All Blacks squad for their end of year tour

[Larksea]

I'd take George Whitelock over Braid & Latimer any day but none of them are anywhere near Messam Right now.

Was interesting to see an interview with Fruen the other day he basically said the doctors have told him he wont have a long carrier in Rugby. He obviously wants to make hay while he can. He will push hard to make the WC next year because I think he will be retired well before the 2015 one. I'd also guess that if he doesn't make the AB's soon he may go for a big contract overseas - Japan would be most likely.

Been interesting to see Both Delainy & Donald come back from injury strong. Mike has turned BoP's season around they were lost without him, though he is kicking a hell of a lot, too much IMO. Donald was simply brilliant on saturday. 7 from 7 at goal, awesome run to setup a try busting multiple tackles, fantastic passing, even drove some poor guy back 5m in a tackle. What impressed me most was his kicking around the field, huge amounts of power and accuracy. I know Cruden is one for the future and slade is coming on well but lets face it. Donald is the next best 10 in NZ behind carter. I'd hate to see the time and experience he's ha with the AB's go to waste. I really like slade and he is above Cruden in my book. But slade and cruden both need to prove they can kick for goal ~75%+ I think they are on the improve but they have a way to go yet.

Another good step forward for Sonny Bill, for sure he has things to work on but he is a giant. He sticks out on the field.

Also good to see guildford regain some form, he still just looks as though he's not training hard enough though. he needs to work on his speed & power, he just seemed much fitter and stronger last year.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Boys not lying if Rutledge does not go as a hooker reserve for the squad then I question what the All Blacks coaching staff are looking at. Bloke is in form and he looks good.

 

[Larksea]

Rutledge is playing really well I dont think he will tour though because only two hookers will go and it will be Mealamu +1 experienced AB hooker.

Have to say though I'm pretty unimpressed with Flynn in the ITM cup. His throwing isn't even any good.

Aled's on fire but his throwing is still questionable.

Elliot is in very good form, his lineout is going well too.

 

[Ninja]

Larksea, Have you got a link to the Robbie Fruen interview? I seriously hope he makes the AB's... He's in my top 3 players...

 

[Darwin]

Boys not lying if Rutledge does not go as a hooker reserve for the squad then I question what the All Blacks coaching staff are looking at. Bloke is in form and he looks good.

Personally I'd be surprised if Rutledge goes on tour - as Larksea said there are likely to be only two hookers selected, with Afoa covering as the third Hooking option. A lot will depend on how Andrew Hore recovers from his injury - if he is fit he will certainly go as the second hooker along with Mealamu (who apparently is back to full fitness now). By the sounds of it, it will be touch and go as to whether Hore will be fit in time, as he is meant to be back playing in 2-3 weeks (with the squad selected in 3 weeks).

Rutledge has been outstanding for Southland (and for the Highlanders), though there will be some reservations about his physical size. He is ok at the scrum and lineout, but does have an exceptional work-rate around the field - my only criticism of him in that respect is that he does miss a few too many first up tackles for my liking.

If Hore is not fit, I think it will be between Rutledge, Flynn, de Malmanche, and Elliot as to who will go as the second hooker (though I suppose 2/4 could go if they decide the need three hookers). I think they will either select Flynn or de Malmanche, however Rutledge and Elliot are undoubtedly the form hookers of the competition in my mind, so I would be tempted to pick either of them.

 

[Shaggy]

It looks like Rene Ranger is the latest injury concern and may not make the AB end of year tour according to the NZ Herald article below. I guess this does enhance the chances of the likes of Fruean or Toeava making the tour.

Rugby: Ranger in doubt for tour
11:06 AM Monday Sep 27, 2010

Rene Ranger suffered a hamstring injury in Northland's loss to Counties Manukau on Sunday. Photo / Getty Images
Northland star Rene Ranger's chances of making the All Blacks' end-of-year tour are up in the air after he suffered a hamstring injury in Northland's national provincial championship rugby 24-40 loss to Counties Manukau in Pukekohe yesterday.

Northland coach Bryce Woodward confirmed Ranger had a ``serious'' hamstring injury but more would be known after the explosive outside back has a medical examination later today.

If the hamstring is seriously torn he could be facing up to six weeks on the sidelines, which would leave the utility back in doubt for the tour. The All Blacks' touring party will be named on October 17.

But All Blacks five-eighth Luke McAlister has been cleared of any serious injury after he was forced to leave the field with an injured jaw early in the second half of North Harbour's 44-30 win against Manawatu in Albany yesterday.

