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England 2021/22

Obviously Martin got to be in there
Why?
If Isiekwe is there (which he won't be, tbf) Martin would be better off back at his club getting game time, tbh
It's too soon for him to be in England contention as anything other than an apprentice
Same with Chessum, he's good but there's a lot of players ahead of him and backrow isn't really somewhere we're crying out for depth atm - like who would you drop for him?

Walker has really impressed me this season - I'd have him at third choice for sure, no one else has really taken their chances this season (Langdon decent over the summer but then club form dropped off and now he's injured, Blamire scored a lot of tries for England but basics were poor, Dolly was decent but realistically was there as a last resort when so many dropped out - I'd have Walker over him)
Would also take Collier as 3rd, or even 2nd, choice tighthead as well (hell if he keeps playing like this I wouldn't be adverse to seeing him get a few starts ahead of Sinckler, who is scrummaging poorly still)
 
I really rate Walker's all round game, but his lineout throwing probably isn't test standard. Then again, neither is Blamire's and given he's barely featured since the AIs, I'd argue Walker has form in his favour.

I like Kelly, but at this stage, I don't see him as a realistic challenger for the 12 shirt. I might revise that opinion in a year's time though!

There's a lot to like about Chessum. He's a massive bloke who hits hard but has the athleticism to get around the park too. Based upon what I've seen so far, I can definitely see him being a future England lock. Agreed with Olyy on him benefitting more from staying with Tigers at this point in time.
 
Why?
If Isiekwe is there (which he won't be, tbf) Martin would be better off back at his club getting game time, tbh
It's too soon for him to be in England contention as anything other than an apprentice
Same with Chessum, he's good but there's a lot of players ahead of him and backrow isn't really somewhere we're crying out for depth atm - like who would you drop for him?

Walker has really impressed me this season - I'd have him at third choice for sure, no one else has really taken their chances this season (Langdon decent over the summer but then club form dropped off and now he's injured, Blamire scored a lot of tries for England but basics were poor, Dolly was decent but realistically was there as a last resort when so many dropped out - I'd have Walker over him)
Would also take Collier as 3rd, or even 2nd, choice tighthead as well (hell if he keeps playing like this I wouldn't be adverse to seeing him get a few starts ahead of Sinckler, who is scrummaging poorly still)
Well if your picking 4 locks and 2 6's than I would have itoje, Hill, isiekwe & chessum (he's more a lock than a 6). 6's lawes and Martin. Reason why I said Martin would be a obvious pick is he has been named or called up in the last three squads by jones. Lawes is nailed on at 6 so the chances of him getting much time is slim anyway. So he would spend time/playing with tigers but importantly he's gaining experience with the squad and with isiekwe he would be the next inline at 6 with jones preferring a bigger 6 recently.
 
It's 1 year out from a RWC the time for experimenting really has ended imo.

The likes of Martin, Chessum, Kelly etc should wait really till after and the likes of Lawes, Manu etc move on.

Honestly would rather see things like Vunipola brought back into the squad.
 
Yeah tbf Binny has looked good whenever I've seen him this season, and if it gets Curry back on the flank them I'm all for it (I still want to see Dombrandt start, but we have to manage expectations with EJ)
 
So by the next WC, if we assume no more experimenting, how many new players have been brought in by Jones and how many underperformers have been challenged / removed? Excluding injury enforced changes what development has he actually done for the side in this cycle so far?
 
Malins has filtered in as well - hard to say where he (/Steward) would be if both of Watson and Daly were fit, but I think at least one would be in the mix even if everyone were available
There's been some injury enforced changes that I can't see being reverted, as well - Marchant taking Josephs spot as a 13/14, for example
Hill came in for Kruis but seeing how much EJ seems to rate Hill I imagine he'd have been in the mix even if Kruis were around

Stuart in for Cole too
 
I think it's too early to say he's finished experimenting TBH - he's still got this 6N, and possibly even the summer, though I do feel that anyone who bursts into the reckoning by then would already be tearing it up domestically by this point of the season - priobably or someone who's already been involved in wider squads getting bumped up with form/potential/desperation.

