[June Tests 2018: 1st Test] New Zealand vs. France (09/06/2018)

[FrenchFan]

we will see a much closer game when their A-Team hits the field next week and given the All Blacks are always crap in their first game of the season playing an understrength French team I don't think there is anything that can be taken from the game other than the performance of individual players.

There is no A side. Cavalry maybe?

 

[All Black]

From the way he talked about it after the incident, didn't seem like he saw it properly and thought it was just a head on head.

Well it did happen all very fast I guess. Still, Pearce did brush it off as 'just a head to head' and that statement in its context, has accident written all over it.

Every game will have 1 to a 100 complaints about the ref. It seems to me that the ref isnt a talking point around this particular incident which is odd considering he literally holds all the cards. I thought Luke Pearce reffed the game pretty well when we were losing throughout the first half. Sadly his performance, like Wayne Barnes of another particular test between the All Blacks and France, will come under some scrutiny.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...sorry-but-the-all-blacks-are-now-a-dirty-side

Just gonna leave this here... Take from it what you will...

 

[All Black]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...sorry-but-the-all-blacks-are-now-a-dirty-side

Just gonna leave this here... Take from it what you will...

LOL old Mark Treason. Makes me laugh how speaks on behalf of "all New Zealanders" and how we are sick of the All Blacks (as he puts it) negativity.

 

[mania]

Problem is Mania that if you lose while cheating, no one cares or remembers.

i know bobby. just get sick of the ABs being portrayed as cheaters when really there are worse. ABs imo need to get over this nice guys image they maintain

 

[smartcooky]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...sorry-but-the-all-blacks-are-now-a-dirty-side

Just gonna leave this here... Take from it what you will...

MR : DR

Thats "Mark Reason : Didn't Read" - as soon as I saw the page ***le in the URL, I knew who the writer would be.

Reason is just a kiwi hater, like his ignorant father. Makes me wonder why he even wants to live here.

LOL old Mark Treason. Makes me laugh how speaks on behalf of "all New Zealanders" and how we are sick of the All Blacks (as he puts it) negativity.

That's rich coming from a Pommie. He must think we are still part of "the jolly Empire old chap"

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

The article is OTT, I do agree NZ are on the dirty side of things though, primarily due to Cane's presence.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I think the majority of the NZ team seem like top blokes; very down to earth and don't seem like they'd intentionally hurt their opposition outside of the laws. Even SBW after his red was clearly very shaken by it, shown by the doco. That said, Cane is a bad apple. He's always getting caught up in these incidents where a player gets a pretty serious injury (Grosso, Henshaw) because Cane's done something a bit ****ly but not massively obvious so gets away with it. I really dislike him.

 

[Darwin]

I think the majority of the NZ team seem like top blokes; very down to earth and don't seem like they'd intentionally hurt their opposition outside of the laws. Even SBW after his red was clearly very shaken by it, shown by the doco. That said, Cane is a bad apple. He's always getting caught up in these incidents where a player gets a pretty serious injury (Grosso, Henshaw) because Cane's done something a bit ****ly but not massively obvious so gets away with it. I really dislike him.

Always? Twice in his career that I can recall (spanning over 100 Super Rugby games and over 50 tests). Having watched a huge amount of Sam Cane I completely disagree he is a dirty player. Yes, he's been involved in a couple of incidents where players have been injured, but in both cases his actions were more reckless than a deliberate attempt to injure a player. Cane's game is built around dominant tackling. Indeed he probably hits as hard as anyone in the game. On the odd occasion he may slip up too high, or hit a player high when the player slips into him. This doesn't make him dirty. He's not remotely '****ly'; indeed I can't recall him being involved in a single incident off the ball in his entire career!

This is not to say all the All Blacks are saints. Far from it! Indeed there are a number of current All Blacks are prone to being ****ly, take the odd cheap shot, or are just plain dirty at times. Dane Coles (currently injured), Joe Moody, Owen Franks, and (in particular) Liam Squire (that's half the forward pack!) all come to mind as players who cross the line far too often for my liking. Do the All Blacks occasionally play a bit dirty? Yes. Do they get away with it at times? Yes. Are the All Blacks dirtier than other sides. No.

Anyway, a few quick thoughts on the test.

