England EPS 2017/18 edition.

[curtbob7]

Ok.. Couple of issues with that...
1. Smith is better than Lozowski at 10. hands down, no argument. Never been particularly impressed with Lozowski in an England Shirt especially. -noted, I disagree.
2. Cips is 30 so has very little future with England and it's time we all move on. -no, we wanna win the WC, take our best players.
3. Cips is also likely to be off to France (or Ulster) apparently, so again no England future
- we'll see, would be silly of us to let him go.
4. Smith is a better defender than Ford ie. He makes massive hits for his size and doesn't have to rely on other players to cover him. -Smith doesn't get in ahead of Ford. Now that's a no-brainier.

Not saying Smith should start, but taking Cips over him would be like taking Banahan over Cokanasiga (even that would make more sense). -again, take your best players.

Sorry, but rereading this, I'm disagreeing more and more

Wade has been rejected by multiple England coaches now and it's fairly clear that he has no international future despite his age so take someone who might (Woodburn, Lewington, Earle, Ibitoye etc.)

- Valid point on ibitoye

Also a bit of an issue with that font row - Imagine the guffawing SA dressing room if their pack comes up against an Obano - Singleton - Hill front row...

-yep, wouldn't take George, Marler and Cole. I'd rest them. SA would lick lips at Vunipola scrum time too.

Having all your flankers with a total of about 6 caps is just stupid tbh... Why risk it, and against SA too

-wouldn't take Robshaw and Haskell. I ain't backing down from that.

Care has the third most assists in the Prem in an awful team... has to go

- not for me, prefer Robson to have a chance.
Take Mercer at 8 and shift Simmonds into the flank for a Curry - valid point on Mercer over a Curry..

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

DO you not think there is a certain amount to be gained from experience in the dressing room ie. Robo (not Hask) and Care if you are dropping the Lions

 

[curtbob7]

DO you not think there is a certain amount to be gained from experience in the dressing room ie. Robo (not Hask) and Care if you are dropping the Lions

I appreciate that but we know exactly what Robshaw brings and Shields will do just that and more. Haskell- we need another approach to the breakdown IMO. I'd treat this tour as a fact finding mission.

We know what Care brings and Robson can replace him, give him a chance.

Launch- Vunipola - Youngs - Ford - May - Tuilagi - Brown all bring huge experience.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

The thing I would say about Cipriani is that EJ said that his issue with him was that he didn't think he'd be happy being 2nd/3rd choice; he had to start or not be in the squad. Well for probably the first time since then, Cips is deserving of being 1st choice. If EJ meant what he said back then, I could definitely see Cips being taken to SA as starting 10 and moving forward with him there.

 

[curtbob7]

The thing I would say about Cipriani is that EJ said that his issue with him was that he didn't think he'd be happy being 2nd/3rd choice; he had to start or not be in the squad. Well for probably the first time since then, Cips is deserving of being 1st choice. If EJ meant what he said back then, I could definitely see Cips being taken to SA as starting 10 and moving forward with him there.

I'd agree. We know what Ford can do. Take Cips, start him and put Ford on the bench. Running options of Sinckler, Shields, May, Tuilagi etc Cips would thrive off.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

I appreciate that but we know exactly what Robshaw brings and Shields will do just that and more. Haskell- we need another approach to the breakdown IMO. I'd treat this tour as a fact finding mission.

We know what Care brings and Robson can replace him, give him a chance.

Launch- Vunipola - Youngs - Ford - May - Tuilagi - Brown all bring huge experience.

Fair enough... Im saying take Velacott as an apprentice though...

Just so you can pick apart me if you want as well, here is my 34 man squad with 2 * as apprentices

Doubt he will drop all of the lions so thats why there is still a few

1. Genge, Marler, Boyce
2. Cowan-Dickie, Taylor, Dunn
3. Sinckler, Williams, Hill
4. Isekwe, Ewels
5. Launchbury, Spencer
6. Sheilds, Robshaw, *Chisholm
7. Either Curry, Armand, Simmonds
8. Vunipola, Mercer
9. Youngs, Care, *Velacott
10. Ford, Smith
11. May, Ibitoye
12. Tuilagi, Faz (sets him up nicely for RWC if you dont play him, but take him as squad Captain
13. Marchant (no word on Quins about the injury and he didnt play on the weekend, but I hope he is just being rested), Te'o
14. Nowell, Cokanasiga
15. Woodward, Brown

 

[TRF_Olyy]

The world cup is next year, old age really doesn't matter atm.
Are we gonna build a team around cipriani for the next decade? No
Is he gonna retire in the next year? Also no.

You pick your best options at this point.


Edit: Velacott an apprentice?! He's 23! Youngs had 30 odd caps by that age!
Chisholm is older than a good number of the squad as well

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

The world cup is next year, old age really doesn't matter atm.
Are we gonna build a team around cipriani for the next decade? No
Is he gonna retire in the next year? Also no.

