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England's back line

I am undecided as to where he'll be best suited - he could be good at 6, 8, 12 or 13.

The trouble is that at Bath we already have three potential England centres.
Two of which would probably want to move on should they lose their starting berth - I can't see either Eastmond or Joseph being content as bench players (quite rightly, too).

He will almost certainly play a bit at centre (the coaches have explicitly said so) - whether he then moves on to the back row is a different matter.
We are pretty stacked in the back row too, though.

I'd largely agree with what Olyy is saying.

From an England point of view I'd love it if tigers signed eastmond off bath and Bath played Burgess at 12 . Would have some consistent partnerships then with Burns, Eastmond, Tuilagi and Ford, Burgess, Joseph
 
Take Hooper out the side,....move Garvey to 4/5.
Move Burgess to 6 / 8 with Fearns at 6/8 and Louw at 7.

Keep Eastmond at 12.

England
6 Burgess
7 Robshaw
8 Billy V or Ben M

Now thats got some power, carrying , tackling...work rate...
 
Take Hooper out the side,....move Garvey to 4/5.
Move Burgess to 6 / 8 with Fearns at 6/8 and Louw at 7.

Keep Eastmond at 12.

England
6 Burgess
7 Robshaw
8 Billy V or Ben M

Now thats got some power, carrying , tackling...work rate...

No idea why bath made hooper captain! Such an average player who surely can't be sure of his place in the team
 
He's a very good captain - he was captain at Leeds too.

Coaches are always full of praise of him as a captain. I agree he certainly doesn't set the world alight, but he's decent.
 
He's a very good captain - he was captain at Leeds too.

Coaches are always full of praise of him as a captain. I agree he certainly doesn't set the world alight, but he's decent.

Also teams need players like him . Reminds me a lot of Leo Cullen at Leicester . Unseen work is more important the seen work imo
 
Mike Ford has said that Burgess will come in as a centre for Bath. Arriving on 15th October, expected to get his first game time in November.
Would expect that means he'll feature vs London Welsh and/or Exeter Chiefs in the LV= cup.
 
Mike Ford has said that Burgess will come in as a centre for Bath. Arriving on 15th October, expected to get his first game time in November.
Would expect that means he'll feature vs London Welsh and/or Exeter Chiefs in the LV= cup.

Will certainly boost attendance figures for the LV games.

Makes more sense to start at centre imo, he would've needed the whole off-season to learn the breakdown technique if he was to play in the back row..
 
Mike Ford has said that Burgess will come in as a centre for Bath. Arriving on 15th October, expected to get his first game time in November.
Would expect that means he'll feature vs London Welsh and/or Exeter Chiefs in the LV= cup.

I'm sure he will be the creative 12 Lancaster has been crying out for :p
 
Somewhere Warren Gatland is smiling with pride as he observed Gatlandball spreading out to conquer another nation's rugby psyche.
 
Ah man where does that leave Eastmond?? For me he could be the 12 we've been looking for.
He looked very impressive in the 1st test in NZ and made a good combo with Manu.

Also (with regards to England) we're forgetting Burrell who alongside Mike Brown was one of our players of the 6n.
 
Ah man where does that leave Eastmond?? For me he could be the 12 we've been looking for.
He looked very impressive in the 1st test in NZ and made a good combo with Manu.

Also (with regards to England) we're forgetting Burrell who alongside Mike Brown was one of our players of the 6n.

But Burrell also looked distinctly average in NZ, so question marks over him for sure.

Eastmond is in some predicament it seems.
 
This is nothing new - he said as much when they first announced it, they've also continually reiterated that they don't want to use him in a conventional way.

From everything they've said it seems to be as if Ford is trying to create a new style of back row/centre player that loosely resembles a league loose forward.
 
Patchy

Burrell looked off the pace, but so did Farrell, Launchbury etc etc...i think half of them were just knackered after a long season...aswell as the fact we were playing NZ in NZ.

I suspect we will see Burrell back to his best this season. In the 6n it was him running the great lines (and scoring off them) that we expect from Ashton, which we havent seen him doing.

Didnt realise that Rats...do you think that will work?
 
I'm happy for them too use him in the conventional way, just like Jamie Roberts. He is far more physical than the other 12's around so why not utilise it ? Put Burgess next too Tuilagi and batter every other team into submission, have playmakers in other places like South Africa. Care-Cipriani-Yarde-Burgess-Tuilagi-Daly-Brown / opposite Care-Farrell-Banahan-Burgess-Pohe-Tuilagi-Foden
 
But isnt that what Burrell did in the 6n...but also offered some intelligent line running in to the space between tacklers giving a bit of variance?
 
As Rats has already said, everyone knew that Burgess would be getting games at centre to ease him in - and surely, everybody knows that doesn't mean he'll end up there.

Christ knows why we're talking about Pohe already. Yeah, I know he's really big, but that doesn't mean he'll be international standard. Maybe let the kid get a few games, assuming he does, what with Leicester probably being the single worse club for bringing through their youngsters.

The state of England's back line in that tour means I wouldn't want to take away too many negatives about any player. My main objection to Burrell is he doesn't seem to be the sort of player we want at 12 and he doesn't have the same impact as Tuilagi at 13.
 
The state of England's back line in that tour means I wouldn't want to take away too many negatives about any player. My main objection to Burrell is he doesn't seem to be the sort of player we want at 12 and he doesn't have the same impact as Tuilagi at 13.

Summed up nicely!

The full conversation with Ford: http://www.espn.co.uk/premiership-2014-15/rugby/story/238911.html

Bath head coach Mike Ford has confirmed rugby league star Sam Burgess will begin his union career in the centres.
Burgess will join Bath at the end of the NRL season with his team the Rabbitohs set to reach the final. If they achieve that feat, Burgess is likely to arrive in mid-October with a view to playing his first game of union in November.
There were original reports Ford saw Burgess as a blindside or No.8 and he could yet end up there, but his first exposure to rugby will be in the backs.
"We've got a plan for him in the centres to start with, but my gut feeling is he will end up in the pack," Ford said. "Whether that will be Christmas, whether it will be Christmas 2015 who knows? He's here for a long time so we're not too worried about that."

When rumours of Burgess' switch to union came to light, the Rugby Football Union was reported to be footing some of the transfer fee and his wages but Bath ended up purchasing the player solely with their own funds. Stuart Lancaster has previously said he sees Burgess as a centre but Ford says Bath will have jurisdiction over the management of his switch to union.
"They've got nothing to do with him, the RFU have got no say in his development at Bath rugby," Ford added. "They haven't asked us to play him at centre, but clearly I've spoken to Stuart and we're on the same lines. He again wants Sam Burgess to be Sam Burgess."

When Kyle Eastmond made his switch from league to union, much of his first season was blighted with injury. For Ford, central to the transition from one code to the other will be careful management of Burgess and he will not rush him.
"When he arrives we're going to have a look at him. I think South Sydney will get to the grand final this year they are playing that well. So he'll have to be refreshed mentally and physically, give him a couple of weeks off, let him look at the game, learn the game, learn what the ruck's all about, the fundamentals of the game.

"We'll see how he is. The last thing I want to do is for us to get to March, April time and for him to be burned out. We've got to really look after him, it's a tough league. We've got a plan for him now, but there's so many variables that can happen between now and then.
"Clearly we'll probably look at him in the centres first and foremost, let him learn the game from afar really. But if he's doing 60 plays a game in the NRL then you don't really want him playing on the wing do you, in rugby union."

Exactly the right attitude IMO.
 
I see him as a flanker / No. 8 personally, so I see him starting off at 12 then moving after.
 
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