Scotland vs Wales - 09/03/2013

[Big Ewis]

Wales look miserable on attack. Sure they've gotten past a woeful 8-game slide, but you can see why after watching them play this tournament....I hope they get their attack back soon, coz right now, Europe is looking like a fakking FAAAAAAARCE in terms of attack. There's what, France once every 5 matches and Ireland about the same rate that can string a real pro try ffs....England's powerful but terribly uninspired...
Wales, Italy and Scotland (yes I know they scored a lot, but against Italy...have you seen that thing ??!) all can produce strong defense, good scrums...but then, just, where is everybody ?

 

[dullonien]

Whilst I agree to a certain extent yeo91, have you noticed that the weather has been a little sh**ty? Also, today we couldn't get any attack going because Scotland interfered every other minute with a penalty.

I do want to see ore attacking from Wales though.

 

[Ospreylian]

Warburton silenced all his critics today, including me. I think when you have as much natural ability as he does you are bound to bounce back from poor form fairly quickly. I hope it's not just a blip and that he can continue playing this well.

The only problem it poses is who does Howley select at 6 for England? I'm a massive Jones fan and a massive Tipuric fan. Further into the future still, what happens when Lydiate returns? Perhaps the Lydiate, Faletau, Warburton back row is the one that will last the longest and be selected more frequently in the future. On the plus side, it's great to see so much competition on the flanks for places. The only worry is cover for number 8, but I suppose Pretorius has been playing well this season. And players like Kieran Murphy and Morgan Allen are proving their worth at club level.

I think people are bashing Wales' performance a bit too much without considering all the factors leading up to this game. Crucial games, where both teams have something big to play for, are always going to be close affairs, and this match was no different. Yes Wales need more creativity in attack, but with one game to go it is probably too risky to change the line-up now. They just need to focus on beating England with the players they have, and then go back to the drawing board after the tournament to reevaluate which backs actually deserve their places in the starting line-up. I think I noticed Roberts with ball in hand only once today, which is very worrying. But Biggar is growing with every game, North is finding his best form again, and Halfpenny was superb yet again.

Let's not forget Wales have not conceded a try for about 3 and a half games now. The pundits always bang on about how Wales aren't good in attack at the moment and that they need to up their game to beat England, but then go on to say how players like Barritt are guiding England to a grand slam because of his defense. But from where I stand, Wales' defense is about as good as England's at the moment. It's strange how some pundits seem to ignore Wales' defensive abilities, and shrug off the idea Wales could beat England on defense alone.

 

[Amobokoboko]

Very very good game from Wales, after Richie Gray left the field the Scottisch defense lost some of their solid performance. Scots had some bad ball handling.

 

[Draggs]

Warburton silenced all his critics today, including me. I think when you have as much natural ability as he does you are bound to bounce back from poor form fairly quickly. I hope it's not just a blip and that he can continue playing this well.

The only problem it poses is who does Howley select at 6 for England? I'm a massive Jones fan and a massive Tipuric fan. Further into the future still, what happens when Lydiate returns? Perhaps the Lydiate, Faletau, Warburton back row is the one that will last the longest and be selected more frequently in the future. On the plus side, it's great to see so much competition on the flanks for places. The only worry is cover for number 8, but I suppose Pretorius has been playing well this season. And players like Kieran Murphy and Morgan Allen are proving their worth at club level.

I think people are bashing Wales' performance a bit too much without considering all the factors leading up to this game. Crucial games, where both teams have something big to play for, are always going to be close affairs, and this match was no different. Yes Wales need more creativity in attack, but with one game to go it is probably too risky to change the line-up now. They just need to focus on beating England with the players they have, and then go back to the drawing board after the tournament to reevaluate which backs actually deserve their places in the starting line-up. I think I noticed Roberts with ball in hand only once today, which is very worrying. But Biggar is growing with every game, North is finding his best form again, and Halfpenny was superb yet again.