You pick your best options at this point.

But he's unlikely to be elegible by 2019

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

So my revised baabaas squad.
1. Obano, 2. Singleton, 3. Schonert
4. Spencer, 5. Ewels
6. Ross, 7, O'Connor, 8. Mercer
9. Vellacott, 10. Smith
12. Redpath, 13. Tuilagi
11. Cokasigna, 14. Ibitoye, 15. Woodward

16. Walker, 17. Boyce, 18. Hill
19. Williams, 20. Curry
21. White, 22. Shillcock, 23. Butler/Lawrence

IMO would be good pre RWC U20's experiance for the likes of Redpath, White and Ibitoye and in positions where not too many

Interested to see the U20's squad could be one of the best set of backs we have had.
9. White, Snow, Brand
10. Grayson, Hardwick
11. Loader, Seabrook
12. Butler, Redpath,
13. Lawrence, James,
14. Ibitoye, Olowofela
15. Parton, Crossdale,

Put Smith in that squad and damn.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Edit: Velacott an apprentice?! He's 23! Youngs had 30 odd caps by that age!

Who else is there really?
Townsend - 22
Maunder is injured.
The only other one I can think of is Simmons at Tigers who is 20 but misses the U20's by a month. Also wouldn't mind a 8. Simmonds, 9. Simmons, 10. Simmonds thing Lol.
Maybe Mitchell.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

So my revised baabaas squad.
1. Obano, 2. Singleton, 3. Schonert
4. Spencer, 5. Ewels
6. Ross, 7, O'Connor, 8. Mercer
9. Vellacott, 10. Smith
12. Redpath, 13. Tuilagi
11. Cokasigna, 14. Ibitoye, 15. Woodward

16. Walker, 17. Boyce, 18. Hill
19. Williams, 20. Curry
21. White, 22. Shillcock, 23. Butler/Lawrence

IMO would be good pre RWC U20's experiance for the likes of Redpath, White and Ibitoye and in positions where not too many

Interested to see the U20's squad could be one of the best set of backs we have had.
9. White, Snow, Brand
10. Grayson, Hardwick
11. Loader, Seabrook
12. Butler, Redpath,
13. Lawrence, James,
14. Ibitoye, Olowofela
15. Parton, Crossdale,

Put Smith in that squad and damn.

Throw in a loose 5 of
4. Lamb (He's a lock isn't he?)
5. Isiekwe
6. Curry
7. Curry
8. Earl

19. Basham
20. Moore
And that's pretty formidable

 

[curtbob7]

Micheal Rhodes fit and elligible?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Manu tuilagi has told Eddie that he wants to focus on rest and recovery for the SA tour. (Also guessing his new born factors into it.

So 13 really is bare bones, hoping Daly stays fit.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Manu tuilagi has told Eddie that he wants to focus on rest and recovery for the SA tour. (Also guessing his new born factors into it.

So 13 really is bare bones, hoping Daly stays fit.

Nowell for 13.

 

[curtbob7]

Buggar. Bateman for 13 then.

Nah serious surely Sam Hill will be involved now then.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

The world cup is next year, old age really doesn't matter atm.
Are we gonna build a team around cipriani for the next decade? No
Is he gonna retire in the next year? Also no.

You pick your best options at this point.


Edit: Velacott an apprentice?! He's 23! Youngs had 30 odd caps by that age!
Chisholm is older than a good number of the squad as well

Yeah, but Mercer was older than the Curries... I gave it to players who I don't think will play a part now, but might in a few years

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Who else is there really?
Townsend - 22
Maunder is injured.
The only other one I can think of is Simmons at Tigers who is 20 but misses the U20's by a month. Also wouldn't mind a 8. Simmonds, 9. Simmons, 10. Simmonds thing Lol.
Maybe Mitchell.

Then have him in as a player?
Apprentice slots are for kids who have zero chance of playing but are there for exposure to the environment,
We need a 9 there as an option not as a tackle bag holder

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Then have him in as a player?
Apprentice slots are for kids who have zero chance of playing but are there for exposure to the environment,
We need a 9 there as an option not as a tackle bag holder

Eddie has made it clear that Care and Youngs are his two scrum halves... He's not gonna get game time if theyre both fit

 

[will311293]

I'll be amazed if Dan Robson isn't in the squad.... one of the stand out scrum halves in Prem over last 2-3years.

Also shout for Jack Willis as an Apprentice?

Realistically even with bias ... Wade and Cips won't go .. either due to not being favoured or not what coach is looking for... Still would have loved to see Cips/Farrell combo.

JWC has a chance.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

I'll be amazed if Dan Robson isn't in the squad.... one of the stand out scrum halves in Prem over last 2-3years.

Also shout for Jack Willis as an Apprentice?

Realistically even with bias ... Wade and Cips won't go .. either due to not being favoured or not what coach is looking for... Still would have loved to see Cips/Farrell combo.

JWC has a chance.

I'd take willis as an apprentice actually