It was feared McAlister's jaw had been broken but it was only bruised, North Harbour confirmed today, meaning he was expected to play a full part in training this week and be available for the match against Counties in Pukekohe on Sunday.

- NZPA

 

[Larksea]

Larksea, Have you got a link to the Robbie Fruen interview? I seriously hope he makes the AB's... He's in my top 3 players...

ok I had no idea where I had seen it but I managed to find it what you need to do is:

go to: http://nz.sports.yahoo.com/rugby/
it has a link to a video in the middle, click on that and it will open a new window and play the video...
in the lower part of the video window you can "browse videos" scroll down and look for "Kahui Sholdered out" (was three clicks down for me)
Watch that video, it has an interview with Fruen

 

[FlukeArtist]

@ Larksea

You are kidding re Donald right?
Sorry mate- the guy has had long enough to establish himself at International level and he simply has not managed to do that. He cannot possibly go on tour.

Also, George Whitelock is good, but Braid is far, far better- the Southland game a good example of his workrate.
I have never rated Liam Messam. Good sevens player, thats about it. Over-rated in my book

I have no idea how Aled de Malmanche ever got near an AB team, the guy is invisible on the field, and Elliott only had one decent season of rugby, which is now 2 seasons behind him.
I agree Rutledge has to get a look in, but ONLY if Hore is not available.

Are you a Waikato supporter per chance?

 

[ranger]

@ Larksea

You are kidding re Donald right?
Sorry mate- the guy has had long enough to establish himself at International level and he simply has not managed to do that. He cannot possibly go on tour.

Also, George Whitelock is good, but Braid is far, far better- the Southland game a good example of his workrate.
I have never rated Liam Messam. Good sevens player, thats about it. Over-rated in my book

I have no idea how Aled de Malmanche ever got near an AB team, the guy is invisible on the field, and Elliott only had one decent season of rugby, which is now 2 seasons behind him.
I agree Rutledge has to get a look in, but ONLY if Hore is not available.

Are you a Waikato supporter per chance?

De Malmance invisible? thats ridiculous. I dont think he should be near the ABs but thats only because his lineout throwing is horrible, he is second only to Mealamu for the work he does around the field in my opinion. Hes the best ball running hooker we have, Elliot is good in space but De Malmance is just so strong that he creates holes where there arent any. The momentum he gave the Cheifs with his running was a massive factor in the Cheifs finals run in 09. He is also a rabid worker at rucktime and a destructive tackler, his work around the field is awesome, if Owen Franks could throw into the Lineout accurately then id have ADM as the reserve hooker.
Its seems like its a bit late for Rutledge, he obviously isn't in the coaches thinking and there is nothing more he can really do to change that. If he was anywhere near selection you would have thought that he would have at least been given a spot on the NZ barbarians team that played the Maori?

 

[smartcooky]

Boys not lying if Rutledge does not go as a hooker reserve for the squad then I question what the All Blacks coaching staff are looking at. Bloke is in form and he looks good.

I don't think its a question of what they are looking at.

Rutledge would only go as a third hooker because 1 & 2 are Hore and Mealamu. If Afoa is going as a prop, then he will double as the third hooker (Ted has already indicated that).

Certainly, I believe Rutledge is well ahead of Cory Flynn.

De Malmance invisible? thats ridiculous. I dont think he should be near the ABs but thats only because his lineout throwing is horrible, he is second only to Mealamu for the work he does around the field in my opinion. Hes the best ball running hooker we have, Elliot is good in space but De Malmance is just so strong that he creates holes where there arent any. The momentum he gave the Cheifs with his running was a massive factor in the Cheifs finals run in 09. He is also a rabid worker at rucktime and a destructive tackler, his work around the field is awesome, if Owen Franks could throw into the Lineout accurately then id have ADM as the reserve hooker.

He's also a very strong scrummager, especially on opposition throw in

 

[nickdnz]

de Melmanche will be one of the biggest disapointments if he can't get his throwing streight. He's one of the strongest players in New Zealand, he has a great work rate, great ball runner in terms of drives and a very solid scrummager (can cover prop). If we chose a third hooker option I would choose de Melmanche. I do however agree he needs to sort out his line out throwing, which is a skill you'd think shouldn't have taken as long as it so far, to sort out.

 

[Darwin]

Apparently Tony Woodcock is a good lineout thrower. A few years ago he was taken to South Africa as the third lineout throwing option - Afoa was the third hooking option, but Woodcock would throw into the lineouts if Afoa moved to hooker (http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/562423). It would have been good if he had worked on his throwing (I'm assuming he hasn't done much work, as I haven't heard the AB selectors talk about it since), as he could have covered for de Malmanche....