Let's not forget Wales have not conceded a try for about 3 and a half games now. The pundits always bang on about how Wales aren't good in attack at the moment and that they need to up their game to beat England, but then go on to say how players like Barritt are guiding England to a grand slam because of his defense. But from where I stand, Wales' defense is about as good as England's at the moment. It's strange how some pundits seem to ignore Wales' defensive abilities, and shrug off the idea Wales could beat England on defense alone.

Jones will probably miss the England match. Tipuric-Warburton pairing. Done.
Interestingly, we have not conceded a try since we scored our first of the tournament.

 

[Jbobo]

Wales accomplished smt fun. They've won consecutively (starting from last year) away in each 6N stadium. Twick and Ireland last year, the remaining 3 this year (Paris, Rome, now MField...).

But besides this completely irrelevant yet fun fact, may I please extend my...sentiment on this match:

what





a






complete absolute shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhittttttttttttttyy game, dear Lord, my goodness, God have mercy, God blind me.

Absolute shytttiest 6N ever.

I am almost 100% sure7 your comments are a result of France loosing all their games so far. Please stop prattling on about how bad the six nations has been, as it has obviously been better for for some than it had for others . It's clearly only because France have been sh**e throughout the tournament that you keep saying how terrible it ha been. Basically, you bore me sir.

 

[dullonien]

Jones will probably miss the England match. Tipuric-Warburton pairing. Done.

The backrow battle will be interesting. A lot is made about England not having a traditional 7 (especially by me), so we'll have to see how they go against two traditional opensides in Warburton and Tipuric. I personally think it could give us a big advantage, like it did today against a Scottish team that was also short a traditional 7.

 

[Big Ewis]

I am almost 100% sure7 your comments are a result of France loosing all their games so far. Please stop prattling on about how bad the six nations has been, as it has obviously been better for for some than it had for others . It's clearly only because France have been sh**e throughout the tournament that you keep saying how terrible it ha been. Basically, you bore me sir.

^ such a silly post. If you can't see objectivity in my posts I'm not interested. And I bore you ?!! rofl, as if this game didn't annihilate any notion of entertainment you had left from the other matches !!

The level of play has been abysmal this tournament, and the "good team", England, are a little far from entertaining themselves. France and Ireland, the two teams that have attacking flair in this tournament, have completely underperformed - esp. France, of course.
So many matches without tries, without any risks taken, terrible mistakes throughout the 80min, guys not knowing the rules committing childish penalties, fundamentals unchecked...FRA WAL was one of the shhittiest games I've seen in recent memory, only beaten by this very one (SCO WAL).

And to Wales fans (....with common sense): I obviously wouldn't be exactly reassured with the current state of the team. There are okay elements, like the return of a strong scrum (despite it not engaging on many occasions to have the opposite scrum collapse ^_^!), strong defense...but on attack, my goodness...there is zero creativity, and though the raw talent is quite rich, the team overall looks un-threatening on attack. You have an amazing fullback, good/very good backs altogether, Jones and a strong scrum for the forwards...but the efforts are FLAT. Yes you've broken through the 8-game slide, and it's good of course, but my God come World Cup time, or wtvr other big event (NOT JAPAN !!); this team would better work on a number of things.
Like, it's not coz Wales just won 3 in a row that "yay that's it, forget aaaalll the problems we're good again".

I mean this in a Northern Hemisphere way, not merely a french guy criticizing Wales. We are at a low...low point right now. This is one of the shhittiest 6N I've seen in my life. Go back and watch some 80's/90's/2000's stuff if you don't believe me lol, refresh your memories ! This is ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww, as if it needed to be mentioned !!
I forced myself to sit through the entire 80min of this match, just to analyze the play from both teams. But I felt like leaving the couch every 10min or so, and I nearly didn't come back for the 2nd half but I thought it would be better...

I personally can't wait for the summer and beyond...thank God the RWC is so far from now...I'm not sure any 6N side would make it past the pools !

