England vs Australia

[Olyy]

Definatley agree with tait/foden on the bench,
Taking off Banahan at some point in the second, moving monye to wing and bringing on a specialist FB could've worked well

 

[munstermuffin]

England ranked 7 in world

NZ, SA, Aus, Ire, Fra, Arg, all ahead of ye and Wales should be too so like not much to be upbeat about :huh:

 

[Infern0]

Just as i said, in a different class. Not that I care, David Haye is what british sport is all about baby!

New Zealand by 30 points next week, but we will probably scrape a close win against Argentina and that will make everything all right as usual lol

 

[QLD]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wally @ Nov 8 2009, 02:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Yeahhh that's my f***ing boy Genia. Most pleasing aspect of the game was the fact Australia actually had the composure to keep plugging away even after numerous botched try attempts.

7. Moody > Smith

Apart from that surprising match up Australia dominated. Special note needs to be made about Wilko's tackling, what a man. None were better then Rocky's hit on Banahan though. Huge.

9. Genia 12. Cooper 13. Ioane 14. Hynes = Reds for the win. Bet Barnes is starting to regret turning his back on Queensland.

Hope Ioane's injury isn't too serious because Cross sucks. His positioning when he came on was sketchy as.

Ashley-Cooper is the best fullback in Australia and this should be his position from now on.[/b]

pretty much spot on. Except our lineout is woeful. 50/50 ball on our throw and we never throw anyone up on the oppositions ball. Yer that pommy 7 was a menace, their whole forward pack was decent. Our second row is non-existant. Our backs were better but well done to Jonny Wilkinson who I rate higher than Carter.

 

[Bullitt]

Well, that should put pay to all this ******** about shoehorning players out of position at least.

And what a surprise... Wilkinson comes in and it's the "give it to Jonny" show. And when that failed there was no plan B.

Pathetic.

 

[Bullitt]

Stuart Barnes is spot on;

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/rug...icle6907872.ece

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Nov 8 2009, 10:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Well, that should put pay to all this ******** about shoehorning players out of position at least.

And what a surprise... Wilkinson comes in and it's the "give it to Jonny" show. And when that failed there was no plan B.

Pathetic.[/b]

Yes, Geraghty and Monye played out of position.
No, we don't have anyone who is better.

The main problem as far as i see it was nerves from Geraghty's part, and i would much prefer him on the pitch that a 12. Hipkiss 13. Erinle combination at centre.

at fullback, we all know Foden and Abendanon can't defend, at least Monye has some international experience and can (mostly) put in a decent tackle.

for next week i would go with a team of:

1. Barnes
2. Hartley
3. Wilson
4. Lawes (even if Shaw is 100%)
5. Borthwick
6. Croft
7. Moody
8. Haskell
9. Hodgson
10. Wilkinson
11. Banahan
12. Geraghty
13. Hipkiss
14. Monye
15. Cueto

16. Bell
17. Thompson
18. Shaw
19. Armitage
20. Care
21. Tait
22. Foden

Payne is honestly the biggest waste of space in the world, ever. He does **** all apart from scrummage whereas Barnes scrummages better (demolished Payne when Wasps played Bath, resulting in a Payne red card for 2 collapsed scrums) and also offers power and offloading skills in the loose. Might also be tempted to play Wilson at loosehead (where he can play and has for Newcastle, not just in an emergency) with Bell at 3 who looked promising when he came on and made some good ground and offloaded well.

Hartley had an instant impact when he came on, and really gave us added flair in attack. Accurate at the lineout and more promising than Thompson.

If Lawes is going to start any game, this has to be the one. Argentina are missing players and looked vulnerable when ANDY GOODE was playing against them. He looked promising when he came on and secured good line out ball and put himself about.

Haskell was far better than Crane when he came on. Dominant at the breakdown and made a couple of cracking breaks. Looked an improved player. Croft and Moody were superb and with Haskell i think those 3 could, with time, form a great back row with Moody making way for Rees once he gets over his injury problems.

Hodgson gave us quick ball, 'nuff said.

Monye looked poor at fullback, Cueto has played their more often for England.

 

[dullonien]

England could have won that game if they tried to play a bit of rugby. Why do they leve slow ball soo much? Why do the forwards think they can pick and drive over from the half way line? Englands backline had enough firepower to case some majour headaches for Austrailia, yet we hards saw any of them in space. Wilkinson's kicking from hand was terrible for the most part. Geraghty had a mare at 12, with some horrible decisions, at least he tried to play what was in front of him though.