Generally though:
LHP: Genge has graduated from bench against weak opponents to being trusted to start, though probably still 2nd choice behind a fit and available Marler. Rodd seems to be in as 3rd choice if Marler absents himself.
HK: LCD - as with Genge, not a new arrival, but trusted to start. Blamire's probably arrived as 3rd choice, but there's been plenty of experimentation there.
THP: Stuart in for Cole, There have been a few others trialled in as 3rd choice.
LK: Ewels and Hill have been bedded on - though both loos vulnerable, others like Moon and Ribbans have been looked at.
BR: has had plenty of churn, but Dombrandt seems to be being introduced carefully, rather than thrown in willy-nilly. Curry at 8 definitely counts as experimentation, and not as abject a failure as it's often painted here - certainly allows some flexibility for a RWC squad.

SH: Quirke, Mitchell & Randall
FH: Smith :) & Furbank :(
CE: Marchant, Lawrence, Atkinson
WG: Radwan, Malins, Lynah
FB: Steward, Furbank, Freeman

Now his first choice XV may not be particularly different, but then we sent a very young squad to Japan; most of the changes will be players who's risen from 2nd/3rd choice up to starter - which is as it should be TBH. His 33-man RWC squad will have a fair few new faces from 2019; his wider 45ish-man training / standby squad will have even more.
Given the same head coach, how much churn does anyone expect in 1st choice 23s between RWCs? You'd expect evolution > revolution, surely? certainly compared to an interval with a new head coach, or following a disastrous RWC.

Not all experiments succeed; and some are more throwing a body in in desperation, whilst protecting your actual project players.
I'd suggest the likes up Rodd, Dombrandt, Quirke, Smith, & Steward are being fed in carefully, with differing time frames and responsibilities based on Eddie's assessement of them as individuals; whilst others like Blamire, Dunn, Ewels, Mitchell, Furbank have been thrown in a bit partially because someone needs to wear that shirt this week, and partly to see if they pleasantly surprise Eddie.
 
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I agree on virtually all of that. Slightly unfair to put Furbank in there at 10. I know he started at 10 vs. Tonga but that was quite obviously never the plan.
 
I agree on virtually all of that. Slightly unfair to put Furbank in there at 10. I know he started at 10 vs. Tonga but that was quite obviously never the plan.
Which is why I also included him at 15, and is the only player I included in 2 positions (whilst Malins and Marchant, for example, also played multiple).

Basically, I was working down the positions, off the top of my head, and reached 10 before 15
 
Carrying on the Barbeary stuff from the Premiership thread…

Jones clearly likes him. His main attribute is his ball carrying and in fairness we absolutely need more aggressive carrying from the pack. There's more to his game eg decent offloading, but the carrying is his point of difference.

So where does he fit in?

Paraphrasing @BPM, 8 is a nuanced position that requires a lot more than carrying. Barbeary can do all the muscular stuff, (although will be harder at international level), but it may take quite a while to get the subtleties engrained.

7 wouldn't really seem to be on the cards. If looking at a starting shirt 6 might be most likely. Traditionally the home of the wrecking ball but there are other very strong, experienced, candidates who all play very differently to him and there's always balance to think about. Also, and not something I thought I'd type a few months ago, but now not beyond the realms of possibility that Lawes might take over the captaincy at some point.

Barbeary's been hyped, and he's an exciting talent, but at the moment it's hard to see him nailing down a starting shirt this side of the RWC. Bench option, certainly.
 
Wouldn't mind a look at 6. Barbeary, 7. Curry, 8. Dombrandt at some point

As much as I'm a huge fan of Underhill I think he'll be the first in line for the chop when someone new comes into the squad - I think Curry is next in line for the England captaincy tbh, even though Lawes did captain before

As exciting as AB is, though, he's as frail as Manu - whilst I do expect to see him in the Six Nations EPS, i have concerns about how his body will handle A) the EPS training camp, and B) international rugby
 
8 doesn't need to be nuanced all depends how you play and the game plan.

I know he was getting raved reviews this weekend personally I wasn't that impressed with him on the whole.

IMO he's a good impact player at international level potentially.
 
I'm still shocked at the exclusion of Steffon Armitage and Carl Fearns. Strong, abrasive carriers with the kind of killer instinct England is missing. 6 Fearns, 7 Lawes, 8 Armitage ticks every box.

Some of Eddie's decisions are baffling.
 
Watching Alfie this weekend, he looked like a typical Tongan someone like London Irish would have at 8, great going forward and over the ball but just a bit of a one trick pony.

I know he was playing 6, but I really like the educated way Tom Willis plays. An 8 who thinks is a real threat where as a Billy or Alfie (right now) is just a big body.
 
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