Like, I'm at a point where I'm eager for the next 4N to get my taste for Rugby fully restored. I want to see tries, complete plays, phases with a conclusion, running, passing, real structure on attack, creativity, good fundamental skills...not.........this !

 

[TRF_Cymro]

^ such a silly post. If you can't see objectivity in my posts I'm not interested. And I bore you ?!! rofl, as if this game didn't annihilate any notion of entertainment you had left from the other matches !!

The level of play has been abysmal this tournament, and the "good team", England, are a little far from entertaining themselves. France and Ireland, the two teams that have attacking flair in this tournament, have completely underperformed - esp. France, of course.
So many matches without tries, without any risks taken, terrible mistakes throughout the 80min, guys not knowing the rules committing childish penalties, fundamentals unchecked...FRA WAL was one of the shhittiest games I've seen in recent memory, only beaten by this very one (SCO WAL).

And to Wales fans (....with common sense): I obviously wouldn't be exactly reassured with the current state of the team. There are okay elements, like the return of a strong scrum (despite it not engaging on many occasions to have the opposite scrum collapse ^_^!), strong defense...but on attack, my goodness...there is zero creativity, and though the raw talent is quite rich, the team overall looks un-threatening on attack. You have an amazing fullback, good/very good backs altogether, Jones and a strong scrum for the forwards...but the efforts are FLAT. Yes you've broken through the 8-game slide, and it's good of course, but my God come World Cup time, or wtvr other big event (NOT JAPAN !!); this team would better work on a number of things.
Like, it's not coz Wales just won 3 in a row that "yay that's it, forget aaaalll the problems we're good again".

I mean this in a Northern Hemisphere way, not merely a french guy criticizing Wales. We are at a low...low point right now. This is one of the shhittiest 6N I've seen in my life. Go back and watch some 80's/90's/2000's stuff if you don't believe me lol, refresh your memories ! This is ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww, as if it needed to be mentioned !!
I forced myself to sit through the entire 80min of this match, just to analyze the play from both teams. But I felt like leaving the couch every 10min or so, and I nearly didn't come back for the 2nd half but I thought it would be better...

I personally can't wait for the summer and beyond...thank God the RWC is so far from now...I'm not sure any 6N side would make it past the pools !

Like, I'm at a point where I'm eager for the next 4N to get my taste for Rugby fully restored. I want to see tries, complete plays, phases with a conclusion, running, passing, real structure on attack, creativity, good fundamental skills...not.........this !

You know what's funny ... you like picking faults / criticize with everyone else team ... but not your own. It certainly amuses me.

 

[Patchey]

Correlation being abysmal weather in North West Europe for all but the first weekend of the tournament and a lack of flair, risk and tries and a high error count? I think so...

 

[LittleGuy]

Thought everyone was raving after the first week, this is the greatest 6 Nations ... times have changed.

That first week was a little overated, the Italy vs. France game was great and Ireland vs. Wales became very good after 45 minutes(unless you're an Irish fan) but wasn't anything thrilling before that point, and England vs. Scotland was entertaining but wasn't close or dramatic.

 

[tompaton]

I'm stoked for Warburton, he's a class player and to see him do what he did out there was brilliant. People can talk about Robshaw all they want and he's an outstanding player and captain himself, but he has never put in as good a breakdown display as that. Gatland wants a natural on the ball openside flanker and I believe Warburton is that man. I do think though, that Robshaw could play a low tackling role that the likes of Lydiate play and be utilised at 6. That is, if Lydiate does not make the plane.

I also thought Tipuric came in and played his best half of rugby in the tournament as well. He seems to add more to Wales when he comes off the bench rather than starting. That said with Ryan probably out next week, both of the two starting is probably the best option, unless Lydiate is fit to go???

 

[Ospreylian]

I also thought Tipuric came in and played his best half of rugby in the tournament as well. He seems to add more to Wales when he comes off the bench rather than starting. That said with Ryan probably out next week, both of the two starting is probably the best option, unless Lydiate is fit to go???

