England vs Argentina - 06/11/22

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

A short term coach might be just what we need. I'm guessing we will beat Japan, lose to the other big two and then Jones and the RFU can claim we made progress and bury their heads.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

EJ gets a lot of stick, often rightly so but they players on the pitch have to shoulder a good share of the blame. A lot of the points today were leaked due to ill discipline and playing far too loose.

Don't do that at their clubs though? It might be they don't trust the England systems or maybe they don't trust the other players.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

EJ gets a lot of stick, often rightly so but they players on the pitch have to shoulder a good share of the blame. A lot of the points today were leaked due to ill discipline and playing far too loose.

If the players played in a similar way for England as they do for their clubs then that would be fair but they don't. The discipline of players for England is worse in every single case than at their clubs. They are more frantic than at their clubs, more stupid errors, more wildly throwing the ball about, more aimless kicking. I cannot think of any players who currently play better for England than they do for their club. That is entirely on the coach. If you put England up against Sarries, I'd go for Sarries to win. If nothing else, they could just wait for England to inevitably give away a penalty.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

If the players played in a similar way for England as they do for their clubs then that would be fair but they don't. The discipline of players for England is worse in every single case than at their clubs. They are more frantic than at their clubs, more stupid errors, more wildly throwing the ball about, more aimless kicking. I cannot think of any players who currently play better for England than they do for their club. That is entirely on the coach. If you put England up against Sarries, I'd go for Sarries to win. If nothing else, they could just wait for England to inevitably give away a penalty.

I 100% believe sarries would beat england if you could duplicate players. Just way more drilled and organised. They play with a plan and all seem to know what they are doing….the opposite of England.

 

[Grizwald]

Domestic and international arenas are completely different. Personally central contracts would go a long way IMO but then I'm not particularly invested in a domestic club.

EJ has often bemoaned the amount of time he gets the squads together for. The proof will be in the pudding come the WC I guess when he will get the players for a decent length camp.

 

[Fuzzy du Plessis]

Manu not getting injured is probably the only positive I can think of.

In the post match interview Eddie said "Manu's pulled up a little bit sore so we'll just have to wait and see"* so there's a chance we might not even have that positive!

* if that was said about any other player it wouldn't even be worth worrying about, but this is Manu we're talking about...

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Marchant's fit, Radwan's fit, Earl's fit. All would lift the dynamism and threat yet none can even make a wider squad. Lawrence looks reinvigorated and is also nowhere to be seen. Ditto Daly.

Bar one big hit and a couple of average carries, Manu was pretty anonymous. Until the Nowell high tackle I hadn't even realised he was on the pitch.

Binny ran hard in a straight line. Couple of handling errors, but utterly predictable. Big and straight line doesn't really cut it any more. Coka took his try well, but otherwise didn't get any space and for a big guy he's really average in the air.

Steward dropped a couple. That happens in those conditions, but did we use him as an attacking threat in the air on a day that suited it?

Genge looked to be going fine and getting the upper hand in the tight, so why take him off when he did? Felt preprogrammed. And if your replacement LH isn't going to be a great scrummager then much better to give Rodd the chance.

For all his experience Youngs isn't really the answer now. JvP should have been given his head post Australia and immediately gave a quick glimpse of what he can do.

And Smith and Farrell is an either or at 10, not both. Farrell's looked v good at 10 for Sarries, but then bang average at 12 in the national set up. Go figure.

Coles mixed up some good and some indifferent but there's something there. Established players with big reputations like Itoje and Curry weren't awful, but weren't standout either.

Interesting that the scrum went fairly well, although it looked like the Pumas had brought their U16 LH, who I've previously seen struggle.

Etc.

 

[Wasps92]

I lost count of the amount of times Ben Youngs dawdled up to a ruck before passing the ball to thin air. JvP did more in 15 seconds than Youngs managed in 55 minutes.

Billy Vunipola must've knocked the ball on at least 4 times.

Apart from that it was the usual turgid rubbish. Jack Nowell is nowhere near international quality anymore unfortunately.

2, 3 phases then hoof - the same crap we have had to put up with for 3 years.

 

[Jaguares]

What a win!

 

[Crash Hamster]

It's a potential huge series of worries, isn't it?

Where are the tries coming from? Where's the pace? Why are we featuring virtually a whole backline of the halt and the lame? Why are players with no great form being selected ahead of those who are playing extremely well? Why a 6:2 split? Why are people playing out of position? Why, when most of this has happened before, are we still asking the same old questions? What's the actual game plan?

Plenty of people will no doubt be along to say "I'm sure Eddie knows more about it than you", but even they must be beginning to doubt that now, surely?

The point is, it will only take an early injury to mess up his whole backs selection and prove him wrong. Even if he gets away with it, it doesn't make his decisions right. If he keeps doing the same thing, one day it will bite his stubborn Australian backside, probably in a World Cup game.

Tl;dr: I'm so bored of Eddie Jones. (c) MarkyH

<shrug>

 

[ncurd]

Haven felt this crap about an England match since we crashed out our own world cup in the group stages.

And both times we ******* saw it coming a mile away.

 

[Crash Hamster]

RFU

www.englandrugby.com

Aw, mate...

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

RFU

www.englandrugby.com

Aw, mate...

Don't think anyone believes a word he says any more and more importantly, I'm not sure the players do either.

 

[Smurfy]

If England are going to play the limited power game then you can't play a supposedly flair player like Smith at 10. You need a 10 like Farrell who will put you in the right areas of the pitch and a 9 who is not glacial. To be honest I'm not sure Smith is a particularly great 10 anyway, but he is a complete indulgence in a Jones side.

 

[Reiser99]

Also wasn't this what EJ had finally been waiting for Smith, Farrell, Tuilagi axis. Basically what he's hoped for all along and it did...nothing.

 

[Wendigo7]

Domestic and international arenas are completely different. Personally central contracts would go a long way IMO but then I'm not particularly invested in a domestic club.

EJ has often bemoaned the amount of time he gets the squads together for. The proof will be in the pudding come the WC I guess when he will get the players for a decent length camp.

All nice to say.

Every time the England players go to Eddie; they come back worse.

 

[Wendigo7]

A short term coach might be just what we need. I'm guessing we will beat Japan, lose to the other big two and then Jones and the RFU can claim we made progress and bury their heads.

I want us to lose to Japan.

he would have no where to turn to then.

 

[Jaguares]

This try was magnificent:



First phase, baby!

 

[Wakaloo]

I was at the stadium tonight (Argie fan), and the atmosphere was indeed very dull. I don't know if it was the uninspiring game (there was also a distinct lack of the usually lively argie fans that would spur an english response, as I saw a few jerseys close to where I was, but no real group that could get things going chant-wise).

The most exciting moment of the match -even for english fans- was the Boffelli try. All in all happy for the Pumas' win, but I wished I could've experienced more than a couple of half-assed "Sweet Chariot" that almost felt like a chore for those singing around me.

 

[Scotty]

Also wasn't this what EJ had finally been waiting for Smith, Farrell, Tuilagi axis. Basically what he's hoped for all along and it did...nothing.

Yes because there is no attacking threat! You can double up on manu knowing if Faz steps he isnt a real threat and that manu isnt likely to pass.

Manu Slade would work better because you have the decoy to give Slade space to draw and bring the wingers like big joe into the game. But EJ took off manu meaning we had 3 playmakers.

Even if it was Smith Manu Slade the 3 relatively slow back 3 players it took away that some of that threat.

Non of this is saying other players dont deserve to be in the mix aswel/instead, im just saying working with what we had today.