The French looked good on defence for 60 minutes until they lost a player and subsequently lost the plot. They didn't offer much in attack though. Bastareaud was fatter and slower than when I last saw him. I struggle to see how they will create much with him in the midfield. Thomas impressed with ball in hand (though looks a bit suspect on defense), while Grosso looked sharp too.

For the AB's Taylor was excellent - he's really developed into a top class international hooker. He was superb at the set piece, and his general play around the field was brilliant too. The props were solid, with Tu'inukuafe impressive off the bench on debut - he looks to have a bit future. Scott Barrret played his best game in Black, continuing on his good form with the Crusaders. I thought Squire played well, though he played a lot tighter than usual (which was good to see). Luke Whitelock was very good. He's clearly the 2nd best 8 in the country.

I thought the midfield was pretty good (ALB recovered well after a couple of early drops), while McKenzie made an excellent impact off the bench (though should have passed inside to Ben Smith rather than going himself on one occasion). The bench role suits McKenzie well, so (despite his eye-catching display) I don't think he will be starting for the AB's anytime soon.

 

[Hanley!]

I'm only catching up on this now, and I'm shocked by the ref's decision, the citing commissioner's decision, and the decision of some of the All Black fans to treat these rulings as anything less than ridiculous. I'll be thinking of Remy Grosso the next time I hear some twat of a fan saying the game has gone soft. Getting rid of reckless, dangerous high tackles is important and worthwhile and this proves that - contrary to what some people believe - not enough is being done.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

MR : DR

Thats "Mark Reason : Didn't Read" - as soon as I saw the page ***le in the URL, I knew who the writer would be.

Reason is just a kiwi hater, like his ignorant father. Makes me wonder why he even wants to live here.



That's rich coming from a Pommie. He must think we are still part of "the jolly Empire old chap"

You all still are. Harry and Meghan will be down to give the next orders later this year old chap.

 

[Darwin]

I forgot to mention that I thought that the referee overall had a pretty good game, apart from his yellow card decisions (the French player obviously should not have received a yellow, while Cane should have received a yellow IMO). He was perhaps a little pedantic, but I think with experience he could develop into a very good test referee.

 

[Five Meters Out]

I think the majority of the NZ team seem like top blokes; very down to earth and don't seem like they'd intentionally hurt their opposition outside of the laws. Even SBW after his red was clearly very shaken by it, shown by the doco. That said, Cane is a bad apple. He's always getting caught up in these incidents where a player gets a pretty serious injury (Grosso, Henshaw) because Cane's done something a bit ****ly but not massively obvious so gets away with it. I really dislike him.

Having watched a fair bit of him, I wouldn't call Sam Cane a dirty player. Cane is merely a product of the NZ system. Go to any ground in NZ on a Saturday and you will see and hear open side flankers being instructed to play exactly the way Cane plays his rugby. They're expected to play very aggressively, right to the edge. If you play like that the margin for error is small and there are times you'll go into penalty territory. But that's accepted. If flankers in NZ don't play in that manner, they get replaced by one that will.
Now if we were talking about Liam Squire, well............he's different story. Reminds me of Cowboy Shaw and Grizz Wylie from back in the day.

 

[Immenso]

I forgot to mention that I thought that the referee overall had a pretty good game, apart from his yellow card decisions (the French player obviously should not have received a yellow, while Cane should have received a yellow IMO). He was perhaps a little pedantic, but I think with experience he could develop into a very good test referee.

So, did I. Thought he was excellent outside the two controversial incidents, and also have the same view on the cards. No yellow for France, yellow for Cane, no card for Ofa T.

Other thing ref was criticised for was Ardie Savea's try when his knee touched the ground. Ref saw the grounding so had no need (he thought) to use the TMO. While that try was technically incorrect NZ were under penalty advantage in front of the sticks, something was coming anyway.

Ref will carry the baggage a long time though I'd say, rugby fans are ref-blaming card-braying cry babies.

 

[BobbyM]

I'm only catching up on this now, and I'm shocked by the ref's decision, the citing commissioner's decision, and the decision of some of the All Black fans to treat these rulings as anything less than ridiculous. I'll be thinking of Remy Grosso the next time I hear some twat of a fan saying the game has gone soft. Getting rid of reckless, dangerous high tackles is important and worthwhile and this proves that - contrary to what some people believe - not enough is being done.

