England Post-WC discussion

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Back off one of the provinces will take him.

Eddie Jones apparently eyeing him up as well.
Between us and Munster last I heard.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Pah, you poached Brookes from us anyway
He's a Fylde lad, played in the same side as Josh Beaumont

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Pah, you poached Brookes from us anyway
He's a Fylde lad, played in the same side as Josh Beaumont

Get back in your box! *waves crucifix madly*

Can't decide whether the purchase of obscure/tired, second tier internationals is shrewd or foolish. I think they do well at getting the balance right between giving youth opportunities and giving the team a backbone of experienced players.

Simon Hammersley anyone? I've got a lovely deal on Tom Catterick, aspirational, talented young fly-half or wing?

I've got high hopes for Hammersley, but he's yours for a tenner.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Clifford going well for Quins against the Blues.

 

[Peat]

Pah, you poached Brookes from us anyway
He's a Fylde lad, played in the same side as Josh Beaumont

While we point out these things, Dom Barrow came through Leeds' academy iirc.

 

[Mumbles119]

Article with some of the activities that Eddie has been up to over the last month.

Especially the meeting with Lancaster that has this quote from Eddie about Lancaster and the players:

"He really cares. He gave me some insight into some of the players. You take those things into consideration. If you hear those things enough about a player there must be some truth to it. If there is enough smoke, there is a fire there.

"So if someone says he's an idiot, then another bloke says he's an idiot and three other blokes says he's an idiot, then he's probably an idiot!"

Any bets on which player/s this is?

Logical thought would dictate it can only be players dropped or ignored for the EPS. And if rumours are to be believed; this could be the 'poison' of Wood. Or the hot headedness of Cipriani. Or maybe even just the general lack of brain shown by underachievers like Twelvetrees.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/story/_...d-meeting-bayern-munich-manager-pep-guardiola

 

[TRF_Olyy]

"So if someone says he's an idiot, then another bloke says he's an idiot and three other blokes says he's an idiot, then he's probably an idiot!"

Maybe Eddie should read his own words.
I mean this is the guy considering Hartley as his captain.

 

[Mumbles119]

Maybe Eddie should read his own words.
I mean this is the guy considering Hartley as his captain.

Yes. Eddie has been saying so many of the right things, such as the the need for a true open side etc... But saying these things and then taking the actions of potentially selecting Hartley as captain and considering Haskell as a true 7 are worrying.

But both of these worries are purely rumours until we see the reality in a few weeks time.

 

[ratsapprentice]

TBF, I really like Dylan's character... It's his ability as a player (set-piece aside), and his discipline that I have concerns over.

I think on character alone Hartley is the best candidate for captain in the EPS.

 

[Peat]

Possible that there was no one in mind at all Mumbles, and it was a general point.

 

[Maverick1987]

If he stands by his word and picks players only on form Hartley can't be starting because George is head and shoulders above him

 

[ratsapprentice]

Has he said he'd pick players based on form?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Has he said he'd pick players based on form?

He said they would be starting with a clean slate, which implies he is picking based on how they are doing now. It also implies he won't pay attention to previous disciplinary issues. It's slightly worrying as many Bath players as individuals are top quality and have shown that with England but are part of a club that is failing miserably at the moment. To lose the likes of Watson, Attwood, Ford (Yes I know how bad he has been recently) and Joseph because Bath as a whole are failing would be a step back IMO.

Likewise lots of Sarries players are doing brilliantly at club level but have consistantly shown they are not good enough internationally (Ashton, Goode, Barritt).

 

[Maverick1987]

He said they would be starting with a clean slate, which implies he is picking based on how they are doing now. It also implies he won't pay attention to previous disciplinary issues. It's slightly worrying as many Bath players as individuals are top quality and have shown that with England but are part of a club that is failing miserably at the moment. To lose the likes of Watson, Attwood, Ford (Yes I know how bad he has been recently) and Joseph because Bath as a whole are failing would be a step back IMO.

Likewise lots of Sarries players are doing brilliantly at club level but have consistantly shown they are not good enough internationally (Ashton, Goode, Barritt).

Yeh the clean slate part is what I meant . Although it's difficult to agree with the clean slate part because he picked Hartley and Tuilagi . To be fair to Ashton he will be very useful outside Daly/Joseph . Play him outside Tuilagi and Barritt and you get what you deserve imo

 

[ratsapprentice]

It doesn't mean he'll pick solely on form, necessarily.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

It doesn't mean he'll pick solely on form, necessarily.

Nope but it strongly hints that what he is interested in is what they are doing now. Unfortunately that means purely club experience, which isn't always a great indicator for selection.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Like I say, I don't think what he said meant what you think it does... to me, it just means that "just because you were in/out before, doesn't mean you will be in the future".

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

There's the risk that he'll pick players like Goode and ignore players like Ford, yes, but on the bright side it means that in the squad are players who probably wouldn't have got a look in under Lancaster- at least not yet.

Players like Kvesic, Ewers, Beaumont, Thomas, Devoto, Sam Hill, have been introduced post haste. In my opinion that's only a good thing.

The ones who can prove that they'll maintain their form won't get dropped- win- and class is permanent, so Watson, Ford, etc, will eventually come back into favour- win.

It's a solid approach in my opinion.

 

[Peat]

I'd be careful about taking too much implication from his words before we see how he goes about his work. The squad would indicate there's a certain amount of preference being shown to those with past international performance as well as a certain amount of preference to those who are young and displaying big potential; so who knows where he goes with a team?

I suspect Jones himself doesn't know yet fully, as he's not had the guys in training.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I suspect Jones himself doesn't know yet fully, as he's not had the guys in training.

Bingo.