England 2024/25

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

As I said before, McGuigan is the biggest head scratcher for me. He's dropped off a little recently, but at Newcastle he was easily one of the best hookers in the Premiership even in a struggling side.

Blamire may still come good, but realistically all of the caps he, Dunn, Langdon, Dolly and Walker have acquired should really have gone to McGuigan.

McGuigan was named in Borthwick's original 6N squad but got injured before even arriving in camp, hence why Walker picked up those caps. After that McGuigan's form at Gloucester was never anything like his form at Newcastle. Had that injury not happened I think he probably would have been Borthwick's 16 going into the RWC.

EJ should have involved him before that though.

 

[BPM]

Yeah, I was responding to @don't Skip Leg Day's comment re. Eddie screwing up the hooker spot.

Only really looking at George and LCD was a bit like sticking with Youngs and Care at the beginning of his reign, only looking at alternatives if his hand was forced or he abruptly changed his mind.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Yeah, I was responding to @don't Skip Leg Day's comment re. Eddie screwing up the hooker spot.

Only really looking at George and LCD was a bit like sticking with Youngs and Care at the beginning of his reign, only looking at alternatives if his hand was forced or he abruptly changed his mind.

The main screw up has not been having an A team so that players can be properly assessed and prepared for the step up.

 

[BPM]

In an ideal world maybe, but they'd only have been 'properly assessed' if the opposition was of the right standard.

Based upon Portugal's showing in the RWC, they're the right type of opposition. Probably more so than another Tier 1 A side IMO. The opportunity to get one over England will be a good motivator, even if it isn't the full side. I'd argue that two A sides playing each other doesn't have the same intensity.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Borthwick’s revolution starts now and case to start Smith is overwhelming | Robert Kitson

Getting through the World Cup was the first priority but England need to unleash a new wave of players in the Six Nations

www.theguardian.com

 

[Wasps92]

Freeman has to be in the squad...abd probably should be starting.

Would love to see what he could do if England can actually get the ball to him and with Feyi-Waboso on the other wing.

But it's England under Borthwick so it'll probably be Steward on the wing and Marcus Smith at FB.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Would love to see what he could do if England can actually get the ball to him and with Feyi-Waboso on the other wing.

But it's England under Borthwick so it'll probably be Steward on the wing and Marcus Smith at FB.

Makes me sick but I hope we don't see Smith or Freddie at FB. Smith needs to be the 10 and Freddie needs to be 3rd or 2nd choice FB right now.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Henry Slade has said Borthwick has spoken to him since the World Cup with BBC Radio saying that implies he will be involved for the Six Nations.

 

[BPM]

Makes me sick but I hope we don't see Smith or Freddie at FB. Smith needs to be the 10 and Freddie needs to be 3rd or 2nd choice FB right now.

That's probably fair. It'll be an unpopular comment, but right now Furbank looks like the best choice at 15.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

That's probably fair. It'll be an unpopular comment, but right now Furbank looks like the best choice at 15.

In the long run I'd like to see Freeman there. Has a lot of the size/safety that Steward brings but is way more athletic. Feel like he'd be a bit wasted on the wing.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

That's probably fair. It'll be an unpopular comment, but right now Furbank looks like the best choice at 15.

I'm a fan of playing the in form players unless the incumbent has credit in the bank and is still performing well enough to not merit being changed. Furbank has looked good and I'd say get him in. Not every player we select needs to be our prospect for the whole world cup cycle, sometimes you just need someone playing well and let someone else try to take the shirt from them.

I think we get a bit too caught up in trying to put players in every position who we think may be the best 3 years down the line rather than just putting in who is the best now. Eg Spencer isn't one for the future but I'd say we definitely need him in given his form.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

In the long run I'd like to see Freeman there. Has a lot of the size/safety that Steward brings but is way more athletic. Feel like he'd be a bit wasted on the wing.

I would as well but we have three top quality FBs on Furbank, Freeman and Hendy. I can't see is managing to keep all of them at the club with game time.

Personally I'd move Hendy (who can also play FH) to 12. He's big, fast, great hands and pace and it would only help his england chances.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Furbank it is possible for players to excel at Club level and not International rugby. Maybe he should get another crack.
Freeman hasn't played at 15 in over an year, Marcus Smith has made the smae amount of 15 starts as Freeman in the past 2 years.
England aren't going to be playing like Saints either.

I don't really get the pooping of Steward, considering his form for Tigers has been pretty spot on, especially as a physical carrier.

But again England are not going to be playing like Saints. People are going to have to realise it, even without Farrell. Borthwick will not tear up his play book for something completely different. What worked v SA is what he will aim for in the 6N's.

Honestly I see Borthwick going with (If injuries etc are the same)
9. Mitchell
10. M.Smith
11. Daly
12. Lawrence
13. Slade
14. Watson
15. Steward

21. Spencer
22. F.Smith
23. Freeman

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Meet ETHAN ROOTS, Exeter's brawling Kiwi on England's radar

NIK SIMON: In his early 20s, Ethan Roots was working on a building site in north Auckland, earning below the minimum wage and questioning what his future held. He had already tried cage fighting.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Honestly if England was to pick a non English Exeter back row I would be more keen on Jacques Vermeulen

 

[West Country Wail]

Josh Iosefa-Scott also EQ at loose head if you want the Chiefs foreign born triad

 

[BPM]

Is Iosefa-Scott any good at anything apart from falling over he try line from 1m out?

 

[West Country Wail]

Depends, do you want England to have mobile props or a decent scrum? He's actually quite agile for his size and his CV goes way beyond 1m flops


Some are from 3m

 

[BPM]

Furbank it is possible for players to excel at Club level and not International rugby. Maybe he should get another crack.
Freeman hasn't played at 15 in over an year, Marcus Smith has made the smae amount of 15 starts as Freeman in the past 2 years.
England aren't going to be playing like Saints either.

I don't really get the pooping of Steward, considering his form for Tigers has been pretty spot on, especially as a physical carrier.

But again England are not going to be playing like Saints. People are going to have to realise it, even without Farrell. Borthwick will not tear up his play book for something completely different. What worked v SA is what he will aim for in the 6N's.

Honestly I see Borthwick going with (If injuries etc are the same)
9. Mitchell
10. M.Smith
11. Daly
12. Lawrence
13. Slade
14. Watson
15. Steward

21. Spencer
22. F.Smith
23. Freeman

Saying Furbank is the form 15 isn't 'pooping on Steward'.

Spencer should definitely get a call up but is he playing any better than Mitchell? Across the season so far maybe, but not in the past few weeks.

 

[BPM]

Depends, do you want England to have mobile props or a decent scrum? He's actually quite agile for his size and his CV goes way beyond 1m flops


Some are from 3m

I was being facetious. He seems to carry fairly well and hit rucks, but from what I've seen he's not a notably good scrummager. A squad at best.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I was being facetious. He seems to carry fairly well and hit rucks, but from what I've seen he's not a notably good scrummager. A squad at best.

Yeah he's not a good scrummager at all.

Of Roots, Vermeulen and Iosefa-Scott I'd say Vermeulen is the only one who is even close to being good enough to be in England contention and he's also the only one with no genuine English roots so I'd rule him out based on that.