What shocks you about the decision? Did you agree with the referee and citing commissioner? If not, why not? Is this a case of the rules not being followed or a case of new or different rules needed? Given the significant increase in physicality of the game since it became professional, I would be surprised to hear people saying the game has gone soft.

 

[FrenchFan]

The French looked good on defence for 60 minutes until they lost a player and subsequently lost the plot. They didn't offer much in attack though. Bastareaud was fatter and slower than when I last saw him. I struggle to see how they will create much with him in the midfield. Thomas impressed with ball in hand (though looks a bit suspect on defense), while Grosso looked sharp too.

that's not surprising. They're one of the lowest try scoring team around. They've scored less tries than Italy in the last two 6N.
NZ are going to walk the series. In fact from watching SR I'd fancy one of the NZ provinces to win it.

Are you guys paying to watch this?

 

[Thingimubob]

Well it did happen all very fast I guess. Still, Pearce did brush it off as 'just a head to head' and that statement in its context, has accident written all over it.

Every game will have 1 to a 100 complaints about the ref. It seems to me that the ref isnt a talking point around this particular incident which is odd considering he literally holds all the cards. I thought Luke Pearce reffed the game pretty well when we were losing throughout the first half. Sadly his performance, like Wayne Barnes of another particular test between the All Blacks and France, will come under some scrutiny.

Get what you're saying, but the context is changed completely by the fact that not one but two contacts to the head are missed out, which happened before the head on head collision.

Had Pearce noticed this then maybe he wouldn't have brushed off the TMO with the "only a head clash" line, as it clearly wasn't just that.

Overall I didn't think Pearce was atrocious, nor did he really have an affect on the result, just the ridiculous inconsistency between his treatment of the French yellow card and then the AB players in the Grosso incident knocks his grade down quite a bit!

 

[FrenchFan]

I don't get all the talk about the yellow card excuse. It didn't change the outcome of the game and the ****-poor showing by the tourists.

Aren't test teams supposed to apply their game plan when they're down to 14 or 13 men? of course they are. It's part of their training. All the Top 14 teams
train with one or 2 players out in order to work their defensive and attacking patterns. Because yellows will happen. So one player out and the whole team collapses. Not my idea of a team. But when was the last time the union put a team together. I can't remember.

If NZ recycle the ball in the opposition's 20s. They will score 9 times out of 10. McKenzie ran around Bastareaud like he wasn't there. Teddy Thomas defensive
positioning was shocking at times even with 15 players on. That's down to poor defensive coaching and a test player not knowing his positioning. They defended and played like a tier 2 side. Because they're coached like one. Simple.

It was a foregone conclusion NZ were going to win - the only question was by how much. The yellow didn't change that. It only accelerated the inevitable. Fair
or unfair the yellow didn't determine the huge mismatch that exist btw the 2 sides. That mismatch was there before the KO. You only need look at the team compo for starters.

 

[mania]

with all these cheating accusations i forgot to mention the ABs forward pack
d4m they were busy and did loads of tight work.
special mention has got to go to scottBarret, moody, squire and the Whitelocks, george was every bit as busy and effective as sam. they were supreme at the rucks and mauls, tirelessly clearing and securing.
codieTaylor was good but played pretty loose.
canes was as usual a tackling terminator.
tuinukuafe has a lot to learn about the tight work imo. he's got a big task ahead of him learning to keep up with our forwards workload. at times he seemed a bit lost in open play.
forwards won this game for the ABs and set an awesome platform for aaron and beudy to run their backs.
love these kind of games where the arm-wrestling at the coal face comes to the fore.

 

[mania]

I think the majority of the NZ team seem like top blokes; very down to earth and don't seem like they'd intentionally hurt their opposition outside of the laws. Even SBW after his red was clearly very shaken by it, shown by the doco. That said, Cane is a bad apple. He's always getting caught up in these incidents where a player gets a pretty serious injury (Grosso, Henshaw) because Cane's done something a bit ****ly but not massively obvious so gets away with it. I really dislike him.

thats a real shame. watch cane and solely cane for the full 80 mins and you will appreciate what he brings to the game. youre looking at a split second of his game and ignoring the other 79 mins and 58 secs of his game.
he's ruthless and hard hitting, but never dirty. every team needs someone like cane in their side. he's the kinda of player that you dont need to give instructions too. all you have to say to him (as they say in the avengers) is "cane smash"