England Post-WC discussion

[NickBD]

3 coaches in a row not picking Cips maybe they know something we don't.

I might be in the minority but I am a big fan of the squad with the injures. No Cips, Kvesic and Roko are the biggest omissions but other then that looks good.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

No mention of Croft, he doesn't seem to be particularly in the running?

 

[TommiG88]

I see the good and the bad.

Surprised with the omissions of Cipriani and Kvesic.

I really don't rate Devoto at the moment, the guy isn't even first team for Bath.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

While we're waiting for the announcement...

Marcus Watson took his try nicely at the weekend. How do people think he might pan out in a couple of years?

It's not all about speed, but I can't imagine a faster back 3 than Watson, Watson and May.

 

[Which Tyler]

Very.
I'm all for looking to the future, but he's 20 - shouldn't he be in the u20s? Or in the Saxons and training with the seniors to get experience?
He's not going to be playing in the 6N for the seniors, so it'd be a bit of a wasted spot?

All I can do is link to this thread.
http://www.therugbyforum.com/threads/36973-How-much-1st-class-rugby-should-young-props-hookers-play

 

[NickBD]

Telegraph reporting Joe Simpson will not make the squad just Youngs and Care.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

https://twitter.com/englandrugby/status/687273371374084096

Leaks were crap then.
Kvesic in Fraser not
Devoto and Hill in Manu not
Tom Youngs out Cowan Dickie in

 

[tsof]

Confirmed squad. No Tom Youngs or Brad Barritt

Forwards

Josh Beaumont (Sale Sharks), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs), Jack Clifford (Harlequins), Jamie George (Saracens), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), James Haskell (Wasps), Paul Hill (Northampton Saints), Maro Itoje (Saracens), George Kruis (Saracens), Matt Kvesic (Gloucester Rugby) *injury replacement for Dave Ewers (Exeter Chiefs), Joe Launchbury (Wasps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Matt Mullan (Wasps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Henry Thomas (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Kieran Brookes (Northampton Saints), Billy Vunipola (Saracens), Mako Vunipola (Saracens)

Backs

Chris Ashton (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Elliot Daly (Wasps), Ollie Devoto (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Owen Farrell (Saracens), George Ford (Bath Rugby), Alex Goode (Saracens), Sam Hill (Exeter Chiefs) *injury replacement for Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs), Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs), Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby), Marland Yarde (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Hartley FFS.

What has he done in the last year really.

Ashton over Roko makes me sick.

 

[ncurd]

No Cips (may as well retire from international rugby),
No Roko (no idea what he has to do),
Included Ashton (Boooooo)

Apart from that no real complaints no idea why people rate Devoto but imagine he's our last choice 12 in that squad.

 

[McTallshort]

Confirmed squad. No Tom Youngs or Brad Barritt

Forwards

Josh Beaumont (Sale Sharks), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs), Jack Clifford (Harlequins), Jamie George (Saracens), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), James Haskell (Wasps), Paul Hill (Northampton Saints), Maro Itoje (Saracens), George Kruis (Saracens), Matt Kvesic (Gloucester Rugby) *injury replacement for Dave Ewers (Exeter Chiefs), Joe Launchbury (Wasps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Matt Mullan (Wasps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Henry Thomas (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Kieran Brookes (Northampton Saints), Billy Vunipola (Saracens), Mako Vunipola (Saracens)

Backs

Chris Ashton (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Elliot Daly (Wasps), Ollie Devoto (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Owen Farrell (Saracens), George Ford (Bath Rugby), Alex Goode (Saracens), Sam Hill (Exeter Chiefs) *injury replacement for Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs), Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs), Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby), Marland Yarde (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

So there we have it, Jones no better than the rest.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Also not sure I agree with dropping Wilson, he looked much better against Toulon.

 

[Jakedood]

Confirmed squad. No Tom Youngs or Brad Barritt

Forwards

Josh Beaumont (Sale Sharks), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs), Jack Clifford (Harlequins), Jamie George (Saracens), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), James Haskell (Wasps), Paul Hill (Northampton Saints), Maro Itoje (Saracens), George Kruis (Saracens), Matt Kvesic (Gloucester Rugby) *injury replacement for Dave Ewers (Exeter Chiefs), Joe Launchbury (Wasps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Matt Mullan (Wasps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Henry Thomas (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Kieran Brookes (Northampton Saints), Billy Vunipola (Saracens), Mako Vunipola (Saracens)

Backs

Chris Ashton (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Elliot Daly (Wasps), Ollie Devoto (Bath Rugby) *injury replacement for Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Owen Farrell (Saracens), George Ford (Bath Rugby), Alex Goode (Saracens), Sam Hill (Exeter Chiefs) *injury replacement for Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs), Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs), Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby), Marland Yarde (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

Only personal change would be Roko for Ashton. Hopefully Jones sees the uselessness of him at International Level in the EPS, though if he can score tries like he manages for sarries or used to for England, then I'll say well played. However I'm a far bigger fan of wingers like Watson and Nowell who don't simply take advantage of other's line breaks but also can break the line on their own, as well as having the defensive skills and pace and tracking ability to do what Ashton does for sarries!

He has made a lot of fresh changes to the squad, dropped a lot of the deadwood, and it's understandable why he'd consider looking at Ashton, even if personally I'd say Roko is better. All in all a pretty promising squad, especially given the injuries!

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Hartley and Lawes are actually making me angry now.

Heywood has been outplaying Hartley (not hard since injured mind).

Lawes has been crap.

If Hartley is made captain I will cry.


Thank fuk Kvesic is in.

 

[NickBD]

So Kvesic in for Ewers, Thomas in for Brookes, DeVoto in for Manu and Hill in for Slade.

Good to see that if Ewers was fit he'd be in squad thought he'd get over looked again. Concerned that Kvesic is only in as a injured replacement though. Thought Kvesic and Fraser would be the guaranteed 7s for the squad, guess not.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Confirms that Clifford will be starting 7 with Robshaw 6 IMO.

 

[TommiG88]

Only a certain amount of changes can be made, right?

I think we'll see more made in the summer.

 

[Tmartin995]

Think the Tom Youngs omission makes sense now that I think about it. Jones has stated he wants to play a fast paced game and you can't do that if your hooker can't hook and the ball is stuck in the middle of the tunnel. Hope he's been told to go away and work on it.

 

[ncurd]

I think Jones has cunningly used the injury rules to get a look at more players than his allotted 11. If a player plays badly he can bring someone else in if they play well the other player is not fit enough yet.

 

[Which Tyler]

Leaks were crap then.

Huzzah! Happy wioth press speculating; not happy with leaks.

Devoto and Hill in Manu not

Well, not really; just injury cover for Manu

Ashton over Roko makes me sick.

He's only allowed 11 changes; and made 11; IIRC Ashton was in the EPS 33, just not in the RWC 31

Of course, Yarde over Roko is still an odd decision.
Equally, I'd far rather see Simpson in that squad; but I can't disagree that there were more important changes to make (though I'd have used that change and kept TYoungs instead of Hartley to allow it)