One thing. Whay was Monye playing fullback and Cueto wing? Cueto has a decent amount of international experience at 15! Just an odd decision, although Monye went ok at fullback.

Aus were hopeless in the first half. Penalty after penalty, but England failed to capitalise on it.

The one good thing I can say for England was, good defence for the majority. Wilkinson was superb in this aspect, and really led a very physical midfield defensive line.

As Mite said, England need more than Johnny Wilkinson to win! Christ Stuart Barnes was annoying to listen too. Was basically masturbating over Wilkinson all game (didn't seem to care what was happening in the game either!)

 

[Bullitt]

I have no idea why people think Foden cannot defend. Chinese whispers and lies - started by the same idiots who still harp on about his scrum-half experiment. He's not in the best of form right now, but still the best (only) specialist fullback available while Armitage and Morgan are injured.

As for Monye, Cueto and Bananaman.

Monye - Not at his best, but the future for the England wing. Persevere and don't f*** about with him wearing 15.
Cueto - Solid if unspectacular, he'll have to do until the likes of Cato and Ashton step up.
Banahan - A big man who uses his size against weaker opposition; Which there shouldn't be in the international arena. Not up to standard.

Of other note;
=Care is out of sorts (but the first person to mention Ellis will be shot). It's time to give Hodgson a game.
=The Haskwit was actually better then expected, but I shall still never pay him a compliment out of principal. Because he's an utter f***wit.
=Hartley is THE MAN. Anyone who says otherwise is a communist.
=Don't début Lawes when the games already lost then wonder and criticise him for not making an impact - Unless you want to destroy his confidence and ruin even more young talent needlessly.
=Unless a decent, varied, flexible and expansive gameplan is developed, England could have the cream of world rugby and still get beat by a 2nd rate Oussie side. That is the main problem - Begone Rob Andrew and come back Brian Ashton.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Nov 8 2009, 12:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Unless a decent, varied, flexible and expansive gameplan is developed, England could have the cream of world rugby and still get beat by a 2nd rate Oussie side. That is the main problem - Begone Rob Andrew and come back Brian Ashton.[/b]

So true, we need more attacking moves, the inside ball doesn't always work. Hopefully with a little more time together Brian Smith can start developing this, otherwise he can f*** right off along with Andrew.

 

[Bullitt]

Brian Smith is a f***ing idiot who considers crash ball "innovative".

I do wonder how many players will return to their clubs and will be crap for several weeks because of him.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

I wonder whether Cockerill would be interested in becoming forwards coach so we can get rid of Wells, would love to see Ashton as attack coach but can't see it happening. Maybe someone like Mike Catt would be interested though?

On a positive note, Mike Ford seems to be doing well on the defensive front. We looked very solid yesterday for most of the game.

 

[Bullitt]

Just found this, changes nothing but do with it as you want.

 

[monkeypigeon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Nov 8 2009, 02:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Just found this, changes nothing but do with it as you want.

[/b]

Yeah...wasn't it called back for a knock on before that or someone was offside or something like that?

 

[Bullitt]

Can't remember now.

 

[An Tarbh]

Moody knocked it on from the cross field kick but you've a genuine gripe with the Genia try as it came off the lineout where the ball had gone out on the full but Clancy made a balls of the call.

 

[gingergenius]

Yep, there was definitely some kind of knock on before from memory. That's one of the really annoying things about this game - there's nothing we can complain about.

1st try was very sloppy. A ruck near your line requires guards, and it's not fair to expect Deacon to mark 2 men. Geraghty/ someone else should have stayed there. At international level scoring should never be that simple.

2nd try was equally simple. Poor tackling.

You'd think these errors can be quickly ironed out. The reason this is very annoying because aside from that, our defence was excellent, especially against an attack that always looked threatening.

And herein lies our problem. Our attack was not threatening, I think principally because we did not get enough forward momentum and quick ball. Too many times we had great centrefield position on their 22, but slow ball. As far as I'm concerned, this ball is not worth thinking about. Pocket, drop goal, 3 points thank you. I'd rather win with drop goals than lose with near-misses.