 

[ranger]

Apparently Tony Woodcock is a good lineout thrower. A few years ago he was taken to South Africa as the third lineout throwing option - Afoa was the third hooking option, but Woodcock would throw into the lineouts if Afoa moved to hooker (http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/562423). It would have been good if he had worked on his throwing (I'm assuming he hasn't done much work, as I haven't heard the AB selectors talk about it since), as he could have covered for de Malmanche....

Ive always thought it odd that teams haven't looked into options like this more often. Why not test out all 8 forwards to see who is the best natural thrower, then train them up and use them as a fall back option if the hooker is having an off day (Much like how teams have a raft of goalkicking options nowdays.) Or even use them as the number one thrower if they are good enough.
Look at Liam Messam for instance, he isn't much of an asset at lineout time currently and has to rely solely on his running game and loose play defense to earn selection. He used to be a handy basketball player so you can assume that he would be able to hit a target, If he trained up his lineout throwing then his stocks as a player would rise dramatically. It would free us up for the selection of a dynamic hooker like Afoa or DeMalmance to give us the advantage around the field. Hell you could even experiment with playing a second tighthead prop at hooker to really hammer home an advantage in the tight, imagine that.

 

[squirrel]

reckon demalmance wishes he had taken up his welsh offer now

 

[Ninja]

Cheers Larksea for the link... I must've missed the TV1 sports new that night

Anyway, I agree Rutledge is the form Hooker now, He's miles ahead of Flynn atm.

I'm a Canterbury guy and I don't rate George Whitelock at all!!! He makes tackles but that's about it... He gives away too many penalties and he knocks it on quite often...

Donald has had his many many chances, and yeah, he can't cut it at international level. He's done and dusted...

 

[Sam Owen]

Rutledge is playing well but so is Hika Elliot. I wonder if they both could go.

 

[squirrel]

hika reminds me of schalk britz as a type of running hooker

 

[osmond]

Well Im a Wellington man and I rate George Whitelock. He only knocked the ball on once or twice in this years ITM cup, and it was because he wasnt expecting the ball to be fair on the guy. He doesnt receive any more yellow cards or penalties than guys like Richie McCaw so I dont know why people say that. He is the answer to our backup openside.

And forget Aled de Malmanche and Rutledge. Dane Coles needs to be given a chance in the All Blacks, some may say thats crazy but he just keeps getting better and better. He is athletic, has a high workrate, runs like a back and throws the ball into lineouts just as good as any other hooker in NZ. Dont think he will appear until after the RWC though.

 

[veux]

Ive always thought it odd that teams haven't looked into options like this more often. Why not test out all 8 forwards to see who is the best natural thrower, then train them up and use them as a fall back option if the hooker is having an off day (Much like how teams have a raft of goalkicking options nowdays.) Or even use them as the number one thrower if they are good enough.
Look at Liam Messam for instance, he isn't much of an asset at lineout time currently and has to rely solely on his running game and loose play defense to earn selection. He used to be a handy basketball player so you can assume that he would be able to hit a target, If he trained up his lineout throwing then his stocks as a player would rise dramatically. It would free us up for the selection of a dynamic hooker like Afoa or DeMalmance to give us the advantage around the field. Hell you could even experiment with playing a second tighthead prop at hooker to really hammer home an advantage in the tight, imagine that.

I agree - when I played U16s + U17s we had our 8 throw in (who was an American Football thrower) - needless to say we didn't have to worry about our hookers poor throwing and we never lost our own lineout ball.

 

[Darwin]

Well Im a Wellington man and I rate George Whitelock. He only knocked the ball on once or twice in this years ITM cup, and it was because he wasnt expecting the ball to be fair on the guy. He doesnt receive any more yellow cards or penalties than guys like Richie McCaw so I dont know why people say that. He is the answer to our backup openside.

And forget Aled de Malmanche and Rutledge. Dane Coles needs to be given a chance in the All Blacks, some may say thats crazy but he just keeps getting better and better. He is athletic, has a high workrate, runs like a back and throws the ball into lineouts just as good as any other hooker in NZ. Dont think he will appear until after the RWC though.

Not only does Coles run the ball like a back, he actually thinks he's a back - he spends about as much time in the backline as Isaac Ross! Kevin Mealamu had a similar issue early in his career, though to be fair I think Coles is starting to play a bit tighter this year. Once he realises he has a 2 rather than a 12 written on his back he will become a much better rugby player!