couldve done better" argument is a discussion in probability and alternative realities.
Gatland took the job and imo exceeded expectations. i didnt see anyone (or any these posters) before the tour touting that he should be able to win 3-0. most people thought that Lions would get a beating (and ashamedly alot were kiwi's), devalue the tour and make a mockery of Lions history.
imo Lions and Gatland more than came away with their pride intact. they proved why the existence of this tour is important and should continue.
touring NZ is a kinda tough place to tour. Gatland the Lions and their supporters came here and i'd like to think that they showed us what a rugby showcase like this is all about. they showed its about rugby. i loved it and in the nicest possible way they taught NZ'rs humility.

whats come after is taking cheap shots at a great result that could've easily been worse.
ive coached rep teams with the best of the best brought together. the hardest thing to do in that situation is breaking down the individual identities and making them believe and trust each other. team work is paramount . whilst gatland didnt get them hugging each other, they all worked together and hunted as a pack.
 
An attack on Gatland? The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy, to drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather into your bosom his wives and daughters.
 
Groundhog said:
An attack on Gatland? The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy, to drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather into your bosom his wives and daughters.
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its only a game
 
Part of the reasons the lions expectations were so low was gatland being the coaches.

I don't think gatland should be celebrated for doing better than his terribly low expectations.

You say it's just a game but this thread has been ridiculous for the past two days. This issue is over and it doesn't mean anything.
 
themole25 said:
Part of the reasons the lions expectations were so low was gatland being the coaches.

I don't think gatland should be celebrated for doing better than his terribly low expectations.

You say it's just a game but this thread has been ridiculous for the past two days. This issue is over and it doesn't mean anything.
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Agree. The emotion in this thread is at critical mass.

I think it's better for everyone if gatland never coaches lions again and gets out of Europe asap
 
themole25 said:
Part of the reasons the lions expectations were so low was gatland being the coaches.

I don't think gatland should be celebrated for doing better than his terribly low expectations.
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^this
 
Everyone is moaning about gats and im not his biggest fan and he didnt have the best tour/made mistakes but i think the main issue was rob howley, against the best team in the world ypu need a good attack coach and he hasnt proved he has what it takes if wales attacking form is anything to go by in recent years. Not sure who i would have picked if im honest.
 
Honest point here when under Gats has Wales ever been a scary attacking threat in terms coached attack? Shane Williams was the last welsh back that put geunine fear on the team sheet and he picked himself with tactics of give the ball to Shane.
 
themole25 said:
Part of the reasons the lions expectations were so low was gatland being the coaches.
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20% maybe, but mainly that NZ have been totally dominant for some time. Many are saying they're not vintage, but there's still clear water between them and the rest. They've just whitewashed a Rugby Championship and even the Irish defeat was immediately avenged, in Ireland.

themole25 said:
I don't think gatland should be celebrated for doing better than his terribly low expectations.
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But nor should he be slaughtered for not beating the ABs in their own backyard.

As for "Eddie or Joe would've done better....." , well, who knows? Last time I looked neither of those were RWC winning coaches - SCW was, he took a Lions down there and it was a complete Horlicks. Eddie's abrasive and out there - that probably takes some time to adapt to and you don't have that on a Lions tour. It's a unique challenge and when the history is written most people will look back and say it was a decent result.
 
Could anybody else have done better than WG?

I don't think there were many outstanding candidates - Eddie Jones and Joe Schmidt were possibly the only other two names who could have led the Lions to possible success.

The media did not want the Lions to be victorious (they always seem to have a downer on any British team doing well), so that's an uphill battle in itself.

Anyway, you can't change what has happened and the 2017 tour is now history. Let's look forward to 2021 and hopefully a 3-0 win over The 'Boks.
 
People forget though this.
Before the test New Zealand were on fire so of course anyone would've taken a draw. But during tests they were awful. Stats back that up all over. And maybe some was down to Lions but alot of it was down to themselves. Be it injuries or just dip in form. And in that case on reflection it was a lost opportunity. People are saying (Players, fans and coaches) that another coach in those circumstances would've win it. And is that guaranteed no. But alot of reasons and debate topics are spot on.
It could be argued Jones wouldn't have been as bias or loyal and that may have been a pro or con. Schmidt may have built the better plan. Etc etc. At end of day it hindsight but certainly a fair argument. In alot of people's eyes they were disappointed Gats got the job and feel he didn't enhance reputation. Again fair debatable views
 
http://www.planetrugby.com/news/gatland-reconsiders-lions-coaching-future/

"My thing to Sean is, if he can look himself in the mirror and say 'I was the most professional person on tour, on and off the field, in New Zealand', in terms of the way he prepared himself then I think his points would be more valid," said Gatland.

"I was disappointed with his comments. I thought him coming out and saying we should have won 3-0 was pretty disrespectful to New Zealand. That's where he lost his credibility."

Comes out and basically says that a guy he picked for all three tests and one of his top three performers wasn't very professional and again states he wasn't a good enough coach who doesn't think he could have won the series! Top class guy!
 

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