To generate quick ball we really need to sharpen up on ball carrying. In the starting pack, the only player known for his carrying was Crane. And he was no more effective than Easter, which is really disappointing because I thought he was better than that. Shaw and Sheridan both add some muscle, but they're missing. We must select Hartley, Lawes and Haskell in the next game so we can actually get some forward thrust. And if it's not happening, we have to accept it quickly and drop-goal our way to victory.

It's harsh to blame the backline on poor attack when there was nothing coming physically from the forwards. I think Geraghty had a poor game at 12 and is there through lack of other options rather than his own scintillating form, but that's not to say he's a bad player. Give him, Wilkinson and Hipkiss quick ball and you'll find that a defence on the back foot makes a backline look so much better.

Also, can we please put Cueto at fullback, because Monye's talents are best seen on the wing.

my team for Argentina:

1. Payne
2. Hartley
3. Wilson
4. Lawes
5. Borthwick ©
6. Croft
7. Moody
8. Haskell
9. Hodgson
10. Wilkinson
11. Monye
12. Geraghty
13. Hipkiss
14. Strettle
15. Cueto

16. Thompson
17. Barnes
18. Kay/ Shaw (if fit)
19. Armitage
20. Care
21. Tait
22. Foden

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Nov 8 2009, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Yep, there was definitely some kind of knock on before from memory. That's one of the really annoying things about this game - there's nothing we can complain about.

1st try was very sloppy. A ruck near your line requires guards, and it's not fair to expect Deacon to mark 2 men. Geraghty/ someone else should have stayed there. At international level scoring should never be that simple.

2nd try was equally simple. Poor tackling.

You'd think these errors can be quickly ironed out. The reason this is very annoying because aside from that, our defence was excellent, especially against an attack that always looked threatening.

And herein lies our problem. Our attack was not threatening, I think principally because we did not get enough forward momentum and quick ball. Too many times we had great centrefield position on their 22, but slow ball. As far as I'm concerned, this ball is not worth thinking about. Pocket, drop goal, 3 points thank you. I'd rather win with drop goals than lose with near-misses.

To generate quick ball we really need to sharpen up on ball carrying. In the starting pack, the only player known for his carrying was Crane. And he was no more effective than Easter, which is really disappointing because I thought he was better than that. Shaw and Sheridan both add some muscle, but they're missing. We must select Hartley, Lawes and Haskell in the next game so we can actually get some forward thrust. And if it's not happening, we have to accept it quickly and drop-goal our way to victory.

It's harsh to blame the backline on poor attack when there was nothing coming physically from the forwards. I think Geraghty had a poor game at 12 and is there through lack of other options rather than his own scintillating form, but that's not to say he's a bad player. Give him, Wilkinson and Hipkiss quick ball and you'll find that a defence on the back foot makes a backline look so much better.

Also, can we please put Cueto at fullback, because Monye's talents are best seen on the wing.

my team for Argentina:

1. Payne
2. Hartley
3. Wilson
4. Lawes
5. Borthwick ©
6. Croft
7. Moody
8. Haskell
9. Hodgson
10. Wilkinson
11. Monye
12. Geraghty
13. Hipkiss
14. Strettle
15. Cueto

16. Thompson
17. Barnes
18. Kay/ Shaw (if fit)
19. Armitage
20. Care
21. Tait
22. Foden[/b]

I don't think it's really fair to drop Bell and Banahan from the 22, Bell played well when he came on and Banahan has 3 tries in 4 england games (2 against Argentina). Stick with Banahan like Australia have done with Genia and Giteau early in their careers.

 

[Bullitt]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ali12 @ Nov 8 2009, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Banahan has 3 tries in 4 england games[/b]

So? Peter Crouch has 18 goals in 36 international games. You wouldn't call him one of the best strikers in the country though.

Banahan has scored against weak-ass opposition and offers nothing against the big boys who can suss his game and deal with bigger and more talented then him on a weekly basis.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Nov 8 2009, 04:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ali12 @ Nov 8 2009, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Banahan has 3 tries in 4 england games[/b]

So? Peter Crouch has 18 goals in 36 international games. You wouldn't call him one of the best strikers in the country though.

Banahan has scored against weak-ass opposition and offers nothing against the big boys who can suss his game and deal with bigger and more talented then him on a weekly basis.
[/b][/quote]

Well, I would actually...in the top 2 best strikers in the country

back to the point, Argentina aren't 'weak-ass' opposition, they're a better team than we are at the moment.