England 2024/25

[Saintjay]

My understanding is it's an eight team franchise that travels the globe like F1. It's more 'events weekend with rugby' rather than just rugby.

It'll die a death like rugby X did and probably not even get off the ground.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

My understanding is it's an eight team franchise that travels the globe like F1. It's more 'events weekend with rugby' rather than just rugby.

It'll die a death like rugby X did and probably not even get off the ground.

Apparently several England players are willing to join for a lower workload and higher pay.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

My understanding is it's an eight team franchise that travels the globe like F1. It's more 'events weekend with rugby' rather than just rugby.

It'll die a death like rugby X did and probably not even get off the ground.

It may, it may not but I'd take it seriously. And even if it flops there will be another idea along soon.

We've already seen peak years players give up on the international game for money whether ABs through Japanese sabbaticals or English players going to France. Short career, concussions, one injury away, other sportsmen getting paid far more etc, you can understand the temptation to cash in.

The ABs are exploring the possibility of playing in the Middle East and Beaumont recently said that going there was inevitable as the sport needed the money. At least he was honest enough not to BS people about growing the game.

I suspect that the only certainty is that the next 10 years will probably see more changes in the game than the previous 120. But that's what happens when the money men get involved. Invite them through the door at your peril, as make no mistake, they don't give a **** about anything other than sweating the assets to make short term money.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

It may, it may not but I'd take it seriously. And even if it flops there will be another idea along soon.

We've already seen peak years players give up on the international game for money whether ABs through Japanese sabbaticals or English players going to France. Short career, concussions, one injury away, other sportsmen getting paid far more etc, you can understand the temptation to cash in.

The ABs are exploring the possibility of playing in the Middle East and Beaumont recently said that going there was inevitable as the sport needed the money. At least he was honest enough not to BS people about growing the game.

I suspect that the only certainty is that the next 10 years will probably see more changes in the game than the previous 120. But that's what happens when the money men get involved. Invite them through the door at your peril, as make no mistake, they don't give a **** about anything other than sweating the assets to make short term money.

Playing in the Middle East is just a vanity product. They not going to sell many tickets they at all or even get a higher broadcast revenue.

 

[Reiser99]

Playing in the Middle East is just a vanity product. They not going to sell many tickets they at all or even get a higher broadcast revenue.

I wouldn't mind as that's where I'm currently based and Ire vs Arg will finish at 1am tonight. However, you're not going to sell out stadiums regularly around the world year on year. It will be a novelty, nothing more.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

The RFU will block any players who join the breakaway league from representing England but other countries might not do so - so international tournaments will be a mess as England could be relying on players currently no where near selection while some countires abandon their league and still select their best.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Playing in the Middle East is just a vanity product. They not going to sell many tickets they at all or even get a higher broadcast revenue.

Probably get quite a big appearance fee though.

The game's mostly in a mess. You're increasingly going to see teams and players following the money wherever that might be.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I wouldn't mind as that's where I'm currently based and Ire vs Arg will finish at 1am tonight. However, you're not going to sell out stadiums regularly around the world year on year. It will be a novelty, nothing more.

That's what they said about franchise cricket and that's played in even fewer countries than rugby.

There's no real sporting merit to it. But everybody has a price, it's just a question of finding it.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

That's what they said about franchise cricket and that's played in even fewer countries than rugby.

There's no real sporting merit to it. But everybody has a price, it's just a question of finding it.

Franchise cricket is helped by the biggest ce4sion being held in a country where Cricket is like a religion. Plus the demographics of the Middle East suit Cricket getting an audience there much more than rugby.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

My understanding is it's an eight team franchise that travels the globe like F1. It's more 'events weekend with rugby' rather than just rugby.

It'll die a death like rugby X did and probably not even get off the ground.

Hot take rugby x was awesome but a terrible idea for commercial use.

An end of season event for charity with a captain's draft would be great. But that's also what I think rugby sevens should be

 

[Rinkadink]

I can totally see many people who watch international rugby and maybe those who support a franchised "club" getting behind the concept, much as I'd dislike it all to happen.

Club > country >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> franchise nonsense (even if it features "the best" players)

 

[Becca]

It's a terrible idea.

 

[higgik]

If no EPS, or overseas ban, team for Japan.
Genge, LCD, Stuart, Martin, Tuima, Hill, Underhill, Willis, Randall, Smith M, Roebuck, Stewart, Marchant, Freeman, Arundell

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

If no EPS, or overseas ban, team for Japan.
Genge, LCD, Stuart, Martin, Tuima, Hill, Underhill, Willis, Randall, Smith M, Roebuck, Stewart, Marchant, Freeman, Arundell

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Did Roebuck do enough to earn a crack vs Japan?

Did he get on after Slade's HIA?

Is he the best England wing since...ever?

 

[Geordie]

See how some of younger lads go against Australia A.....

 

[Which Tyler]

We did much better than I expected against South Africa - by about as much as we did worse than I expected against Australia.
The weaknesses we expected to see were all on show, we just had enough tenacity to mitigate them better than expected.

Ultimately though, this is a results business, and I can't help compare this year to the year that got Eddie fired.

2022:
W: 5, D: 1, L: 6
6N: 3rd place
SI: W2, L1 in Australia
AI: W v Japan, D v NZ, L v Arg & SA

2024:
W: 4, D: 0, L: 7
6N: 3rd place
SI: W1 in Japan, L2 in NZ
AI: ? v Japan, L v NZ, Aus & SA

For me, Borthwick doesn't get any slack for the churn of assistant coaches - and nor did Eddie. Losing 1 is unfortunate, but this is a pattern, and it's literally his job to put a coaching team together, build them into a unit, and get them signing from the same hymn sheet.

SB is currently on a 48% win ratio; the 2nd worst for an England coach since 1985 (Andy Robinson being worse). Yes, worse than Johnno or Ashton, significantly worse than Eddie's 2nd cycle.

 

[TommiG88]

He's been at the helm for nearly 2 years and I've seen no marked improvement. The team still doesn't know what they're doing. I was positive after the end of the 6Nations and Summer Tour, but Felix Jones seems to have been the catalyst for anything good.

We are an uninspired team going through the motions.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Lot of hype around AOF and goodness knows we need some dominant top class props.

Profile of him in today's Sunday Times in which he says he's 17 stone 8, and aiming for 18 1. So going from something like 111 to 115 kg.

That's small by international standards now. Weight's obviously not everything in scrummaging but most top THs are now over 20 stone and a good few loose heads too. Of our recent opponents all the NZ and Aus started are listed at 20 stone plus with the Bok pair pretty close. The French TH last night was 22 stone.

Not to say that AOF can't succeed, but if you're conceding that much weight you've got to be an excellent scrummaging technician and contributing elsewhere.

He's also short which may actually help him. In terms of position I can think of some shorter LHs who have done OK, but few THs.