I agree, Tipuric played out of his skin. The competition the Welsh management have now generated between Warburton and Tipuric is fantastic. It seems one will up their game when the other edges ahead of them in the pecking order. It's really great to see such competition, and I'm sure they enjoy it too, it will only improve them as players in the long term. Wales are ridiculously privileged to have ONE absolutely class openside flanker, let alone TWO.

Ignoring Lydiate for now, I really like the balance of a Tipuric, Faletau, Warburton back row. As much as I love Ryan Jones, Tipuric's performance yesterday cannot be ignored. He provides a running link between the forwards and backs and his work in the loose is phenomenal. Faletau provides fantastic defense, and very rarely misses tackles, and Warburton gives the team breakdown work and turnover ball, as well as some good ball-carrying. He also made 13 tackles yesterday, missing 1, so it's not as if his defensive work is all that shabby either.

I was pretty impressed with Ken Owens' impact from the bench as well. When Hibbard was taken off I was pretty angry, because obviously he was one of Wales' stand-out players. But just looking at Owens' stats, he made 9 tackles in that 20 minutes that he was on the field, without missing a single one. That is joint 4th tackler with Ian Evans. It just shows that Wales do have a decent bench to rely on still, like they did in the world cup.

Obviously the game wasn't the most exciting, and that shows in the fact that, between the two teams, only ONE clean line-break was made, by George North. Discipline was terrible too, 16 penalties conceded by Scotland and 12 by Wales.

 

[Big Ewis]

You know what's funny ... you like picking faults / criticize with everyone else team ... but not your own. It certainly amuses me.

you're soooooo sensitive about your team it amazes me. You're the kind of person who will only accept (semi-accept ?) a guy who goes "Listen, I suck at everything...just, everything...I'm so miserably terrible at everything...but now if I could just say I think you're a little bit - just a TAD BIT...- if I may say so, just a tad bit pretentious" as criticism.

It absolutely amazes me, really I can't stress enough the amazement, because I've kept saying how monstrously shhityyy France has been for weeks and weeks now, as is due.
And this is the SCO WAL thread my friend, how ridiculous is it you would bring up France here ?! You actually wanted me to, in order to say what I CAME HERE TO SAY about the team in question in this thread, go like "listen, France sucks horribly, we really do, we're so bad hah hah hah..." and then type what I actually came here to say ? :lol:
The hyper-sensitivity is unbelievable !!

Man, go on the France threads and say what you want about France honey, it's a forum, no problem !! That's what it's made for !! But with a name like "Cymru" you must be one of those irrational Welsh supporters who just cannot imagine the idea of someone criticizing the Welsh team, or something in that vein...

And btw: I don't read every single comment here, but I'm pretty impressed by the Welsh fans not criticizing their own team. Where's the self-criticism fellas ?! it's like the welsh fans are so happy they're winning again after a....chasm honestly, that they won't even look at how awful they look on the field and only pick the positives !

Guys, wake up, Wales has nothing on attack. They throw themselves at the defense and hope for an opening eventually...and yes of course France has sucked this tournament, if this helps somehow validate my criticism. France has played like fkn *****, there happy now ?

 

[dullonien]

Yoe91, yes I am happy we are winning again. I prefer that Wales win ugly than lose pretty, and as a Welsh supporter I've experienced both over the past decade. Our forwards are possibly the best in this tournament (the big test being next week against England), with great strength in depth developing in most positions. That is cause for optimism because it provides a great platform to re-discover and work on our backline play.

I think everyone in Wales wants to see our attacking game improved, but for the minute our options to do that are somewhat limited due to injures. Ashley Beck has only recently returned from injury, and he's not going to be thrown into the final game of the tournament against England. Eli Walker is also injured, and those two are probably the obvious two who could come in an increase our attacking threats. There's also Henson, but he's still on the road back and not ready yet. A change at 9 would also be welcome, but that's not going to happen unfortunately. Phillips had a good game yesterday, but he still plays a certain way that doesn't promote attacking rugby. Anyone who saw Rhodri Williams' performance for the U20's saw what a traditional sniping scrum half can add to a team. There is going to be a great chance to work on our attacking game this Summer.

We've also got to put things into context. After a dismal first 45min against Ireland, we probably strung together the most impressive attacking 35min of any team in the tournament thus far. However it still took our losing streak to 8. The next game against France was simply must win, and we did so by grinding out the result, nothing wrong with that. Up next was Italy in atrocious conditions, never going to be a free flowing game there. And finally there was Scotland yesterday, again pretty poor conditions, and we were playing against a team who conceded 18 penalties. When a team does that there is little chance to open the game up, because the other team stopped us from doing so. There is also little incentive to do so, when we still put almost 30 points on them with only scoring one try.

 

[Tony Manx]

. When a team does that there is little chance to open the game up, because the other team stopped us from doing so. There is also little incentive to do so, when we still put almost 30 points on them with only scoring one try.

I would agree that that is part of the reason but only part.....Wales were not that good by their high standards and not all can be laid at the door of the way Scotland played or the weather. They will have to play immeasurably better than that to win against England it was Martyn Williams who said that and not just me...............

 

[Aedaphon]

Yoe91, yes I am happy we are winning again. I prefer that Wales win ugly than lose pretty, and as a Welsh supporter I've experienced both over the past decade. Our forwards are possibly the best in this tournament (the big test being next week against England), with great strength in depth developing in most positions. That is cause for optimism because it provides a great platform to re-discover and work on our backline play.

I think everyone in Wales wants to see our attacking game improved, but for the minute our options to do that are somewhat limited due to injures. Ashley Beck has only recently returned from injury, and he's not going to be thrown into the final game of the tournament against England. Eli Walker is also injured, and those two are probably the obvious two who could come in an increase our attacking threats. There's also Henson, but he's still on the road back and not ready yet. A change at 9 would also be welcome, but that's not going to happen unfortunately. Phillips had a good game yesterday, but he still plays a certain way that doesn't promote attacking rugby. Anyone who saw Rhodri Williams' performance for the U20's saw what a traditional sniping scrum half can add to a team. There is going to be a great chance to work on our attacking game this Summer.

We've also got to put things into context. After a dismal first 45min against Ireland, we probably strung together the most impressive attacking 35min of any team in the tournament thus far. However it still took our losing streak to 8. The next game against France was simply must win, and we did so by grinding out the result, nothing wrong with that. Up next was Italy in atrocious conditions, never going to be a free flowing game there. And finally there was Scotland yesterday, again pretty poor conditions, and we were playing against a team who conceded 18 penalties. When a team does that there is little chance to open the game up, because the other team stopped us from doing so. There is also little incentive to do so, when we still put almost 30 points on them with only scoring one try.

While I do agree with your assessment of the conditions in the Northern Hemisphere over the course of the Six Nations, the Frenchman does have a bit of a point: no Northern Hemisphere attack has looked like it could consistently out play and create gaps their opposition's defence.

Ireland played some gorgeous rugby in the opening weekend and, although I believe their opening try yesterday was an exemplar piece of set piece play, they haven't looked nearly as fluid since.

England have battered their way through a number of teams and relied on Farrell's metronomic boot to guide them through the Six Nations thus far.

Wales also had free flowing in the first week and whilst their is an argument to be made for the abysmal conditions they've faced they really haven't produced much of anything in attack, especially off the kick return where the punt return is not only their go to, but seemingly their only tactic.

France... Has looked abysmal behind a Machenaud-Michalak half back pairing. I'd like to say some of the best attacking rugby has in fact come from the Parra-FTD pairing we saw for half the game last week. But with PSA seemingly trying to sink the French ship, we won't be seeing them together for a long time...

Italy finally looked good behind Orquera on the first weekend (probably a large factor in prompting what people were calling the best opening to the 6N ever) but have frankly been outplayed in every game since. For me this is the biggest shame because I have been rooting for Italy for absolutely years...

I actually admire Scotland for running the ball back at their opposition when they have the chance but their chances have been... well few and far between is an understatement. It's hard to make comments about an attack when the team mounting it never has the ball <_<

 

[dullonien]

I would agree that that is part of the reason but only part.....Wales were not that good by their high standards and not all can be laid at the door of the way Scotland played or the weather. They will have to play immeasurably better than that to win against England it was Martyn Williams who said that and not just me...............

Yup I agree that we we have still been poor in attack. Roberts only get's a couple of touches a game, North and Cuthbert have their moments, but aren't brought into the game enough, and Jon Davies is also not getting his hands on the ball enough either.

However, I'm not sure we do have to play too much better to beat England next week, not in attack anyway. If we get on top up front again, our defence holds firm and we take the one or two chances that present themselves, like we have in the previous 3 games, then that should be enough to win again imo. To do that will mean upping the performance somewhat, but I've actually been very pleased with our forwards performances, and as the old saying goes, forwards win you game, the backs decide by how much. Of course, England have also been good up front, and in defence, so it'll be whoever get's on top in those areas that will win imo. I would like to see our backs cut loose, but Howley seems incapable of producing a gameplan that can do so.....

 

[TRF_Cymro]

you're soooooo sensitive about your team it amazes me. You're the kind of person who will only accept (semi-accept ?) a guy who goes "Listen, I suck at everything...just, everything...I'm so miserably terrible at everything...but now if I could just say I think you're a little bit - just a TAD BIT...- if I may say so, just a tad bit pretentious" as criticism.

It absolutely amazes me, really I can't stress enough the amazement, because I've kept saying how monstrously shhityyy France has been for weeks and weeks now, as is due.
And this is the SCO WAL thread my friend, how ridiculous is it you would bring up France here ?! You actually wanted me to, in order to say what I CAME HERE TO SAY about the team in question in this thread, go like "listen, France sucks horribly, we really do, we're so bad hah hah hah..." and then type what I actually came here to say ? :lol:
The hyper-sensitivity is unbelievable !!

Man, go on the France threads and say what you want about France honey, it's a forum, no problem !! That's what it's made for !! But with a name like "Cymru" you must be one of those irrational Welsh supporters who just cannot imagine the idea of someone criticizing the Welsh team, or something in that vein...

And btw: I don't read every single comment here, but I'm pretty impressed by the Welsh fans not criticizing their own team. Where's the self-criticism fellas ?! it's like the welsh fans are so happy they're winning again after a....chasm honestly, that they won't even look at how awful they look on the field and only pick the positives !

Guys, wake up, Wales has nothing on attack. They throw themselves at the defense and hope for an opening eventually...and yes of course France has sucked this tournament, if this helps somehow validate my criticism. France has played like fkn *****, there happy now ?

Nah not sensitive, but by your reaction / response you certainly are. Again on the defensive.

Also to enlighten you, 'Cymru' means Wales ... and 'Cymro' means Welshman, in Welsh. So your a bit clueless there, to call irrational and vein is a tad rich from you. Might do you some good to read and look into things instead of getting your massive ego stuck in the door on the way in.

Also might have an early candidate for TRFies here. Full of riddles.

 

[Big Ewis]

dullonien :
right on buddy, I'm not questioning all that...but I will not stand for Welsh fans all of a sudden pretending like nothing happened, like a certain MONUMENTAL streak didn't just end, and whistle it off...:whistle3:
Be men fellas, when things are **** they're ****, when things are a bit better they're only A BIT better...Wales, I MUST insist, look like a tremendous pile of steaming you know what on attack, ESPECIALLY given who they have on the team. They just, I repeat, throw themselves at the opponents, where the hell are the nice wide passes, the interior to exterior distribution etc...the quick scrum half releases...
I hope Wales come right back to conquer their attack once again as it's just incredible they've gone from unanimously voted and achieved Grand Slam to nothingness complete in such a short period of time. Now they're winning again, it's good, but as a welshman I would have to be a lot, lot more critical of my own side is aaaaaaall I'm saying.